List your Tips on Spoting Cleaned coins here....please

IndianHeadMan

Please list your tips if you have any.

dorkkarl

tips as in you don't ever want to buy a cleaned coin? or you are willing to buy them & are concerned w/ how much $ to take off?

K S

tjkillian

One way to tell is an old silver coin with no cartwheel effect, yet is bright white. Another is to look at the surfaces and if you see a lot of parallel, fine hairline scratches.

Tom

hughesm1

On lightly circulated silver coins that have been dipped/cleaned, look for a slight change of colour on the worn areas (on Bust halves it's easy to spot.)

IndianHeadMan

bump......... Tips on indentifing that a coin has been cleaned........ Thanks for you help

KlectorKid

look for dark spots around stars, dates or any place that is hard to get at with a brush.

Placid

If it's a picture I look for dark inside the letters like O and D and around the base of stars or outline if the figure while the rest of the coins surface is brighter.

In person lots of small hairline scratches on the surface.

airplanenut

Look for a coin in an ACG slab...

Dog97

Color is the first thing I notice on circs. No bright shiny silver color should be on original circs.
Stains or discolorations around the devices. Usually residue from cleaning agents or from toning that was removed.
Lackluster, i.e. shiny and reflective but no cartwheel effect in XF-MS. XF don't always show luster but AU should show some in the protected areas of the fields. These protected areas should have the cartwheel affect even though the fields normally don't.
If I haven't seen them already hairlines are the next thing I look for to tell cleaning. Some collectors confuse die polishing lines with cleaning hairlines but it's really easy to tell the difference. Die polish lines run ALL the way up to the design elements and not through them but cleaning hairlines stop short of meeting the design elements, leave a non hairlined area next to the elements then usually continue over the elements.
Things like this are almost impossible to see in a scan but very easy to see firsthand.

fcloud

Hair lines are tricky. A raised hair line is not from cleaning--it is in the die. An incuse (like very light scratches) are from cleaning. You need to be able to determine the difference, so you don't pass on a good coin in which you think is cleaned.

shylock

With copper the obvious either have an off-color pinkish tone, or a generic washed out gold look. Some comparisons. I've been fooled on well done work that retains its lustre yet still has coloring that just doesn't fit the chart. Example. Same coin, note the nic in O of ONE.

RGL

If it comes back in a little plastic baggy -- instead of plastic -- from PCGS, it may have been cleaned ... or perhaps not!

IndianHeadMan

Bump...... good thread thanks for the help

clackamas

On Lincoln cents look for coins that have a very uniform purple or muddy purple/brown over the entire coin. Some purple is OK, and is natural but it should start on the rim and rainbow over the coin. Of course if its pink its a dead give away that the coin is not original.

heavycopper

Be sure to look at a coin under a single point light source -1 light bulb. Fluorscent lights will hide hairlines. I got fooled once with a buffalo nickel under the wrong lighting. The cleaning was light and did not show up until I got home and examined it again. I returned it right away. Rotate the coin and look at it at different angles. This will help you pick up the hairline scratches from a cleaning. Then you should look at good coins to know when you see a cleaned one. I was offered an AU seated quarter. It looked good at first but had kind of a flat look to it. There were no luster flow lines under 10X power. I couldn't see hairline scratches but it had been cleaned. I show it to a dealer (former PCI grader)beside me and the first thing he said was that it had been cleaned.

wallstreetman

When it looks like wood and not metal!

tjkillian

Wallstreetman,

I have several indian cents with that woodgrain look, and I really like the look of them and they are NOT cleaned.

Tom

clackamas

Coins that show a wood grain are for the most part original. They may have been cleaned but just having a wood grain is not a sign that the coin has been cleaned. Espesially with early "S" mint lincolns. The alloy used on these coins was not mixed properly and the wood grain can and usually is wholly original. I like the look as well.

Loki

Here is a neat online brochure that NGC has on their site explaining and illustrating what to look for in spotting artificially-induced flaws (cleaning, whizzing, PVC damage, etc). Good reference.

Lakesammman

Agree with most of the above. The one exception is that die polish lines often do extend over the devices. I finally gave in and bought a binoc. microscope. It's amazing how many die polish lines extend into the extreme depths of the die - don't ask me why. The key on "lines" is raised vs. incuse, something I have a hard time seeing w/o the 'scope.

Have obtained a couple lights that Shylock turned me onto - will try to demonstrate the above and post a pic, if it works.

DHeath

No one said this, but all implied it. It is important to know what each coin's (year, branch) characteristic look and normal toning look like. Exceptional coins should always cause more careful scrutiny. If a particular coin should have satin fields, yet the one you're looking at is brilliant, or worse, flat then it probably has been cleaned. Many of the better doctors will enhance a dull surface with silicone spray, or other undetectable chemical that will temporarily improve luster. They still look funny. Early Washington quarters have many looks, and knowing a coin is altered requires some knowledge of the proper look for that coin. IMHO

goose3

enlarge the obverse picture!!!!!!!!!!! OUCH!!!!!!!!!!!!

shylock

Don Heath -- great point. With IH copper certain tones are common in different time frames, and I assume this is due to changes in the alloy quality. For example, an early 1890s thru 1909 P mint gem will often have a vibrant orange tone. Most of the MS66RD 1894s I've seen show this dramatically. If that same tone showed up on an early coin, whose gems are known to be more standard mint gold, it would raise an eyebrow. The 1880s IHs are known for their deeper colors, and many acquire nice bullet type toning around the rims. In certain dates in this decade a bright gold example would require a very close look.