PCI Problem Labels. Kind of funny? Kind of sad!

braddick

"Environmental Damage"

Hmmm... That's what a recent Peacock Ike came back as. Beautiful toning- full peacock toned surfaces, now resting in a Red Label PCI MS61 holder...

Also- how about this? A VG08 Sacawagea, Red Label with "Artifical Wear" on the insert.

ARTIFICAL WEAR?! This is actually kind of a cool insert. Coin is problem free, other than the 'fake' wear...

Now, the real insult? Because I included two Canadian rainbow toned dollars (Specimen 68 and Specimen 69. I'm pretty happy with those two grades) I paid $16. per coin for the whole submission (three day turnaround).
Rounding out the submission was an 1807 Bust dime, with problems, AG03.

goose3

how about posting some pictures!?!?!?

Mark

Braddick:

I think we have all heard of artificial toning (AT) but artificial wear (AW) is surely novel. I wonder how PCI can tell AW from honest wear on, say, any coin dated prior to 1950? Do you suppose they have staff experts determining if wear is genuine wear or AW?

Mark

RotatedRainbows

You have to give them credit for that Sac because in reality they are correct, there is no way that coin could have acquired that much wear in such a short period of time in normal circulation. There is no doubt someone spent some time rubbing that piece (now who would do such a thing???????) to turn it into a VG.

coppercoins

Any chance that Sac dollar was struck through grease filled dies, or perhaps could be the result of a die trial strike? Of course without images it's impossible to tell, but being in a PCI slab, I wouldn't trust anything the label says.

KlectorKid

Even if some1 rubbed it it is still wear. but if some1 used a belt-sander i can see there point

airplanenut

I always wondered if PCGS would BB braddick's coins for that... then he'd be pissed!

braddick

<< <i>Even if some1 rubbed it it is still wear. but if some1 used a belt-sander i can see there point >>



No. That method (Dremel, et all) would then label the coin as either damaged or altered. Those ways don't work, no matter how I've tried to perfect it.
The "AW" is correct (real method under wraps)- the coin appears to have pleasant, warm, natural circulated surfaces- as if it HAD been in the hands of commerce for the last 30- 40 years.

I guess I shouldn't have used a 2002-D Sac.
(Lesson learned).

Oh, I also included that 1873-S Trade dollar that was highlighted here on a Thread about three weeks ago. It is 100% original and FA02 all day long but per PCI in their infinite wisdom and way of conducting business "gifted" me with an AG03 grade.

dorkkarl

ARTIFICIAL WEAR??? HAHAHHAHAHAHHHAHHAHAHHHHAAAAAAAHAHAHAHAH

that is THE FUNNIEST thing i've EVER HEARD!!! i guess they didn't want the distinction of having the lowest-graded sac in their plastic???

gawdam, i can't stop laughing!!! make it stop! make it stop!

whoooooooooo-wheeeeeeeee!!!

K S

keets

RR beat me to the post. it looks like you got nailed, pat!! they know that the coin arrived in it's state artificially and have designated it as such. no different than AT really.

al h.

dorkkarl

artificial grades, i guess???

STILL laughing!

K S

airplanenut

Putting a coin in an album will speed up toning but isn't artificial- how did you do it, Braddick? He could have done something that just sped it up...

RotatedRainbows

At least now we know what Braddick does all day while he is making posts on the board, typing with one hand and rubbing coins (inflicting artificial wear) with the other hand.

braddick

<< <i>RR beat me to the post. it looks like you got nailed, pat!! they know that the coin arrived in it's state artificially and have designated it as such. no different than AT really. al h. >>



I don't know. -I've got a PCGS VF20 2000 American Silver Eagle that says otherwise. . .

lordmarcovan

ARTIFICIAL WEAR.

ROTFLMAO. That's definitely a first. Sounds like they are hip to your game, braddick. No green label for you! Hahahahaha

...Wait a minute- they don't do the red/green labels anymore, do they? Now the labels are gold. Wassup wid dat? Do they not have a color code anymore?

Oh. You said they still do red labels. What about problem-free coins? Are those the gold labels?

A guy can ask for something so simple as a measly VG08 on a modern coin, but PCI will find a way to disappoint every time.

braddick

Lordmarcovan- Right! And that's the 'sad' part of this all.
I mean, come on PCI! I paid the full price on these. Three-day grading and all!

Throw me a peacock every now and then and a measily VG Sac.
It's not like I'm asking for the world

keets

I don't know. -I've got a PCGS VF20 2000 American Silver Eagle that says otherwise. . .

all that means is that PCGS missed the boat on that coin. don't read too much into this, but an eagle of any date in VF should be a tipoff to some kind of hanky-panky!!

al h.

airplanenut

<< <i> It's not like I'm asking for the world >>



Good- is it still available? I'm interested- send me a PM

Conder101

I'm not sure what is going on with PCI and the red borders, I keep getting conflicting reports. So far I have been told that the red borders have been discontinued, that they are the same as before with no change, and that they have a wide red border like the wide gold border. So far I have not seen any coins that I KNOW were recent submissions to PCI in a red bordered slab of any kind, and awhile back shortly after PCI changed hands we were seeing many coins with obvious cleaning and damage in gold bordered slabs. So has anyone sent anything to PCI recently that came back in a red bordered slab? By recent I mean in the last two or three months. If so I need good scans of both sides of the slab so I can see if it differes from the pre-March 2002 red bordered slabs.


Braddick, how about your Peac ock? When was it sent in?

airplanenut

Conder- why don't you retool a cleaned and corroded copper? Send it to PCI and hope they notice it is slightly damaged...

baccaruda

Putting a coin in an album will speed up toning but isn't artificial- how did you do it, Braddick? He could have done something that just sped it up...


i'd use a rock tumbler loaded with jean material and dimes.

braddick

Conder101- Yes- these were sent in about a week and a half ago using PCI's "3-day" grading tier.
The Red Label coins (I got three back in this batch) are the same as before, only the font is updated- as well as the Gold Label (but, you already knew that).

B- Rock tumbler filled with dimes and bits of denim?
Cool. I haven't tried that yet. Don't the coins get banged up pretty good though? Lots of nicks and marks?

Russ

baccaruda,

Thanks for the tip. The 2002 silver SQ's in my pocket have been making almost no progress.

Russ, NCNE

Conder101

Braddick,

You mention an updated font, they changed the font after the first sale of PCI in Sept of 2001, has it been changed again since the March 2002 sale? Basicly since it seems that have continued to use the red borders I now have to see if there is any way to tell the pre March sale slabs from the post March sale slabs. Can I get some really good scans of both sides of one?

Airplanenut,

I don't use the services. I am strongly anti-grading service, As such why should I submit when there are thousands of collectors who WANT to submit and are going to do so. I just need information about their results.

airplanenut

Conder- I thought that you had one of each type of slab, thus if you didn't have a red slab it might be cheap enough to just submit a coin to "make" the slab for your collection- I fully understand your against the slabbing companies idea (just ironic with what you research )

Conder101

No I don't have all of them, I still lack about 60 varieties in the reference set and and I have pictures of all but about 20 of them. I won't try and make a PCI red because like you say they should be available. I do admit though that I am finally having to break down and make two SEGS varieties that I haven't had any luck acquiring, a SEGS gold and a SEGS Sovereign. Trying to find a cheap gold coin in a SEGS is an oxymoron. They are all better dates or grades of US gold meaning about a minimum of $150 just to get that holder. So I bought the cheapest foreign gold coin I could and I'm getting one made for about $40. On the Sovereign series slab I had never even seen one until two weeks ago. After over two years of looking I'm giving up and making one for $25.



<< <i>(just ironic with what you research ) >>


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