Does the Registry Affect Prices

Typetone

I thought one of the key lessons of the Pinnacle article is that the PCGS Registry is not market neutral. It's existence, or at least general PCGS decisions, seem to affect price.

There are many possible examples, but for now I will focus on strike designation. I notice that on coins with strike designations there are huge premiums for coins with the designation. This is particularly true for dates where strikes are usually weak. We could all cite instances; there are many cases where MS65FX pieces sell for multiples of MS66 or even MS67 pieces w/o the designation. Most of the S mint Franklins certainly fall in this class. I also note that the PCGS registry gives two or more bonus points to coins with the strike designation. Is there a relation? I believe that a coin graded MS66 or MS67 is considered by PCGS to be an overall better coin than one graded MS65FX. Yet the prices reflect a mega bias towards the strike designation coin. Is this the registry affecting price?

You might say that collectors just prefer better struck coins. However consider mint state Walkers. In this series strike is important and the quality of strike easy to ascertain. While collectors prefer better struck Walkers, there is nothing like the Franklin premium. Most 40s S mint pieces have weak strikes. However, I would venture to say that a well struck S mint piece in 65 would price under a regular strike piece in 66, and certainly in 67. Now I would further assert that if PCGS started to designate full-head or whatever Walkers, and gave extra registry points, that the premium would explode. Do you agree? This I think is an example of the plastic and the registry swamping the quality of the coin itself.

We could make the exact same arguement for PR vs CAM vs DCAM 50s proofs. What does everyone think?

Greg

TAP444

In answer to this question (does a cat meow)
Tim

braddick

Short answer: YES.

The Long answer: It sure as all get out DOES!

mdwoods

I agree with Braddick. The registry certainly affects the prices. However, I communicate with many more people because of the Registry, so I count it as a postive. It's fun too. mdwoods

BNE

I agree -- it is an aspect of the uncertainty principle: the thing observed changes by virtue of the act of being observed.

One way of looking at it is that the coins with the designations are overvalued. Another way is to argue (as I do) that the non-designated are undervalued. That's why I'm a champion of brilliant proof coinage. Collectors who choose to collect non-full-step Jeffs, and non-full-band Mercs are getting a lot of relative value for the money, which will be realized if collector sentiment moves broadly away from coins collected only for their "points."

fantasiize

The quick answer ... yes.

The long answer ... absolutely yes.

Braddick,

I knew I liked you but your new icon confirms it.

Ronyahski

Absolutely agree that the Registry has perpetuated bias towards strike designated coins. PCGS could have righted the situation somehat when they weighted and bonus pointed the series. For whatever reason they chose not to. Best example, as pointed out, is the Franklin series. They awarded at least 2 bonus points for FBL when, as the population reports point out, 1 bonus point would have been more than enough.

Having said that, I don't think the Registry has affected prices as much as the desginations themselves. Again, using Franklins as an example, FBL coins skyrocketed in price once "FBL" went on the slab, which preceded the popularity of the Registry.

Lakesammman

If I were collecting "full strike" coins, I would preview every one at home with a microscope and never buy a coin at a show....it's just too easy to doctor those features and overlook it at low mag. The premium being paid is way too much....now then, give me a well struck red IHC and my paddle never rests!!!

RegistryCoin

Ronyahski makes an important point, with a good example of past performance. Now, if a new designation, for example, Full Bands on Roosies, were adopted, will that development (it will affect prices) be caused by the appearance of the registry, or years of a grass roots movement?

braddick

<< <i>The quick answer ... yes. The long answer ... absolutely yes. Braddick, I knew I liked you but your new icon confirms it. >>



Thanks! I figured I OWN that Ike, might as well take advantage of that and USE it as my ICON.

Lakesammman

For years I thought MS65 IHC's should have full feathers - they often don't. Perhaps there should be a full feathers designations?? (MS65RFF)

KAJ1

Lakesammman,



<< <i>Perhaps there should be a full feathers designations?? >>



Don't give AGC any bright ideas.


Kevin

homerunhall

There is no question that the Registry effects prices. There are coins that now bring $5000 for which a price of $500 would have been unthinkable 4 years ago.

Note that we also have a Registry for sportscards and the same thing has happened. Prices for the so-called "commons" (they are actually non-star cards and aren't common in the sense that we use the term in the coin market) have sky-rocketed.

Watch out for stamps...they are next.

David

leothelyon

Just curious, what started the boom in the early 1980's. I realize gold prices had something to do with it but this couldn't have been the only reason why the coin prices went up then.

Leo

And if you see this homerunhall, enlighten us on the 6 step Jefferson dilemma.

boston

The registry certainly affects prices. Third party grading is subjective, but isn't imperative, considering AGC., and all other grading services
when evaluating specific coinage.

The use of computers and the internet brings many more collectors into the mainstream, connecting them to market info and demand.
Population reports affect the price. These reports can be a true reflection or can be a dillusion.

I believe the registry helps in many ways that weren't available 20 years ago. Yet it does have critics and advocates. The registry has brought
about a new generation of scam artists, a new generation of collectors, and those who want to know and share that knowlege.
Knowlege is the only salvation. Degrees of this can be found in the forums, from experienced collectors to the newbies!

The Registry tells us what they believe is correct, and we tell them what we think about it. Fortunately, there are forum members that know
more than the registry about many type, variety issues. I enjoy being here and learning.

Bob

Spooly

It has too! Everytime a good coins comes up for auction.... I bump into 4 or 5 of my follow Registry Set collectors all bidding on the same coin!

jcping

Definitely, it affects the price. Nevertheless, I don't think the set registry affects the price on the whole spectrum.

IMO, the top grade and the next grade get affected the most. What do you think?