1795 $ anacs-8 becomes icg-12, SEE THE PROOF!

dorkkarl

very-rare variety 1795 dollar before after

i personally examined this bust dollar at the heritage auction, it was brilliantly polished, w/ a deep-mirror proof-like finish, but a nice rare coin, anacs net-8. now, it has ended up in a icg-12 holder, & it is "no longer polished".

my question: does it bother you that the coin has been re-toned? esp. considering it is a very rare variety, that has now been made once again into a collectable coin? does the huge increase in price bother you? whaddya think, & i'll post my opinion later - as you might guess, a little controversial.

and YES, they are the same coin.

K S

Russ

<< <i>and YES, they are the same coin. >>



I think you're full of... Just kidding! It's obvious, even to me. What does it say about ICG that they would slab a high-end problem coin without notation?

Russ, NCNE

agentjim007

SO does NGC. I saw this very same dealer take an ANACS cleaned Gobrech (I know I spelled that wrong but you know what I mean) Dollar and get it in a NGC holder. So it's not just ICG.

kranky

This kind of thing is inevitable. Some people can retone a coin, and that net-graded polished coin was a good candidate. After all, the detail was still there to qualify as Fine. Just as with artificial toning, it's not called artificial if you can fool people.

Perhaps the coin was tried at other services first, but got bodybagged. Does the coin look natural?

EVillageProwler

I've seen the coin recently. It looked MUCH better than at pre-FUN and at CSNS. (I've seen this coin at both shows too.)

It is obviously not an original coin, but its appearance is not so bad. Detail-wise, the coin is possibly an VF coin. The coin had already been BB'ed by PCGS -- for cleaning, due to the hairlines. I don't know about NGC.

EVP

dorkkarl

hey evp, please explin. you say it was bb'd AFTER begin curated???

K S

EVillageProwler

Here's what I know of the history of this coin:

Superior Elite Sale during pre-FUN, consigned by Cardinal and bought back by consignor for $1.2K hammer. Offered to me afterwards by TAGZ.

Heritage CSNS auction, consigned by Cardinal and sold for $1.2K hammer.

At this time, the coin was still in its original ANACS holder and ugly as heck.

I lost track of this coin from April until it showed up in Evan's inventory. Since showing up as a retail item, it's been re-toned to what it is now *and* it's been BB'ed by PCGS for cleaning (after the re-toning).

Besides this coin, there's been 4 other appearances of this variety:
1. I. Kleinman, raw EF details but light obv tooling and lightly polished: $2.4K
2. I. Kleinman, raw VG10: $1.8K
3. San Marino, Sept Goldberg pre-LB, PCGS F15: high $3K range
4. Albany, Sept Heritage LB, ANACS VF details F12 graffitti: mid $2K range

All four of the above specimens have better eye appeal than the Cardinal specimen.

#3 was overpriced; it had obv scratches.

Evan's coin is grossly overpriced...

EVP

shirohniichan

my question: does it bother you that the coin has been re-toned? esp. considering it is a very rare variety, that has now been made once again into a collectable coin? does the huge increase in price bother you? whaddya think, & i'll post my opinion later - as you might guess, a little controversial.

There must be a logical explanation for it. Maybe "ICG-12" implies that it was retoned. I don't see why you're making this into a conspiracy.

gmarguli

Maybe "ICG-12" implies that it was retoned.

I always interpreted ICG-12 to mean it's a PCGS-03.

jcping

No wonder ICG did not rank as high as PCGS.

Nysoto

Yes, it bothers me that the coin was quickly and badly re-toned, but there is no law against that; let the buyer beware. I have noticed ICG coins sell for much less than PCGS at auctions, but retailers try to squeeze out more profit by pricing ICG at close to PCGS levels. I collect draped bust halves, I would buy a R.6 - R.8 coin in any condition (even holed) if the price was right.

Thanks for enlightening us on this example.