Submission Results...Please Shoot Me

bumpy

Well, I read on some dealer's ebay page that there is no Santa in the coin business. I am now a believer. As a new collectors club member I submitted my first ever coins for grading: received by PCGS on 3-24, grades were available yesterday.

1851 $2.5 Gold (repunched date)---AU 50 Actually not bad, I thought, I cracked it out of a PCI holder (EF45) just to fill up the fourth space on the submission form

1862 $2.5 Gold--AU 53 Not good considering it was sold to me as uncirculated by an ebay seller with no negative feedback and high positive #.

1853-D $5 Gold--AU 55 Again, not good as I cracked it out of a SEGS holder with MS-60 printed on it. This was actually the coin I had the most hope for since it appeared to be practically mark-free but with a slight luster problem. Comparing it to some generic gold I have in PCGS and NGC MS-62 holders, I really thought this could go 62 or 63 which would have been the ca-ching! I was kinda hoping for.

1799 $10 Gold--[drumroll, please] no grade for cleaning. This is another MAJOR disappointment as it was purchased from an ebay seller with STELLAR feedback as AU-58. Again, to me, this coin looked no worse than the slabbed 62's I have. Which tells me I better take a grading class.


Lessons learned? 1) If it sounds too good to be true...
2) Coin speculating hurts
(if you don't know what you're doing)

Any input from you guys concerning thoughts on resubmission or something else to do with these coins would be most appreciated

Outhaul

Well, you did alright on the 1851

On the 1862, I wouldn't be too hard on the eBay seller right off the bat. Gold can be very difficult to grade if you deal/collect primarily silver or moderns. A WHOLE different standard exists for gold. It's not unusual to find AU's, even in a dealer's case, marked as UNC's.

1853-D...SEGS...nuff said there, I've seen a lot of overgraded gold in SEGS holders.

1799...Sometimes cleaning is tough to detect on any coin, let alone gold. PCGS obviously saw something you didn't. You could crack it out and resubmit.

Lesson #1: NEVER buy raw coins on eBay (my opinion)
Lesson #2: Leave the speculating for the investors and just collect what makes you happy
Lesson #3: Buy a grading book, it is money well spent

Cheers,

Bob

dorkkarl

the real lesson: learn to grade for yourself

K S

ksteelheader

Outhaul just gave you some outstanding advice. Pay attention to it..............Ken

crito

Crack them out and send them to NGC. When they come back with completely different grades, you'll know PCGS is jerking you around.

BigD5

Don't be hard on yourself. The fact that the pci and segs coins actually slabbed, and weren't bagged, is a positive. Those results aren't as bad as you might think.

darktone

An expensive lesson but dorkkarl is right you must learn to grade for yourself. There is a big difference between an AU53 and an uncirculated coin can you post pictures so we can tell you what went wrong? mike

beartracks42

Your experience is not new....I bought two MS63 Indians, a $2.5 and a $5.00 when I first started buying on ebay. Both coins were in ACG slabs When I cracked them out and sent them to PCGS, they both came back AU55. Sound familiar?? I did not lose money on them, so the lesson was cheap...this time.

Gilbert

There is a big difference between an AU53 and an uncirculated coin can you post pictures so we can tell you what went wrong?

A "big difference," huh? Maybe between a 53 and a 65, but not a big difference between 60 - 63. Well, there can be a big difference in appeal, but I wouldn't necessarily call a minor break in luster (which theoritcally could be the diff between say a less than choice UNC and a less than choice AU.

NumisEd

Bumpy, you did okay.......could have been worse. I am willing to guess that your PCI coin was in the old PCI holder. They use to be conservative.....many, many moons ago. The 1799 $10 is too bad. The ebay seller probably called it AU-58 because it has unc. details, but was cleaned. Still, he should have mentioned it to you.

Perhaps you have some hope: ask for a refund from the ebay seller. If he/she wants to keep customers happy, he will take the coin back. I doubt it.

Regarding resubmissions, I think that's exactly what they would like for you to do. Maybe that's why they are so conservative....to promote the game of resubmissions. I would not do it.

nucklehead

Regarding resubmissions, I think that's exactly what they would like for you to do. Maybe that's why they are so conservative....to promote the game of resubmissions. I would not do it. >>

After reading this and other boards for almost three years,yes that IS their game.It's really sad to see board members here get hosed as often as they do.

K6AZ

You really should count your blessings. I am surprised that everything is genuine, if the 1799 Eagle was counterfeit, they would have NG'ed it as not genuine.

Please pay careful attention to this: There are numerous very well done struck counterfeit gold pieces floating around. These are being struck in the middle east. A lot of people have been burned on eBay buying them. Forget what the anti-slabbers tell you with their propaganda, only buy US gold coins in PCGS, NGC or ANACS holders. If you keep buying raw gold on eBay, you will eventually be burned big time.

MrEureka

Crack them out and send them to NGC. When they come back with completely different grades, you'll know PCGS is jerking you around.

And when they come back from NGC, then send them to ANACS and when they come back with completely different grades, you'll know NGC is also jerking you around. And then send them to ICG, ....

When you've had enough, send me the coins. I'll just keep them and help save you additional grading fees and angst.

Russ

<< <i>1799...Sometimes cleaning is tough to detect on any coin, let alone gold. PCGS obviously saw something you didn't. >>



Or, they could have seen something that isn't even there. See my post on the submission results I just got.

Russ, NCNE

topstuf

Why's the fiver a 60? All those marks are from die clash. Clouds, eagle wings, etc. There's an unstruck area on the top lock of hair that is so shiny it's P/L and the color is lousy in scan but Maple Leaf yellow in person.

A .....few....contact marks.......but why not 58 or 61? Must be the answer. "Why not 58 or 61? Let's call it a 60."

This ain't a SCIENCE.

eagle7

Hairlines, hairlines, hairlines! PCGS hates hairlines. Get a pinpoint tensor lamp and at least a 5x loupe and look for the hairlines. Most gold coins if not all, which are in other peoples holders and which are graded between 60 and 63 are loaded with hairlines. These hairlines do not disrupt the luster very much on a gold coin so people tend to agree with the grade if they dont look for the hairlines. Ive seen PCGS send back gold coins in body bags with normal cabinet friction. Send the bodybag coin to NGC or ANACS.

jonesy

I agree with Mr Eureka!! NGC indeed!!
Glenn

braddick

Your 1799 is actually a good score off of eBay. As mentioned, not having it returned as counterfeit is good but the fact the light cleaning was missed by the Seller and you (not PCGS) isn't bad. It must not be offensive. No tooling, no repairs, no rim filing... all plagues of this series and all faults your coin doesn't share.
That alone should be a sweet consolation.

jonesy

Send the 1799 to ANACS for grading.
Glenn

wallstreetman

Chock one up for PCI!

billiardmaster

Good advice? Don't buy coins off ebay. Don't get involved in the crack out game. Find an honest dealer and be loyal to them.
If you can't find an honest dealer in your area, ask me for a name. If you like the coins you have, keep them, if not myself or
any other dealer would be glad to buy them.
Rusty

Merc

You are very fortunate they were all real. Still, I am surprised by your buying habits. I have never seen an 1799 Uncirculated Eagle. The red book has it listed at $10,000! It is $9,200 in the greysheet. Be careful when buying very very expensive raw coins on Ebay. You need to be an expert at grading and authenticating gold when buying these coins. Then again, it is your money and I can't tell you what to do.

darktone

<< <i>A "big difference," huh? Maybe between a 53 and a 65, but not a big difference between 60 - 63. Well, there can be a big difference in appeal, but I wouldn't necessarily call a minor break in luster (which theoritcally could be the diff between say a less than choice UNC and a less than choice AU. >>

Hi Gilbert, I strongly disagree if you can't easily tell the difference between an AU53 gold coin and UNC. coin you should look at more gold in these grades- and I mean this with no disrespect. mike

bumpy

Just wanted to thank all those who responded with their comments and advice. As usual, I learned more in a few minutes of reading here than in months of stumbling around by myself. Maybe when I get the coins back, I can work up some images and get some opinions on what I missed in the 'look'. Thanks again to all.