1796 Draped Bust Large Cent - PO00.5 Condition -- Scan added!

itsnotjustme

My son has a near flat large cent.

On the obverse, you can read about half of liberty, 17 with relative ease, and 96 with the correct alignment of sun, moon, and incandecent light. The head is outlined from the lower neck to the top of the head. Essentially, the rest of the obverse is smooth. I can tell it is draped not capped bust by the hair profile near the word liberty.

On the reverse, it is just plain smooth. Not a detail to be found.

Both side have some porosity... I don't know how to describe the amount... it is multiple small craters.

What's the chance of this slabbing at PCGS?

Spooly

(some porosity... I don't know how to describe the amount... it is multiple small craters)

It's the porosity that gets these coins bagged at PCGS.

Does it look like this?

braddick

It won't slab. Now, if it was a 1796 quarter. . .

Russ

Or, anything like this?





Russ, NCNE

itsnotjustme

It's more worn than either of those. The color is pleasing chocolate brown. I tried scanning it, but it was too dark. On the obverse, the largest corrosion spot is about 2/3 the size of a letter or number on the obverse, and it is the only "big" spot. The porosity is much lighter than Russ' example, and comparable or slightly less bad than Spooly's (but Spooly's has a buried and cleaned appearance... this one is honest wear. Other than the slight pitting, the surfaces are smooth brown copper.

Spooly

All the PCGS PO-1, FR-02 coins I have have smooth surfaces. I would really need to see the coin to tell you if it would bag or grade.

itsnotjustme

Got it to scan better!

itsnotjustme

ttt

Conder101

I would probably have to have the coin in hand to actually track it down completely but I can tell you one thing, it is NOT a 1796 cent. The relative positions of the highest wave of hair and the R nad the Junction of hair and forhead compared to the T do not come close to any of the 1796 cent varieties.

Flash

Why would the amount of porosity in a copper planchet cause a coin to be bodybagged? If the planchet was porous prior to being struck, I fail to see how that would affect the coin's slabability. However, if the porosity was caused by some external condition, such as corrosion, then I could see why it would be bodybagged. I guess my real question is, what causes the porosity often found on these old coppers?

Flash

Cause of porosity on old coppers.. anybody?

itsnotjustme

OK, my eyes are going bleary looking at the coin, the scan, and pictures in Breens. I know for sure it's in the 1797-1799 range, and that it is a draped not capped bust. The facial profile has a distinct bend as you go up off the nose onto the forehead.

BigE

Flash, I think it might be that copper was a real commodity back then and private companies supplied the copper to the minters and might have cheated a little bit on the quality-----------------------------BigE

Spooly

However, if the porosity was caused by some external condition, such as corrosion, then I could see why it would be bodybagged. Yes, external conditions mixed with metal composition.

BigE

Brian, maybe send it to PCI first and see if they red or green label it and/or ASSIGN a date to it--------BigE

BigE

If it comes back graded, then send it to PCGS for a crossover, but whatever you do, dont crack it out first, lol----------BigE

Flash

private companies supplied the copper to the minters and might have cheated a little bit on the quality

Ok, then if that's the way the planchets were made to begin with, then why would porosity cause it to be bodybagged? Thats the way they were produced by the Mint.

BigE

You do have a point there-----------BigE

Conder101

I'll also add that it definitely isn't a 1799 either, again the HWH is not positioned properly under the R for that.