Why Do people on this Board Hate Mr Mint?

LuxuryWines

I have seen a few posts on this board as to why people dislike Alan Rosen (aka Mr Mint) and I am very curious as to why? I have never dealt with him and have only met him at shows... Could someone let me know?

uniship

I've dealt with him and I happen to like him. I think some are turned off by the occasional foul language, and I can understand why, but from my encounters, I like both his personality and high-energy attitude.

alohaet

I approached Mr. Mint at a show in Hawaii a few years back to sell an item I had. He had all kinds of signs saying he was in the market to buy cards and memorabilia. What I had was a framed Ty Cobb photo and bank check both signed in Cobb's famous green ink. Before I came to him I went around to many dealers for thier opinions. I received offers to buy the item from me in a range of $1200 to $1500 on the spot. I went to MR. MINT and he a look at it for about 30 seconds and said "this really isn't worth anything" and abruptly started talking to another dealer. I was totally dismissed by this clown like I had the plague. He buys cards at rock bottom prices from desparate sellers and jacks up the price beyond SMR. For years he did nothing but bad mouth PSA as rip off artist. As you can tell I am not a fan of this guy. This was my experience with MR. MINT it may not be the norm, but that is all can I go by.

Ed

KING KELLOGG

Luxury...

All of my dealings with Alan Rosen were centered around the mega shows from 1986-89. Alan would show up with his fist full of 100 dollar bills, looking for high dollar buyers and sellers. You would think that he had after-burners hooked onto his belt. Here one minute, buying a deal...there the next minute, selling a deal he made an hour prior. His energy level certainly caused all kinds of conflict. But with all the $'s he spent and all the SCD ads he has done, I would have to say he has been good for the hobby. Sometimes quite...Most of the time not.....Always on the move for the next deal...Love him or hate him...He is part of the fabric of our hobby.

toppsgun

I observed a similar encounter to alohaet at the 1994 National in Houston. A collector had waited at Mr. Mint's table for 20-25 minutes to show him a 1965 complete set. Rosen was out and about and when he finally showed up, the seller handed him the set in the binder. Rosen opened the binder, took a look at the first page only (leader cards) and promptly shut the binder without looking any further and said, "No good." Then he jumped up and disappeared into the hall.

Inconsiderate chump.

ROCKDJRW

At Sportsfest a couple years ago I had a old Cubs photo from the early 1900's Iwanted to get some info on. Of course the first dealer I saw was Mr. Mint. He offered me two grand on the spot and told me that was the best he could do and If I came back later his offer would be less. I passed and walked the show and gathered more info on my piece. I wound up selling the piece to a very nice dealer (Tick & tick) for 4500 dollars and that was after he took 25 minutes telling me what I had.

thejam

mr mint is not that bad if you remove his foul mouth, foul body odor, and arrogant nature

uniship

After reading the above posts, let me qualify my statements and say that I talked with him at the 1999 and 2002 Nationals. Perhaps he has toned down his act in recent years. Those encounters described by others in this thread sound disgraceful.

mikeschmidt

Besides his ego....


The infamous T206 Doyle debacle....


there is also the famous story of the person who purportedly won a Babe Ruth autographed baseball from him at one of the major shows he was doing. The winner, pleased with his prize, took the ball to PSA/DNA who would not authenticate it because they felt the signature was questionable.

He overgrades in his auctions (I know, I've won some...) and is not very receptive of questions or concerns from interested collectors, dealers or sellers.

Yzerman19C

I know some people hate these type of threads but i find them informative.

Marc could you elaborate on the T206 Doyle story


thanks

Randy

dude

I've had several Al Rosen encounters. The first ones were in 1990 at some of the larger regional shows like at Strongsville, OH or the SF Labor Day show. It was interesting watching him negotiate buys from people with some pretty interesting vintage stuff. He was pretty savvy I must say.

I too met him at the 1994 National in Houston. He saw that I had a nice camera and thought I might have been with the press, so he was more than happy to welcome me to his table. The MLB players strike was in progress, and if you picked up a Beckett Monthly, you could see that baseball card prices were suffering severely and the nation-wide interest in sports collecting has hideous at the time. When I chatted with him about the Convention in general, he really bashed Houston - claiming that it had no collecting base at all and he pretty much vowed to do everything possible to keep the National from ever returning to Houston. He made similar comments in the following issue of SCD. These comments were very unfair (beyond the timing of the strike) since: 1). There was a Houston Sports Collectors Association with 150 active members at the time. 2) There was a 2 hour sports collecting talk radio show every Sunday night. & 3) The Houston Chronicle ran weekly sports collecting articles. So in short, his claims were non-sense.

He also used to run ads in SCD that said, "Say 'No' to grading". He missed the boat bigtime on that campaign - in my opinion.

I've run into him many times since. I carry a catalogue case to shows which looks like a small suit case. Every so often he'll see me walk in and he'll chase me down. I normally choose to talk to him, since if I keep walking and make a sudden stop, his face will be anatomically implanted in my rump. But our chats are nearly always the same. He's initially astatic to see me like I'm his long lost brother, and then he'll look down at my carrying case and he'll ask if I brought anything to sell. I always answer, "No", and our conversation may last another 3 seconds depending if no one else is walking in with something to sell. I don't hate the guy, but no one could ever love him as much as he loves himself.

His website is worth a look. Some of his "finds" have as much credibility as some of Enron's 2001 financial reports.

The one good thing I can say about him is that he's reached out to the masses (beyond the hobby) and made people aware that sports collecting exists and their vintage collectibles may have some value to them.

Davalillo

As I understand it, Alan's business model is to buy larger collections and quickly flip pieces of them to other dealers and keep the very best stuff for his auctions.

I have bought mint sets from his auctions that three times have come back with an average grade of less than 7. I have also bought individual cards described as nrmt-mt or mt that have come back as low as 5. These purchases date back 10 yrs ago or more in some cases before psa became popular.

He completely missed the graded card phenomenon and was very vocal about how bad it was for the hobby.

Davalillo

mikeschmidt

If you want more information on the T206 debacle, let me know, and I'll post what I remember. It involves, Alan Rosen, SGC (and Joe Markel, the head grader at the time...), and Keith Olbermann, the famous collector and former ESPN anlyst. As a result of this debacle, Olbermann to this day keeps very few graded cards in his collection despite having one of the premier and comprehensive runs of pre-war cards -- many in high grade.

Mr. Mint actually is one of the main buying outfits for Kit Young cards. He keeps many of the gems for himself for his auctions and the "collector-grade" cards get filtered through to Kit Young's catalogs.

As for a little secret -- he has essentially earned himself such a negative reputation in many collectors minds, that you can occassionally find a good steal or two in his auctions. For example, there were two major PSA-graded cards in his last auction that went for approximately 30-40% less than they would have realized in an Ebay or Mastro/Superior-type auction. And, though I probably do not want to disclose what those cards were, I will say that one of the cards was a second-year card of a significant Hall of Famer in PSA 9 condition. The card was 1/3 with the other two examples housed in Davalillo's and Doug Rivard's respective collections. To have such a significant low population card sell for so little attests to Mr. Mint's lack of prominence among many of the advanced collectors of today.

Basilone

<< <i>I've run into him many times since. I carry a catalogue case to shows which looks like a small suit case. Every so often he'll see me walk in and he'll chase me down. I normally choose to talk to him, since if I keep walking and make a sudden stop, his face will be anatomically implanted in my rump. But our chats are nearly always the same. He's initially astatic to see me like I'm his long lost brother, and then he'll look down at my carrying case and he'll ask if I brought anything to sell. >>



Dude-

Where you at the Strongsville (Ohio) show this past spring? I saw the EXACT thing happen with a gentleman with a briefcase type bag. Of course he was a bit older (fifities) so it probably wasnt you.

JOhn

dude

John,

I haven't been in Strongsville since 1990. I only went there since I was traveling to Pittsburgh and planned my trip so that I could catch the show. As I recall, I did well at that show buying several hundred '67 and '68 commons in NM-Mint condition in the $0.50 - $1.00 each range. Those were the days!

dude

BTW - I've received a few inquiries regarding that catalog case that I carry to shows. They are available at Office Depot for $29.99.

LINK

dude

Sorry for the three straight posts. Here is a good article regarding Mr. Mint, Keith Olbermann and the phony T-206 Doyle graded by SGC.

BTW mikeschmidt - it was graded by Joe Merkel (not Markel -- no relation to me).

Phony T-206 Doyle

mcdee2

I do believe that the Babe Ruth auto'd ball was a redemption from some sort of contest. It was pretty much known that the Babe had his personal secretary sign the balls in his place. I dont recall currently the company running the promotion but have seen several of these balls on ebay and they are usually accompanied by the story of actually getting a signature from his secretary.

Basilone

Does anyone know the result of the Rosen lawsuit?

John

aro13

I do remember asking Mr. Mint why all of sudden he started selling SGC cards when he had been so adament that grading was evil. All he told me was that it was a financial decision. Part of the reason he disliked grading so much was that most of the cards in his auctions were advertised as mint (maybe to him). He also used to say that you had better buy his mint cards before the "Rolex crowd" entombs them forever. Of course, there were no returns on cards that had been sent to a third party for authentication (perhaps because they might not come back as 9's or even 8's). His ratings were always very poor in the VCBC magazine. He was rated slightly higher than Alan Hager and right with Broadway Rick in the mid to late 90's ratings.

thejam

he doesn't know what mint is; he sells as mint , but they are not ; he ripped me off by selling a "complete set" but it was not -- it was 1 short with one dupe .... now he is poor

helionaut

From what I recall reading, I think it was $100,000 "endorsement" fee from SGC that changed his mind about slabbing. That plus the way graded cards exploded in 1998 with a SGC 100 McGwire RC making national news by selling for $3000.

Mantlefan

My 2 cents, having won several items from Rosen:

His "Gem Mint Blazers" usually grade 7 or 8.

His conversion to "slab-ism" after years of knocking the grading systems is hypocritical.

His Bobble-head is pathetic.

markmac

I registered for one of his auctions last year and was told by his wife that she would call me back the next day with a bidding number. When I called to get the number, Rosen answered and was very rude and yelled at me over the phone for not having a bidding number. I teach 9th graders and I felt like I was talking to one when trying to explain to him my reason for not having a number. I had about $800 I was willing to drop on a nice 71 topps basketball set, but I never called back to bid. I also ran into him at the Richmond Classic in 2000 where he was giving away his beanie babies. When my uncle and I each grabbed one of the bears, Rosen's table watcher yelled at us from 10 feet away to bring the beanie back since it was only to be given one per family. I'll never participate in anything involving him.

GangstaJayson

<< <i>Sorry for the three straight posts. Here is a good article regarding Mr. Mint, Keith Olbermann and the phony T-206 Doyle graded by SGC.

BTW mikeschmidt - it was graded by Joe Merkel (not Markel -- no relation to me).

Phony T-206 Doyle >>





Thanks for that attachment.. Very cool story, have heard it before but cool to see what rosen said about it....

RedHeart54

Has anyone taken his voodoo doll, er, bobble head to the driving range? Would probably be a great shot.

LuxuryWines

THanks for filling me in everyone .... It is great learn from others without having to pay for your mistakes..... Very good read on the Doyle Article....

theBobs

<< <i>Has anyone taken his voodoo doll, er, bobble head to the driving range >>

or skeet shooting...

KING KELLOGG

Dude...

Thanks for linking the Doyle story...Very intresting...Sound like Mr. Mint wants "free" money.

riccaboni

I can understandbly see where people get off disliking the guy. But let's face it, in response to a few of the posts where he dismissed items before really looking them over, would you take the time to go through a pile of 100 1987 Donruss Benito Santiagos, knowing full well that's not what you are looking to buy at a show where someone may have something you really wanted to purchase and they might get turned away seeing you go through a pile of 1987 Santiagos. While it's agree he may lack compassion, I have to almost applaud the man because he knows what he wants, and he knows how to get it, even though the ways he gets it (lowballing collectors desperate to sell their items) isn't always the best way to go. When I go to a card show, I know that I'm not going to look at 1989 Topps cards, so what is the big deal if he doesn't want to purchase your items because he either doesn't collect them or knows he cannot turn them around?

Ian

carkim

so what is the big deal if he doesn't want to purchase your items because he either doesn't collect them or knows he cannot turn them around?

My brush with "Mr. Mint" was very short and not so sweet. I, too, was at a Strongsville (OH) card show where Mr. Mint was at the first table when you walked in. I had a 1984 Olympic Torch, Leather carrying case, Runner's Uniform, and Limited Edition 1984 Olympic Program for sale. Alan runs from behind his table and grabs my arm and asks me "What do you have there?" I show him my Olympic memorabilia and he ponders for a few moments and says "I'll give you $200 cash and $300 in trade." I say no thanks and gather my things.

I go to a few other tables and this guy is following me around. He starts down-playing what I have to other dealers. He tells them (while I'm standing there) paint is on the carrying case (Which there was) and the torch has burn marks, and the leather handle has a scratch. All of which I pointed out to "Mr Mint" when I showed him the items.

I am a peaceful man but this guy was getting on my last nerve. I told him to back off, and being 6'6" tall 250 lbs., he got the message.

Needless to say I sold the Olympic memorabilia for much more then he was offering.

A few months (maybe a year) later he had a 1984 Olympic torch in one of his auctions. I don't know if it was mine but it would make a great ending to this story if it was.

Carlos

MLTucker

"I am a peaceful man but this guy was getting on my last nerve. I told him to back off, and being 6'6" tall 250 lbs., he got the message."

this makes me wonder who would win a card show fight between mr. mint and mike wentz? maybe it could be a steel cage match where they can fight to the death, then at least we could get rid of one of them.

Philabuster

ML Tucker
I like your idea. The outcome could do nothing but help the hobby.

brucemo

I remember reading an article in Dennis Purdy's magazine. I moved recently and a lot of my stuff is still packed up, so I can't go find it. I remember reading something like this:

Rosen was at a convention/meeting/lecture, and the speaker was one of the PSA founders (Hall?). Rosen was giving off generally negative vibes about PSA and eventually asked how much they'd pay him to grade cards. The reply was, "How about $1000 a week and all you can steal?"

I've never dealt with Rosen, but if the one story a friend told me about Rosen is true, I can understand the above comment.

bruce

helionaut

<< <i> ...and the torch has burn marks... >>



A torch with burn marks? You've got some nerve, there, buddy.

See, it's guys like that and a couple other big-name dealers I've met who don't have time for anyone who isn't willing or, more usually, able, to generate huge profits for them that turn me off. The hobby's not so big that you can act like that without repercussions.

riccaboni

I stand corrected Carlos... I never realized that he'd stoop that low to follow you around, that is rather rude if you ask me...

Ian

BOTN

Absolutely nothing nice can be said about Mint. He ranks very high on most people's Top 10 list of Dirt Bags in the hobby. For people selling their collections there are far better people to sell to.

TheCARDKid

How does he stay in business with this kind of reputation?

My only "encounter" with Mr Mint was a few years ago, when I wrote to him with a SASE asking for a copy of the prices realized from his last auction. He wrote back something to the effect of,..."sorry, we don't disclose that kind of information". I thought it was very strange, considering one of the biggest assets an auction has is its prices realized list. If I'm a potential consignor, that's the first information I would like to know. Hmmmmm, maybe his prices realized aren't so strong after all. I don't think SCD talks about any results from his auctions, even though they promote them very well.

Who's got a bigger ego, Mr Mint or Donald Trump? Rosen reminds me of Trumps bravado, hyperbole, salesmanship,.....whatever you want to call it. Brash might be the best word.

koby

Occasionally Mr. Mint has some really nice cards in his auctions. Sometimes he has stuff that never come up otherwise. My experience with him tells me you have to take his descriptions with a grain of salt, however.

I have talked to Rosen at several shows and agree with everyone who says he is a pompous and rude jerk.

HockeyCardGuru

I agree with TCK. How can someone stay in business with that type of reputation, regardless of hobby "expertise?" I too have attempted to communicate with Minty at the occasional convention and would rather undergo a root canal. Arrogance is the understatement of the century, but my question is, what on earth does this joker have to be arrogant about? ...Michael

zardoz51

Carkim

That is an amusing "Mr. Mint" story!

I made the comment to another board member after seeing the photos of you and your brother from the National, that if a brawl ever broke out at a show, I'd be right behind the two of you.

The fact that Mr. Mint would denegrate your mechandise in such an unprofessional manner, and in light of the fact that you can hardly be considered a midget, the man must have a suicidal wish. I don't believe that I would have been as nice about it as you were. He wouldn't have been so "Mint" by the time I had finished with him, more of a Fair to Poor grade.

thejam

in his earlier life, he probably got low-balled by Moe and Lester; this may explain his nature in grabbing guys and asking if he can see what they have in their package

carkim

I made the comment to another board member after seeing the photos of you and your brother from the National, that if a brawl ever broke out at a show, I'd be right behind the two of you.

If this would have happened to my brother, Mr. Mint would be Mr. Poor-Fair. My brother has quite a temper...Sorry for outing you Jayson.

Carlos

thejam

mr. mint is a zit on the hobby