Need Grading tips on Buffalo's

izzy452

I know about the full horn and the split tail details, any other on the reverse? What about the obverse ?

Any help would be appreciated.

Thanks

Walt

dorkkarl

best grading tip i can give you: don't trust the grade on the slab

this is the series where i got burned the worst

K S

Petescorner

On the Obverse, the separation of "LIBERTY" from the rim is usually required for the coin to be graded "fine" or better.

jonesy

If you're serious about collecting and grading buffalo nickels, you need to do research. Get a copy of "The complete guide to Buffalo Nickels" by David Lange. This book has about everything you need to know about buffalo nickels. It gives you an idea to grading, rarity, and populations. I spend a lot of time looking at buffs being offered at Heritage and Bowers & Merena. Most of these coins have been graded by PCGS, NGC, or ANACS. They are high resolution pictures and will give you a good idea what to look for. And remember, never try to grade raw coins you're going buy by scans.Especially on Ebay.
Glenn

jonesy

K S, How did you get burned on buffs by slab?
Glenn

dorkkarl

to summarize a long boring story, 10 years ago, i had a buff collection, most coins had been pcgs-slabed. being much stupider & more naive than i am now, i'd crack 'em out just so i could keep them in my album. time came to sell (i'd lost interest, moved into bust coins), i had anacs slab 'em, & four of the BIG KEYS that had been pcgs vf-## coins came back from anacs as FINE-##. the biggest loser was the 1926-s in PCGS VF-35 that anacs graded F-12. i lost well over $1000 on the set, & that was the turning point in my coin-collecting career. anacs also net-graded 1 down to fine due to corrosion (pcgs had not bb'd it)

yeah yeah yeah, i know all the arguments about weak strikes, etc, & i know this always opens up a can of worms, but i'm a-gonna say it anyways:

VF REQUIRES A FULL-HORN

there, i've said it, now you can slam me

K S

btw, most of the pcgs slabs i had were the "older, more consevative" rattlers

Libertad

The relative thickness of the rim on the obverse is often helpful in determining the degree of wear. After a while, you'll get a feel for the thin rim vs. thick rim of a more worn coin.

Some of the years from San Francisco show a distinct slope toward the center of the coin from the basining of the die that was done, and SF coins seem to have more pronounced basining which sets Liberty at an additional angle to the plane. The rim thickness is a helpful gauge on these issues.

jdimmick

I have to agree with dorkkarl on this one. My collection is 100% PCGS graded, and I rarely ever by other services stuff, but one area I think PCGS still needs some improvements in consistency in, is Buffalo nickels. There are some really nice PCGS buffs out there, but you have to be cautious and do your homework. I have seen a lot of overgraded buffs in PCGS vf and Xf holders and also coins that I felt should have been ""BB"" for surfaces problems, extremely dark planchets, and light pitting or corrosion.

Also, in looking at a few mintstate better date buffs, I have questioned the grading on some ms-62, and 63's which looked to be really au-58's to me?

jim dimmick

jom

<< <i>Also, in looking at a few mintstate better date buffs, I have questioned the grading on some ms-62, and 63's which looked to be really au-58's to me? >>



I've said this many times...for a Buff that is relatively easy to tell actually. In MOST cases look at the Buffs hind leg and see if you can notice a "plateau". That's a dead giveaway for an AU coin. It's actually a simple thing because the Buff wears in a different place from where the coin is weakly stuck...fortunately!

jom

jonesy

K S, thanks for sharing. I'm sure every collector has made mistakes with their coins. If they say they haven't, they are lying. I have sold coins I wish I had not, I've purchased coins I wish I had not. Experience is expensive!!
Glenn

au58

A minor but significant addition to Dorkkarl's rule that states "VF REQUIRES A FULL-HORN".
For a dealer to pay VF money, Dorkkarl's rule is valid, it must have a full horn.
The corollary, however, is not true. For a dealer to charge VF money, it merely needs to say VF on the slab. Sooner or later, a collector will pay VF money for it.
Then, when the collector tries to sell it, Dorkkarl's rule prevails.

DoctorOfTone

What about the horns that look like they have had some help? I never hear about the re-engraving if indeed that is what's going on. I see Buffalos in great conditon with only a partial horn and then I see the opposite where the coin overall shows substantial wear but has a full horn that looks like it has been re-engraved. Can any members shed any light on this?

DOC

jonesy

That's from reverse dies being used beyond expiration. It wasn't uncommon during the depression for the Denver and San Francisco mints to use previous years reverse dies until they failed. This caused the appearance of the buffalo to appear mushy. They still had a full but weak horn.
Glenn