Anyone have any info as to why the 1986 Topps cards

boggs301012 · January 6, 2003 10:23AM

Suck as far as the over all condition, I own 200 plus Boggs cards I found one that might be a 9 ..weak 9 at best probly an 8. THere either oc top bottom or left to right and if it is centered the top cut is horrible. And if all of that is ok. There is a scuff on 10% of the cards in the upper right hand conrner. (red and black) I just bought another hundred off ebay. I hope it arrives befor I send in my submission Saturday. This submission is some weaker ealry 80's I have given up on finding better copies of. I guess that is part of the challenge of being one of the few people in the world that will pay to have Boggs cards graded.

RedHeart54 · January 6, 2003 1:20PM

What can be said? They have black borders. That was the first year Topps had a colored border since '75 and we all know how difficult those are (though maybe not as much anymore). Unfortunately, while '86 Topps has a special place in my heart as they were the first baseball cards I ever bought, it sucks not only conditionwise, but rookiewise as well. Cecil Fielder, for some reason, just never sustained the set.

Oh well, the day we aren't chasing some elusive card is the day we quit collecting. Right?

FB · January 6, 2003 8:31PM

It could have something to do with people using the vending cases as:

doorstops
paper-weights
building forts for the kids
hiding "good" cases amongst

and a plethora of other reasons...

God... and to think that I bought 600 vending cases that year. Luckily, I was able to sell them by mid-year 88. I shudder to think that I might have banked on the Vince Coleman, Cecil Fielder and Rick Aguilera rookies....

mikeschmidt · January 6, 2003 9:35PM

FB:

600 vending cases -- geez, to think of how many cards that is! That is approximately 9,091 cards are every player in that set. What a huge amount of bulk -- I can only imagine what something like that weighed.

Boggs:

I agree that 1986 Topps is one of the toughest years for finding high-grade examples. Though I know that this will surely change one day, there still have not been any 10's graded from this set. Even 9's are very tough to find. You would think that with a modern set, 9's would be easy. But, as of current, only 5% of submissions garnish a PSA 9 MINT grade. That is absolutely horrible by post-1980 standards. The only hope out there is the pure bulk of this product that is out there (as FB eluded to). I have an 800-count box of both Mike Schmidt and Steve Carlton cards from this set -- I am almost scared to go through them, because I know I will be hungry for a 10, but also know that finding more than a few 9's in that group may be a challenge. Unlike any other 1980s year, I think 1986 has the largest discrepancy in condition between regular and Tiffany issues. Good luck with your finding a nice Boggs card -- I will be rooting for you.

FB · January 6, 2003 10:09PM

Marc,

Between 1984 and 1989 I used to run card shows in the northern NJ area and would buy bulk from Topps in order to 1) sort into sets and 2) flip for a 20% profit to dealers who didn't want to spend $5000 or more for an order from Topps. Luckily, by the time 1988 and 89 came around, I still had over 1100 cases from 84, 85, 86, and 87 so I had to cut back on what I was buying.

I can just imagine what I'd do with 500 cases of 89 Topps!!!!

LJB17 · January 6, 2003 11:27PM

This is a real pain for the Rose collector as there are 9 Rose cards in this set, so I feel your pain. Upon looking at the pop report I saw that 250 Saberhagens had been graded of the 616 total in the 1986 topps set. And 107 of those came back 7s. That seems a little strange. Was there some sort of warped experiment going on?

mikeschmidt · January 6, 2003 11:43PM

LJB17:

Not sure about the Saberhagen cards. I will definitely say that 9s are tough in the set -- but not sure the mass quantities of Saberhagen.

Reminds me a little of the apparent "1989 Topps - Test our Graders experiment" from back in the day (back in the day that CU still sold baseball cards directly, and not through Superior.....). The Tony Gwynn and Robin Yount experiment, where I think that PSA had purchased quantities of both cards and had them graded by graders to test or otherwise evaluate their skills. Over 1,000 Gwynn's graded and over 1,600 Younts. They used to be all over the hobby, though I haven't looked for any of them in a long time. Good smattering of 8s, 9s and 10s, though very few qualified or graded below that.

MS

boggs301012 · January 7, 2003 2:23AM

MS

You are correct regadring the 89's the graded 100 Boggs as well. I submitted the only 9 !!! ..there might be another I havent checked in awhile. I have another 100 86 topps coming and DSL or DLS is selling another 100 I might buy those as well. I about went blind looking through the few hundred I have. I am going to submitt one and hope for the best. I want at least a 9...I would pay almost the going rookie price for a 86 psa 10 !

mcastaldi · January 7, 2003 7:07AM

RedHeart54> "That was the first year Topps had a colored border since '75 and we all know how difficult those are (though maybe not as much anymore)"

Like with most graded sets that depends. I'm sure you know there's a difference between a card meeting the criteria for an 8 (or 9) and a card you'd actually like to own - and they're not necessarily one in the same. There are a couple of us building the 75 set in graded form with cards we actually like, not soley based on the number on the holder. Obviously when you care about each card in the set it makes it more difficult than if you just buy the holder. As a result, there are some cards with mid-to-high pops in PSA8 but are still very tough to find an attractive example.

Mike

Fabfrank · January 9, 2003 2:09AM

I broke down cases of 86 also. I found that the better cards came from rack packs rather than vending or wax. Try buying a 3 or 6 box rack case to find your Boggs card. I would stay away from the 100 card lots. Many dealers were breaking those years down and selling 100-1000 card lots. Those lots have been handled enough to guarantee you won't get a 9.
As for the high pop on Saberhagen, that sounds like a speculator move. 86 is Saberhagens 2nd year card. During the 80's and early 90's, when a players RC card took off in price, their 2nd year card was cheaper but it would move up in price also. Saberhagen was also known to be a cyclical pitcher. He would have 1 good year followed by 1 bad year. I bet a collector or dealer was speculating that his card would move up coming off a bad year.
For modern collectors 86 Topps, 85 Donruss and to a lesser extent 87 Donruss are some of the hardest cards to get 9 and 10 grades for.

Stump · January 9, 2003 6:47AM

Boggs- bought alot of 86 topps. Ordered 100 cases of wax from factory and with that had the chance to get cut card cases from topps. Topps had a major centering issue in that year. I bought alot of the cut card cases with about 40 percent being badly centered. I think they had bad dies or something because they seemed to have fixed the problem in 87. Still have alot of boggs(100) will check and see if I have any good ones . Also just bought a vending case and maybe I will check for you too.

Dave

RedHeart54 · January 9, 2003 11:00AM

This is eerie!! Does anyone else feel like they're reading the Beckett Monthly Readers Write page from a 1986 issue with Wally Joyner on the cover or something?

boggs301012 · January 9, 2003 11:10AM

Stump/Dave any help would be great I sent off a submission today. I couldnt wait for the 100 lot to arrive due to my hours at work today was my only day off till after the special. I did send one off I say 30% chance at a 9. Hopefully PSA is aware how tuff they are...and the grader is in a good mood.

crazysc · January 9, 2003 1:14PM

<< <i>Reminds me a little of the apparent "1989 Topps - Test our Graders experiment" from back in the day (back in the day that CU still sold baseball cards directly, and not through Superior.....). The Tony Gwynn and Robin Yount experiment, where I think that PSA had purchased quantities of both cards and had them graded by graders to test or otherwise evaluate their skills. Over 1,000 Gwynn's graded and over 1,600 Younts. They used to be all over the hobby, though I haven't looked for any of them in a long time. Good smattering of 8s, 9s and 10s, though very few qualified or graded below that. >>

I'm pretty sure they graded those cards to have cards available to give out as promos at shows and the like - I remember talked with a number of people who got a free PSA graded card, and every one was a 89 Topps Gwynn or Yount!

Nuyauwka · January 9, 2003 1:36PM

I remember when I joined PSA , my membership came with a free graded card, the SMR report and another news flyer. The card I received was a PSA 8 1958 topps football common.

ROCKDJRW · January 9, 2003 11:15PM

Stump, If you could also check if you have any high grade 1986 Topps Ozzie Guillen cards I would greatly appreciate it. I have about 50 of them and the best one I have I feel is an 8. Thanks Nathan (Cadefan8@aol.com)

anjcollection · January 10, 2003 2:46AM

Just thought I'd jump in here.

1986 was the first set I ever put together by myself. I had received an 86 Donruss Factory set as a gift but it just wasn't the same.

I just checked the pop report out of curiousity and was amazed to see that there wasn't even a column for 10s and there are barely any 9s! Yikes!

The set brings back many memories though... I'll have to dig through my boxes to see if I have any in 'mint' condition!

boggs301012 · January 10, 2003 11:02AM

Well According to this seller I can corner the market on Mint Boggs cards. I will be happy if a few are mint. I will send him extra money If I get a 10 out of the lot!!!!!!

1986 TOPPS

andrewlaw · January 28, 2003 3:51AM

I broke down some rack boxes, submitted 15 of the better looking ones, and although I am pleased with results...I am sorry to report that my Wade Boggs card came back PSA 8...

on the brighter side, I did receive a PSA 10 ANDY MCGAFFIGAN, and PSA 9 for Pete Rose, Steve Carlton, Eddie Murray and Jim Rice...

mikeschmidt · January 28, 2003 4:00AM

Wow -- the first PSA 10 card from 1986 Topps. Congratulations!!!!!!

boggs301012 · January 28, 2003 4:13AM

A PSA 10 WOW. I would be willing to take the boggs 8 off your hands. Let me know. Too bad the 10 is a common and not a Star. How many 8's compared to 9's did you recieved?

<< <i>
Well According to this seller I can corner the market on Mint Boggs cards. I will be happy if a few are mint. I will send him extra money If I get a 10 out of the lot!!!!!! >>

I left the seller Negative feedback , so no mint cards for me never recieved the cards.
I have an order in at PSA Since the 13th . No updates on the order, they havent even gave a list of the cards I sent in . I am hoping for a PSA 9 on my 86 topps .

andrewlaw · January 28, 2003 4:33AM

I submitted 15 cards...I wanted to submit only stars, but couldn't come up with 15...even after opening two rack boxes...

I got the one PSA 10...
nine PSA 9's
1 PSA 9 OC
4 PSA 8's

Here is the invoice if you want to check out the breakdown...the first 15 are 1986 Baseball, the second 15 are 1985 Football...

Invoice 764957

boggs301012 · January 28, 2003 4:36AM

Base on what I have seen from 1986 topps you did a GREAT job far more 9's then 8's . Pm or email if you want to part with the boggs.

James

LJB17 · January 28, 2003 4:48AM

Drop me an e-mail or pm if you want to trade or sell the Rose.
ljb17@ausitn.rr.com

1420sports · January 28, 2003 6:45AM

andrewlaw - send me an email at NKane9@aol.com

joker73 · January 28, 2003 9:35AM

Nah, forget those other 2 guys ... you want to sell the Rose to me

AlanAllen · January 28, 2003 10:57AM

Wow, a 10 from '85 Topps football too! You should PM Carkim (Carlos), he's building a high-grade '85 Topps football set.

Joe

RedHeart54 · January 28, 2003 11:39AM

Well, afterall, it IS an '86...
so close...yet so far

boggs301012 · January 29, 2003 6:38AM

My 1986 Topps came back an .............................PSA 8 . I will attempt again. My whole order is lower then expected. No 10's I always through in a few ringers for 10's but I didnt get any. I revcieved 2 PSA 7's . I dont like 7's, both are newer cards 1993 DR and 2000 UD. Back to the drawing board on those. I can live with 8's. A few 9's here and there. Over all disappointed. My 1972 Aaron LL cards was an 8 !!!

James

mikeschmidt · February 6, 2003 3:05AM

The first 1986 Topps PSA 10 card to hit the market sold for slightly less than $200-. A Cal Ripken card to boot!

Was auctioned here

boggs301012 · February 6, 2003 4:03AM

MS

That is a really good price for a modern card, I guess my 50.00 offer for a Boggs 10 is about right. His cards sell for 1/4 of Ripken . I wonder is this is the will reflect in a rise in submissions for 1986 Topps ?

James

Fabfrank · February 6, 2003 5:06AM

boggs- I have tons of 86 Topps that I will review and submit in the next special. I didn't get a chance this time because I was concentrating on football. But you are right. This is a very tough year condition wise. I think that the quantity of cards available will offset all the chipping, OC and miscuts from this year. As why approach the 20th anniversary for these cards, more will be submitted and collected again.

LJB17 · February 6, 2003 5:37AM

fabfrank,

Can you find me a 9 or 10 Yount 1986 in your next submission? I am putting together a specific group of cards and I need that one.

Thanks,
Luke

purelyPSA · February 6, 2003 8:39AM

I cracked a rack case and got a whopping 2(!) cards that rated worth submission, and one was a white bordered card. This stuff will eventually come out of the woodwork, but it'll be a trickle compared to other years. Is it just me, or does the facing of the card seem incredibly chip happy? I'm not just referring to the black bordered top, but it seems like all around it was just poorly produced.

BTW, I got a 9 on both the Ryan and the Rose #2.

purelyPSA · February 6, 2003 8:43AM

That's one impressive auction; the fourth underbidder (mikeschmidt) came in at nearly 160 bucks. This one should drive up the number of submissions of 86 material...but I can't see a whole lot of it coming back in gem 10.

Wayne8348 · February 6, 2003 8:47AM

I sniped that auction at $185 and I thought I would win it easily. I was really surprised at not only how high it went but also how many bidders were well above $100 on that card. It would have looked great in my Ripken psa 10 collection.

Wayne

Fabfrank · February 6, 2003 10:46AM

LJB17- I'll make a note of it. I won't be going through them for at least amonth or two. But when I do I'll be submitting all the stars, rookies and 2nd year cards.

anjcollection · February 6, 2003 10:58AM

Hey Wayne,

Just curious, how many in your Ripken PSA 10 collection?
I've got a 83 T if you're interested.

boggs301012 · February 6, 2003 11:23AM

Fabfrank

I will gladly buy a PSA 9 or 10. I have 2 8's, so far. I am going to go over the couple hundred I have again and see what I can submit. (if I use PSA again )

James

Wayne8348 · February 6, 2003 11:56AM

I have about 27 ripken psa 10's so far and I do need the 83 Topps in a psa 10. Email me and let me know what you want for it.

Thanks,

Wayne
wayne840@insightbb.com

boggs301012 · February 6, 2003 12:19PM

anjcollection

If you make a deal there is my 10% thread fee, starting the thread that lead to a deal . Or an 83 topps PSA 10 Boggs for me?

Wayne ...27 I am up to abou....17 or so. My goal is 30 more than 10% of my set (or enuff to fill a penzoni display)

James

Anyone have any info as to why the 1986 Topps cards

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