Friday Evening Post: Do we really need strike designators??

keets

Back in the sixties and seventies when I was active in the hobby, coin grading was much less technical than what it is today. Of course there was G, VG and so on up to and through UNC where things really got nutty and the adjectives began to fly. The only thing I recall specific to any strike designation were Full Steps on nickels, thanks to a bunch of fanatics who focused on the Jefferson series. But that was it. A collector knew what the high wear points were and where weak strike would show and looked for those things.

Fast forward to the late nineties!!! While I got wrapped up in life's little journey and was detached from collecting for about 15 years, the hobby seems to have gotten wrapped up in itself. Now we have various designators for strike which all seem to relate to some type of a sub-grade on the particular coin they're attached to. The latest, of course, will be Full Torch on the Roosevelt.

Do we really need a designation to tell us a coin is fully struck? Why not just assign a grade according to overall strike and leave it at that?? The price difference associated with the designation on some series is significant and yet some coins are graded higher without the designation which puzzles me sometimes. I see Full Head SLQ's with weak strike in the area of the date, Full Bell Line Franklin's with weak strike in the bell lettering, Fully Split Band Merc's with soft hair detail and Full Step Jefferson's with weak overall detail in the rest of the building. It would seem the premium for some of these coins should only be paid for a fully struck specimen overall, with the designator sometimes being a misnomer.

One last point that I can't resist----has anyone else seen an Accugrade Washington Quarter with the F.ull E.agles B.reast designation? The first one I saw was an eBay auction where the seller described it as "full eagles beak" which was good for a belly-laugh!!!

Al H.

NumisEd

No.

AbesNeighbor

Keets,

You are right -on...This stuff is difficult enough without mor strike designators. I guess the Registry set and dealers like them because they tend to "Create" Markets.

goose3

<< <i>Keets,

You are right -on...This stuff is difficult enough without mor strike designators. I guess the Registry set and dealers like them because they tend to "Create" Markets. >>




Don't forget that someone else like these because they tend to generate more $$$
personally I don't need someone to tell me something so silly.

It kinda puts ACG's designations in a different light.

Fairlaneman

Al only if the rest of the coin is fully struck. Its a real turn off to see a Merc with the FB designation with weak detail else where. Basically I am talking about the dates that are known to have good strikes. Some of the dates are just plain lousy strike wise which is normally seen. All 1925 dimes fall into the lousy catagory.

Ken

LucyBop

More designations for me!

Liberty

I think its a great idea...the more the better.

I just wish they'd hurry up and introduce the FR designation (Fully Round) so I know if my coins are truly circular or not.

Liberty

MadMonk

If I'm buying them, already designated...NO
If I'm cherry picking from raw inventory or mint sets....HECK YEA!!

truthteller

I agree with Keets(scarey). Most, if not all, of the extra designations, are pure marketing. Same with the 11 point Uncirculated scale. The only designation that gives credance
to more value is PL and DMPL on dollars, which has been around quite a bit longer than the services.

TRUTH

jeffnpcb

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$
Does that ring a bell!

I will admit that if more people spent more time looking at mint numbers and then pop reports, it would change the thought process a great deal! Certain sets I've been working on do not require a slab and grade, just a decent strike for my Dansco's If you go through mint rolls of Mercs and Roosevelts and a few others[Franlins in mint or proof} , there are a very few that meet the high expectcies of graders. The more the detail has turned into more the money!
Who gets the bill? The true collector who wants a nice set without the PLASTIC!! {within the Plastic has come the events of the last few weeks!!!}

FrattLaw

It's all about the Franklins...... and I'm not talking the FBL ones, I'm talking about the $100 ones. How can a industry keep regrading a limited number of coins ...... strike designators and (not to be anti-PCGS) star designation reviews.

Why PCGS chose to do this now, being 30 days behind economy submissions is beyond me. Do they really need another large influx of coins sitting around there collecting dust. Maybe it IS all about the float.

Michael

LucyBop

<< <i>It's all about the Franklins...... and I'm not talking the FBL ones, >>



Okay.... I'll calm down now......

braddick

How about just a FS (Full Strike) designator? Like others have mentioned, what is highlighted now (FBL; FSB; FH; FS) are only a part of the coin. What about the rest of it (ie: full rivets on the Standing Liberty)?

flaminio

<< <i>How about just a FS (Full Strike) designator? Like others have mentioned, what is highlighted now (FBL; FSB; FH; FS) are only a part of the coin. What about the rest of it (ie: full rivets on the Standing Liberty)? >>



A generic FS (Full Strike) attribute would be my preference. Do away with all the confusing array of acronyms. Simpler, more accurate, and extensible to all coins.

kranky

Good points already made. I think at the beginning of the Full [whatever] designations, they were probably intended to indicate a full strike, yet as we all know that's not necessarily so. A generic Full Strike designation would be useful, I think, but it's too late for that.

I don't really mind the designations in use today because as far as I can tell they are only using the ones that were already established in the collecting community (unlike ACG's Full Eagle's Breast!) If a group of collectors desires to have coins with Full [whatever] designated as such, it's fine with me if a slabbing outfit chooses to serve that market. To me that's no different than ANACS putting variety designations on the slabs.

tjkillian

To me, strike is the most important attribute for an uncirculated coin. Give me a R/B indian cent that is FULLY struck over a pathetic strike red one any day. That being said, FBL, FB, FT, etc are just a notation denoting a full strike. Is is perfect? No, but until they grade strike on its own numbering system, it is all we got.

Tom

keets

here are future considerations. please add any as you feel.

FHS on Morgan dollars to indicate the "full hair strands" over the ear.

FF on Walkers to indicate "full finger" detail on the flower stems.

FEC on Washington quarters to indicate "full eagle claws" on the reverse.



al h.

AbesNeighbor

I just Agreed with TRUTH!................... :-)

quarterjack

Al, i think the walkers would be FSK, full split knuckle. At least thats how i often hear it described.
How about FCW, Full Coin Weight?

Dave

clackamas

There has been a time, IMO, where grading was probably a little looser than it is now. According to published standards, an MS 67 whatever should not have anything other than FSB, FH, or full whatever since the coin must be "fully struck". However there are such graded coins in existance and its the norm. With regards to the FT designation, I have read in the posts that a good portion of the existing MS67's and even the 68 Rossies don't have full torch bands. My question is this - How did they get an MS67 or 68 without a FULLY struck coin wich includes the bands? In light of how the grading standards have worked out in practice, a coin that stands out needs to be recognized and I fully embrace it.

Are 2 Roosies each with the same MS67 grade but 1 has fully struck bands equal? The invention of the slab was to facilitate the trading of coins and the more differentiation you get within a stated grade the better. I and many others have argued that the full grading scale is not used to its potential, there has also been talk about using decimals. The more I know of a coin, when buying on Ebay the better IMO.

jom

If is does not JUST designate Full Strike then my answer would be a resounding NO!

jom

KlectorKid

SBA: FU - Full Uglyness. If not fully struck you do not get the chilling sensation and your heart doesnt beat quite as fast.