MS/PR-70, Few, if any really exist!

Aethelred

I know, I know, this is going to make some people mad, but I'm old fashioned and believe that the grade of 70 is theroretical and does not exist in practice (except perhaps in VERY rare cases)! For a coin to grade 70 it must be perfect, even under at least 5x magnification per PCGS standards, the means free of any marks, spots, fully struck et cetera. I have had the opportunity to look at a number of PCGS and NGC coins graded 70 (most if not all were proofs) and I have considered none of them perfect! To me grading a coin 70 is saying "this coin could not be any more perfect than it is, there is no room for improvement" such a coin just does not exist in my opinion, and is not possible given current minting technology. I am troubled by the lowering of standards on the part of the major grading services, it seems that more and more 70s are being handed out each year. I believe that this is little more than a cynical marketing ploy to keep submissions coming in. In the 1980s when PCGS nad NGC had stricter standards, 70s were almost never handed out and when they were it made news. Now I wonder if a day goes by that either of the major services don't assign a 70? I fear that the current 70 mania is much like the tulip craze of 18th century Holland and a lot of collectors are going to be out a lot of money when the hobby comes back to reality.

CAVEAT EMPTOR!

keithdagen

There is a strong difference between PR-70's and MS-70's.

I have seen very few true PR-70's, while I have seen dozens of true MS-70's. Have three of the latter sitting on my desk, fresh back from NGC. At one time, the services were very liberal in handing out the 70 to proofs, and there are still a lot of 70's on the market that are not deserving of the grade.

Aethelred

Keith, would you agree that there are more that do not deserve the grade than do deserve it?

ksteelheader

My thinking is that if there is a grade of 70, then there has to be something to fit in that slot..............Ken

Wondo

There is no perfect coin. The grade of 70 does not represent perfection, I argue, it represents the highest attainable condition. Perfection in anything does not exist (except for my marriage, darling).

mdwoods

would you agree that there are more that do not deserve the grade than do deserve it?

I would agree with that comment. I would also say that I think there are some MS69s that are 70s, but were not checked closely enough. Think about it. If you send in 1000 proof Dcam state quarters, do you really think any grading company has the time to check for the minute differences between a 69 and 70? Of course, most 69s are properly graded, but many on the boards have had 69s upgraded to 70s when submitted for regrade. I think they are a lot fussier for regrades than straight grading. JMO.

keithdagen

Keith, would you agree that there are more that do not deserve the grade than do deserve it?

On the PR side, yes, absolutely. MS, no.

Like Mark said though, there was a point in time when PCGS cracked down and refused to grade a PR-70, so there are so ultra-nice 69's floating around that have been graded in the last couple of years.

Russ

<< <i>I have had the opportunity to look at a number of PCGS and NGC coins graded 70 (most if not all were proofs) and I have considered none of them perfect! >>



Ditto on the proofs. On the MS side of things, I have seen some that were true 70s. It is also easier - at a glance with no loop - to see the difference between a 69 and 70 when comparing MS coins than it is when comparing proof coins. A very PQ 69DCAM looks like a 70 all day until you get real close.

Russ, NCNE