1870's shallow N IHC counterfeits - another example

Lakesammman

BigD5 loaned me this 1874 coin....it was to compare to another shallow N 1876 IHC thought perhaps to be a counterfeit. The shallow N has been seen on real 1870's coins from 1870-2 and 1877. A 1873 may have the shallow N but hasn't been authenticated. I was hoping there would be "repeating" circulation marks, thus proving one or both were struck from the same counterfeit die (necessarily, the reverse). Circulation marks are like fingerprints, unique to each coin....if 2 coins share the same marks, they were likely struck from a counterfeit die made from a real coin that actually had the marks. Alas, no match. Both are still suspect....if you have other examples, I would love to hear from you.

The 1874 is much more "pebbly" with multiple pimples on the surfaces, typical for a coin struck from spark erosion dies. There are numerous parallel die polish lines on the obverse. Both lack flow lines giving the fields a unnatural, flat appearance.

shylock

This image of the 1874 really shows the unnatural texture on the Indian's profile, almost a sandblasted cameo affect. And the way the upper rim never really meets, but tucks under itself is odd -- wonder if that was a result of the image transfer or if it was on the original coin. Your 1876 has a very authentic look to it from the image.

Just a random observation: do both these have broken D's in United?

Lakesammman

Interesting observation re: the rim....the denticles are less prominent there on the 1874. The broken D is only on the 1874....hope there are more examples out there.

Shylock - sent you a email - check your inbox!

Conder101

Can't really be sure from the scans but it looks like there may be two or three repeating marks below the ribbons on the reverse at 6:00.

Lakesammman

There are several that are hard to see on a picture that has been "low-res'd" to make it easily downloaded. In person, there are no similar marks. Also, the lack of a pimply surface indicates it is likely a different die.

danglen

The lack of flow lines may just be an indication of an early strike in the run, as flow lines generally tend to appear after the dies start wearing a bit, but I agree that because of limited production of counterfeits, lack of flow lines is a diagnostic that could make the coin suspect.