I saw a counterfeit Indian cent yesterday

clw54

It was in a coin shop. The owner had a fake 1876 he'd bought from somebody and didn't know it was fake until he sent it into PCGS. I think he said it was done with spark erosion, but am not sure. Several letters from liberty were flat, and the surface didn't look quite right. It was just too smooth and had a plastic look to it. It was a good education to see what one looked like. Just another reason to be careful with raw coins. There's a lot of stuff like that out there.

Lakesammman

Do you recall if it had a shallow N on the reverse?? How much was it??

clw54

It wasn't for sale, which is a good thing I believe. I did look at some other presumably real low grade Indians and several did have that N like an 1877. I even bought a good 1869 with the shallow N. Since my eye was tuned into shallow Ns, there probably wasn't one on the fake or I would have noticed it.

mbbiker

Please forgive my stupidity but what is a "shallow N"?

clw54

Look at the N in ONE on an 1877. There's probably a few on eBay right now. It's weak near the bottom.

mbbiker

Is a shallow N good or bad? my guess would be bad because it means a weak strike?

Lakesammman

It was a redesign around 1870. Prior to 1870, the N was shallow as shown. In 1870, both were used. It's rare to see the shallow N in 1871 and 1872. The 1877 should have the shallow N, for some reason. The vast majority of post 1870 coins otherwise used the strong N. If you see the shallow N used in 1876, for instance, odds are it's a counterfeit. I have one...that's why I was wondering about the counterfeit 1876...wondering if it was the same dies.

Also, note the different shapes of the serifs. That's a useful secondary characteristic if the N is damaged, worn, filled with oil, etc.