Buffalo Nickel - Machine Doubling or what?

FC57Coins

I recently ran into this 1934D Buffalo nickel - sorry about the big pic for those of you who dial up - but it's the only way I could get the image clear enough to discuss. If you'll note the area by the forehead and the scalp, you can see clearly that there's doubling. The doubling follow's the contour of the indian's profile all the way down to the neck - you can see the doubling there too, although you can't see the face doubling on here. Furthermore, the date, though not clearly visible on this picture, is also doubled - most notably on the 93 and 4 in the same Northeast direction. HOWEVER - the Liberty, shows no sign of doubling whatsoever. So the question is this - This coin is not in the Cherry Pickers guide, no note is made of doubling for this date anywhere - so the assumption is - aha! machine doubling. But if so, how is it that not all of the features are doubled, and secondly, if business strikes get only one blow of the die, where does the doubling come from?

Thanks!
Frank



I just noticed that the hairknot also shows doubling.

smprfi

I have a 1936 with the same signs just in different areas.I sent it to anacs and they said it was just a badly worn die that did this.No attribution.

jonesy

Frank, Since I'm here at work, hard at work, I don't have my Wexler with me. I don't remember ever seeing anything on 1934D buffalo's. I have a SBA with the same double face pattern.
Glenn

FC57Coins

Steve:

I've seen worn die doubling, particularly in some Morgans, and that kind of doubling looks blurred, almost as if the edges of the devices have worn and can no longer "hold" the metal flowing into them. I can understand that. However, the doubling on this particular coin is crisp and defined, so I can't see that being the same - at least I don't understand the process.

Frank

shylock

Frank - check out the strike doubling on this MS66 1934-D. Most of the profile shows it right down to the neck, and the feather is even more pronounced.

jonesy

WOW!! That must be Frank's coin's Bigger Brother!! They look just alike. Except Frank's wasn't rescued from circulation!
Glenn

FC57Coins

There ya go - must be machine doubling since no notation is made of it - great pic - thanks Shylock!

DAM

Frank,

The underlying image of Machine or Strike Doubling has a "flat, shelf like" appearance to it. True doubled dies have rounded underlying images. Sometimes it can be hard to distinguish.

Try this:

1.Take a deck of cards and move the top ten or so cards slightly to the left. The "shelf" or underlying cards are representative of Strike Doubling.

2. Put your hands together, with fingers outstretched, and turn them so they're laying flat. Move the top hand slightly to the left, or right (which ever's easiest). The "rounded" edges of the underlying hand represent the doubling look of a doubled die.

Hope that helps.

intocoins

<< <i> But if so, how is it that not all of the features are doubled, and secondly, if business strikes get only one blow of the die, where does the doubling come from? >>



This is definitely machine doubling. I've seen this on hundreds of Buffalo's. Most that I've seen have it on the profile and the date. The doubling comes from loose parts in the coining process.

Page 369 of Cherrypickers" The looseness allows the dies to shift slightly during the actual striking of the coin.

jonesy

Frank, David Lange's book does mention "Two minor reverse DD varieties". No obverse DD's. Must be machine doubling. You ought to see the SBA Iv'e got. She's got a double face.
Glenn