1949 Lincoln NTC vs. PCGS Grading Challenge

Coppernicus

Ok fellow board members, here's what I'm thinking. I have been looking for a PCGS MS66 1949 Lincoln for over a year now (for my #23 ranked registry set) and haven't seen one offered on ebay. So, over the last few months, I have purchased (on ebay) three MS66 1949 Lincolns in NTC holders thinking that I could crack one of them and submit to PCGS. I have also bought 2 more from local dealers. So, now I am sitting on five of these and, IMHO, NONE (repeat NONE) of these would get a 66 from PCGS.

I am thinking about e-mailing NTC with my findings and challenging them to "back" their grading. I probably will not get a reasonable response but I am more interested in what you all think of my tactics. Is this a reasonable avenue to persue to try and establish a better certification process?

We all are aware of the "fudge factor" in grading, but really! If one service certifies a handfulf coins in a particular grade, is it unreasonable to expect that the grades are at least "in the ballpark?"

I would appreciate your thoughts and/or your similar experiences.

Coppernicus

MastaHanky

I doubt you'll get much out of it. Unless NTC specifically states that they use PCGS's grading standards, the coins are likely graded fairly.

Coppernicus

Mastahanky - Actually, I'm not trying to get anything out of it, except perhaps a feeling that I've "stirred up the waters" at NTC. I'm not a professional grader by any means, but at least with the wheats, I feel that I can tell the difference between a 64 and a 66.

Coppernicus

bartdog

Coppernicus -

I understand your frustration as to inconsistency between grading services, but would you do this same thing to NGC? I have not had a lot of luck crossing NGC to PCGS, but I do not feel that NGC has problems correctly/consistently grading coins.

I'm would assume that NTC grades relatively consistently according to "their" standard, which may or may not (NOT) be on a par with PCGS/NGC so they WILL most likely "back" their grading and tell you that they assigned the correct grade to these coins.

Just my two cents.....

Bill

RELLA

Coppernicus,

If you could care less about quality, I have the 1949 for you...it also wouldn't get a 66 from PCGS but it does have the advantage of already being in a PCGS MS66RD holder.

RELLA

MacCoin

Coppernicus
it has been I exterience that if you make waves you'll get wet.
MacCoin

Coppernicus

Rella - Great comeback! I really do care about quality so no, I do not want a PCGS holder, MS66 grade, with a 65 in it. I'll keep searching! (but thanks for the offer)

Coppernicus

sinin1

Coppernicus - you should take him up on that offer - a lot better chance of getting a PCGS 66 when starting with one holdered that way from PCGS than complaining to NTC (or SEGS or ACG or the others).

At least PCGS has a guarantee to buy or replace - maybe they would get a good one (or find out that what you really want is a MS67 in a MS66 holder).

clackamas

49 is a tough year. I made 1 66 in 2 attempts. The other is a 65. Try buying some raw ones for "Eagle.eye.eddie" on Ebay. I got mine from him for $15 and it went 66RD. I see the Rella and flog31 bought a 49 from him.

Pushkin

Coppernicus,

You might want to do a board search and check out the many threads that refer to Numis Trash Corp. Life may just be too short and too precious to waste any time expecting anything from them. I wouldn't waste my time or money on ANYTHING assocaited with NTC.
They are not a legitimate grading service - end of story.

clackamas

>>>(for my #23 ranked registry set)

Hey your #24 not 23.

RELLA

rotfl...way to tell him clackamas!

Also...thanks for the reminder on that raw '49 I bought; it should go 66 but is not the best of the bunch. I also bought a really nice '52, '57 and '58-D at the same time (along with some MS64RD-MS65RD stuff, but that's usually the best you'll ever get when you buy raw). I have two other '49s that are even better...time to make a submission I think.

I also went back for another look at the slabbed '49 I have right now; I was a little hard on it last post...I would call it about a 66.1-66.2 on marks and spots but high end 66 on luster. I have one person to offer it to but if he passes it will probably be on eBay soon with a nice starting price (like $0.01).

sinin1...an MS67RD in an MS66RD holder...isn't that what every serious Lincoln collector looks for in his short set key and semi-key dates?

RELLA

Coppernicus

Clack - You're killin' me I look away from the Registry for 10 seconds and WHAM - I drop a spot! Nice acqusitions to get you one up on me. You did outbid me on the 29-D (aaarrrggghhh!!!) Congratulations. Ah well, I must now continue the battle....

Coppernicus (Mike)