PCGS Slab History

carnegieron · January 1, 2003 11:45AM

Can anyone out there describe or supply images of all the PCGS slabs and labels and their length of time in service? Also, what prompts PCGS to change slabs? Along these lines, was PCGS stricter in the beginning and if they were, would anyone or has anyone bust out and resubmit hoping for a higher grade? What were the results if you've already tried this? Thanks, Ron

DHeath · January 1, 2003 11:50AM

Conder, one of the best versed humans on the planet in slab history, and a member here is very close to publishing a book about slabs, and grading companies that probably will be the definitive work on the subject. Welcome aboard - BTW. As for crackouts and resubmissions, I think that may have been done before.

Try a search using crackout, and you'll see hundreds of related posts. What do you collect?

littlewicher · January 1, 2003 11:52AM

Most of the PQ coins that were in the old holders, have been cracked out and resubmitted. The chances that you'll find an upgrader coin in an old holder is pretty slim.

carnegieron · January 1, 2003 12:10PM

What do I collect? mmmmmmmm Not an easy question. My first love is Franklins. I do have a registry Roosevelt set that I need 12 more MS67's to complete. Then I be looking for MS68's! HA! The 50S MS68 is over 3k now on ebay. Pop 4. Too many deep pockets for me to compete with. I did go to almost 3k but that was pushing it. The reserve still hasn't been met. I'm also in the midst of putting a 2.5 Indian gold MS set together. A short series but not cheap. I have to stay under MS62 to be able to afford doing it at all. I will look for Conder's publication. Any idea when? Thanks for input on older slabs. Ron

DHeath · January 1, 2003 12:20PM

I'm surprised he isn't on tonight, but I'm sure he'll see this thread and respond. Sounds like a nice set of Rosies. I love the Indians, but I've been afraid to start because it would eat up my coin budget too quickly. I'd love to see some pics, if you get a chance. As for the crack-out question, IMO it is possible to find upgrades, but it takes lots of looking and a good eye. Sounds like you know what an attractive coin looks like. Again, welcome.

carnegieron · January 1, 2003 12:52PM

My question to Conder is; I bought a PCGS Roosevelt from ebay from and the PCGS slab came easily apart. I wrote to PCGS but they never answered. I still have it. Actually, this was the 2nd slabbed Roosevelt from the same dealer that I could easily take the slab apart! The 1st I sent back to the dealer as he insisted I do this. I was pretty naive and sent it back. I think there was some hanky-panky going on within PCGS for this to have happened, and twice to me!! What are the odds of that?? Anyway, Conder, have you ever experienced this phenom yourself? Another slab question. I have a very light green labeled PCGS slab with clear concentric circles and not the frosted circles. The slab is somewhat thicker, too. Any info will be appreciated. Good luck with the book. Need any backers?

wallstreetman · January 1, 2003 12:57PM

carnegieron, I think you need to quit buying from that dealer!

NumisEd · January 1, 2003 1:01PM

Doesn't sound like a PCGS problem........sounds like a fishy dealer problem.

wallstreetman · January 1, 2003 1:05PM

Mr.Hall, are you reading this?

carnegieron · January 1, 2003 1:05PM

...and how would one ever pull a slab apart w/o it cracking? I did stop buying from this person long ago. Perhaps it was a fluke that 2 slabs came apart but...

wallstreetman · January 1, 2003 1:08PM

You can usually tell if its been cut!

NumisEd · January 1, 2003 1:14PM

.and how would one ever pull a slab apart w/o it cracking

I have heard that it can be done, although I have no actual experience. Consider this: How do they make 2 headed Washington quarters? One is cut with precision machine shop technology and placed in another that has been hollowed out with the same type of equipment.

carnegieron · January 1, 2003 1:21PM

I have a habit, for whatever reason, of tapping slabs on my desk. Well, this last one had a dull, hollow sound when I tapped it. I used my finger nail and removed the inside insert from the rim. Very easy. This inside insert sort of fits pretty snug, almost like a suction. It was never, ever sealed, IMO. I wonder if these slabs are counted while they are being used or, as I picture it, there's just some big barrel of slabs and everyone just grabs what they what to. Perhaps not, but somehow some ran out the back door. I wonder if I were to super glue it one would never know? mmmmm I'll probably be at the FUN show this year as they're having a little party for Registry folks so I thought I'd attend (I'm less than a 100 miles from Orlando) and I might carry this slab along for PCGS to look at and see if they might have an explanation.

carnegieron · January 1, 2003 1:29PM

NumisEd; It wasn't cut and it was clearly two unsonically sealed slab parts. I will do a scan for everyone to look over. I could be wrong but I'll let this audience decide. Probably tomorrow some time for the scan. Later, Ron

littlewicher · January 1, 2003 1:35PM

No PCGS slabs should just pull apart. They're sonically sealed. Dealers have been known to carefully open the slabs and replace coins of a lower grade in it, then resubmitting the coin they cracked out. Some of these dealers are very corrupt.

Conder101 · January 2, 2003 9:24PM

Sorry for not getting to this sooner but I did a 26 hour day New Years eve and took a 21 hour nap New Years Day.

I have seen a few, a very few, PCGS slabs that were never sealed. The shell halves do fit together very snugly so it would be possible for the person sealing them to put one in, get distracted, and then when he turns back to his work think he had already sealed it and send it on its way. It would not be likely to fall apart and probably the only way he would notice would be if he thumped in on the table. Even then he probably wouldn't notice because you can bet he'll be wearing hearing protection. I would consider it to be an interesting novelty and would buy one if I can across one. I doubt if it is the result of any hanky pancky be cause if it was we would be seeing a lot more of them. Also if someone WAS smuggling out PCGS shells I would think they would get ahold of a sonic sealer to keep them from being noticed.

Carnegieron, I'll be sending you a PM about the PCGS variety descriptions. Not all of the scans though, that takes too much time. I'm on dial up.

I have never experienced the unsealed slabs personally, I never submit coins. I do not even buy slabs unless I need them for my slab reference set. I am a strictly anti-slab collector. I won't even look at slabbed coins when I am seeking coins for my collection.

I'm not sure which variety of PCGS slab it is you are describing. When you get the listings see if any of them seem to match yours. If not then we will see about some scans possibly. I'm wondering if it might be one of the counterfeit PCGS slabs that came on the market in 1988. But if it was I think you would have mentioned that it was the small sized slab. Well we will see.

PCGS Slab History

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