1868 cent

mids1999

Can someone please guess a grade on this 1868 cent for me please.
I am thinking of submitting it if it is worth over $100
Front
Back

Thankyou
Mike

Placid

MS-65 bn

numobri

I think it's been cleaned.Not sure of grade,looks nice,but will it slab?

MastaHanky

I'm assuming those spots that you say aren't there aren't really there.

I think it looks like a solid 64 with a shot 65. It looks like there's a tiny bit of red left along some of the rims, but nowhere near enough to warrant a RB designation. Still a very attractive coin. I think when I start an Indian cent collection, I'm going to be going for all brown cents, and one like this would fit nicely.

Cam40

I hate to say it but it looks like some old cleaning residue on the reverse.

...I wonder if NCS could fix this and possibly bring it to a RB also?

NCS is a curating service that can help restore certain coins,if they meet qualifications.
I bet they probably turn down more coins than they take in.
I think the IHC you have may pass and get the treatment,but I cant say for sure.
I see no wear at all.
I,ve seen BN 63-64s before.This could be one of them I think.

lordmarcovan

Looks nice to me. How can those white spots not be there? Have they been cleaned off, or something?

Grade? Gee, I dunno. Certainly it looks worth submitting to me, though- it's definitely worth more than a hundred bucks, whatever the case- even if it's AU- and it certainly looks a helluva lot better than AU.

If you think there is any chance it might have been cleaned, perhaps ANACS would be a better service to submit it to than PCGS or NGC- that way, you wouldn't blow your submission fees on an ungraded coin that comes back in a bodybag. Better an ANACS net grade than a bodybag- at least you get a holder out of the deal, then.

Maybe it's because I am not used to seeing such sharp detail on an 1860's-era bronze Indian, but could this perhaps be a toned proof, guys? I'll be the first to admit my inexperience, there. That might account for the somewhat different coloration? Heck, I don't know.

Placid

This is a proof.

mids1999

On my cent there is much more red then the scan shows and I think the spots are in the scanners glass.

Cam40

Thats excellent advice.PCGS and NGC would surely bodybag it.
ANACS would slab it as-is,and net it AU55-58,if it shows signs of old cleaning.
Or if not found to be cleaned,its a MS64 easy,IMO

mids1999

so what could this coin be valued at?
Looking just for a ballpark figure.

mids1999

oh and btw the white stuff on the back of the cent is not there either. My scanner just dont like coins.
Maby I should try to get a pic of it with the digicam.

Placid

$300+ if it has not been cleaned. I don't see why other's think it has been myself.

DCAMFranklin

Mike-
A very attractive coin. I have to tell you the coin shows very dark on my monitor. Personally, I can't see enough detail to accurately determine a cleaning. If you don't know the history or pedigree of the coin, then the likelihood of a cleaning is probably pretty good. Were I in your shoes, I would definitely submit the coin for certification and I would go to ANACS, just in case. I hope you will let the Forum know of your results. Give us a scan of the coin in its new pretty holder! Good luck!

mids1999

heres pics taken with my digicam. Shows better color accuracy.
the cent is inside a 2x2.


Front
Back

numobri

Very nice looking,but still looks cleaned,go with ANAC for grading.Sorry,i my be wrong,i'm not a pro.

mids1999

would the color shown make the coin a rb?

MastaHanky

I still don't think it looks cleaned. Copper usually takes on a very unnatural color after it has been cleaned, and your coin doesn't show it at all. With the newest picture, I think it could easily pull an RB designation, probably in the MS64 area. Very nice looking coin!

lordmarcovan

Man, that's weird how the white stuff shows in the scanner pictures, but not the others. The way the white areas are obviously in the recessed areas of the coin makes me think that there must be something there that is not visible to the naked eye, maybe- scanners are funny about picking things like that up. What's that little "pimple" on the nose? Looks like there are other bumps, too, like one might see on an electrotype. (Not that I am suggesting that this is an electrotype).

Nice looking piece, for sure. It doesn't look cleaned to me in the camera shots, but I am sometimes a poor judge of that, at least when looking at pictures.

mids1999

I am gonna take a chance and send it to anacs and see what they do.
I would send it to pcgs but I dont want the $35 bodybag.
My grandfather had that coin for a long time well over 50+ years according to my father.

The coins I have been asking about were recently given to me by my grandmother after my grandfathers passing.
My grandfather was a collector from way back.
I get to pick the coins I want to keep and she wants me to sell the rest going 50/50 on the money from the sales.

BigD5

That seems like a nice coin. I'm not sure if there's enough red to garner a red/brown designation, but it would be a brown coin that someone would jump all over to purchase. The pimple is probably from a rusted die. There are a few more in the headband too. The strike seems too sharp for an electrotype, to me. Electrotype's usually look unc., but only have au details as the strikes don't transfer fully. I don't see any signs of cleaning on this one, whatsoever. Remember all of the comments you are soliciting are from us going over the pics. That can be very tough to do.

mids1999

I understand the comments are only for the pics.
I am not going to hold anyone to a suggested grade
I appriciate the advice and opinions.

Does anyone know where I can get some web space?
5MB is not nearly enough for me.
I have to constantly delete stuff on my web space to make room for new stuff.

Thanks Mike

darktone

Hi Mike, the color looks good to me. I would think ms64 brown with a small chance of red/brown. Don't forget though that fifty years ago they cleaned coins also but I don't think it's a problem here though. Very nice coin. mike

MastaHanky

<< Does anyone know where I can get some web space? >>

I'm putting together a server that everybody will be able to use to host pictures. I'll hopefully have it up and running next week. That'll give you about 20 gig to store pictures on. I'll post more info when it's ready for use.

Pushkin

Looks fine to me - I don't think its been cleaned. ANACS is pretty easy on color designations for copper. I would guess it will come back MS- 63/64 RB.

You can always submit it to PGS (Pushkin's Grading Services), I can guarantee you MS-67 RD (for a double latte at Starbucks; throw in a raspberry pastry and it might go MS-68).

Nice coin. I like it.

Thank you for your attention. I just brushed the cat - anybody want some raw material for mattress stuffing?

shylock

Nice tough date IH. Appears to have a misplaced date (top of 8 or 6) in the denticles below the 8 & 6, take a closer look at that.

dorkkarl

grades ms-64+, a borderline gem imo. BN designation. looks original & well struck, which 1868 should be. call me crazy, but that coin must be around $1500!

btw, i think the whole "BN", "RB", "RD" thing is overrated. many times, a nice even BN coin looks better than a splotchy RB counterpart.

K S

Pushkin

I pretty much agree with Karl on the RB/BN designations. Aslo, there is so much variance among the grading services on RD/RB/BN its ridiculous. They are just all over the place on the color designation - and then there is the date issue. PCGS is much more lenient on older dates as to what they grade RD. Just give me great eye appeal.

As for NGC and ANACS on color - my experience is its a crapshoot (and I never make my point)

Anyway, I really like the 1868 - very nice coin.

Cam40

Submit to ANACS.If it comes back MSXX,it would be a good candidate for a crossover to PCGS plastic,If you prefered to have it holdered in the `better` plastic (PCGS).
Good luck .

mids1999

thank you for all the advice