Truly amazing detector find- grading/pricing opinions solicited (update: for sale on B/S/T now)
lordmarcovan
Posts: 43,530 ✭✭✭✭✭
A pal of mine found this 1798/7 S-152 cent just north of here on Sunday, and I got it from him in a swap (I gave up some gold, but consider myself to have gotten this coin for a song.) Sometimes some truly amazing Draped cents come out of the ground here, as long as they were in well-drained soil. I've only dug one Draped cent myself, but it was corroded into a brown slug, and only identifiable by Liberty's hair bow. (I have found one other large cent so far- an OK 1837- meaning I have actually found more colonial copper than I have US large cents). My buddy Billy, who found this, claims to have also gotten a nice 1775 British halfpenny from the same hole. Amazingly, Billy claims to have seen 1794-95 Liberty Cap cents in similar condition, found by someone else!
Anyway, I checked out the 1965 edition of Sheldon's Penny Whimsy to attribute this (our public library actually has a copy!), and am fairly comfortable with the S-152 attribution. The S-152 is the most common of the 1798/7 overdates, but all the overdates must be rare in high grade, as I see EF40 examples list for $3,500-4,000 ... and I personally would call this one an easy AU50! It would not slab at PCGS/NGC without bodybagging, I don't think, so it may go off to ANACS, if don't keep it raw.
What I am wondering is this: what do you suppose ANACS would net grade this thing at? I do think it would net grade for the little bit of porosity, but I've seen worse, and you have to admit this thing is incredible for something that lay buried in the dirt 200 years. I would love to hear opinions on this, particularly from EAC members. What would you grade it at, and what would a proper net grade be? I don't think a net grade of EF40 is too unrealistic. Am I dreaming, here?
I'd also be interested to hear what you think the coin's real-world value should be. If it net grades to EF40, say, does this really mean I have a $3,000+ coin? I don't want to count my chickens before they hatch. I'll probably sell the coin, but it is tempting to keep it, too.
Anyway, I checked out the 1965 edition of Sheldon's Penny Whimsy to attribute this (our public library actually has a copy!), and am fairly comfortable with the S-152 attribution. The S-152 is the most common of the 1798/7 overdates, but all the overdates must be rare in high grade, as I see EF40 examples list for $3,500-4,000 ... and I personally would call this one an easy AU50! It would not slab at PCGS/NGC without bodybagging, I don't think, so it may go off to ANACS, if don't keep it raw.
What I am wondering is this: what do you suppose ANACS would net grade this thing at? I do think it would net grade for the little bit of porosity, but I've seen worse, and you have to admit this thing is incredible for something that lay buried in the dirt 200 years. I would love to hear opinions on this, particularly from EAC members. What would you grade it at, and what would a proper net grade be? I don't think a net grade of EF40 is too unrealistic. Am I dreaming, here?
I'd also be interested to hear what you think the coin's real-world value should be. If it net grades to EF40, say, does this really mean I have a $3,000+ coin? I don't want to count my chickens before they hatch. I'll probably sell the coin, but it is tempting to keep it, too.
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Comments
Numismedia: $660 in F12, unlisted any higher
Red Book: $3,500 in EF40, unlisted any higher
Hmm.
I have less than $500 worth of swapping stock invested in the coin.
Can you get a brighter picture it's really dark.
The darker picture more accurately portrays the coin's color, but I suppose it could be hard to see on some screens.
The more qualities observed in a coin, the more desirable that coin becomes!
My Jefferson Nickel Collection
EF would be my guess.
Here is a link to a au not same date but same design the 1805.
Link
congratulations! i've owned a few 8/7, but never above about a fine.
just my opinions, but bottom line is that's a GREAT coin.
K S
LSCC#1864
Ebay Stuff
my hotels
Obscurum per obscurius
I do believe that it has a shot at AU50 based on details alone (aside from the net grading which would pull it down to VF or EF or whatever). But if the consensus so far is EF, so be it. I can't complain, really, even if it would grade EF and net down to VF... or even F15, maybe. Like I said, I got it for a song. My pal even mentioned that he would take me detecting on that site, maybe...
Anyway, thanks for the opinions- keep 'em coming.
Talk about pay dirt!!!
I just noticed a newly-cleared site around here today (road grading), that looks promising for digging some Victorian-era coinage at the very least. They have taken up the pavement and the top foot or so of subsoil of one lane of Highway 17 here in Brunswick; a stretch that runs right between a big Victorian house and the famous Lanier Oak, which is the tree that shaded the poet Sidney Lanier while he wrote The Marshes of Glynn in the 1870's. (The spot overlooks the marshes and Lanier Oak used to be at the water's edge. Now it is in a traffic island in the middle of Highway 17.)
I only have a limited opportunity, since there are big piles of fill dirt waiting to be pushed back on the site. I can't get out there until tomorrow night. I hope they haven't started repaving it by then. Around here, the window of opportunity is often quite narrow on construction projects (which are one of the best types of places to detect, because the dirt is laid bare and the top layer of modern trash is often scraped off.)
I believe it would net grade XF40 myself.These old coppers are given the benefit of the doubt,because of their age.I can almost make out the 8/7 without seeing it in person.Maybe it's wishful thinking and my hope your right.That would be a keeper.
Registry 1909-1958 Proof Lincolns
sincerely michael
Have I told you lately that I hate you?
Clark
this is the kind of thing people dream about finding...cool coin!
Ken
Neptune- I would recommend a solid middle-of-the-line machine by one of the big makers: White's, Fisher, Garrett, or maybe Tesoro. Minelab (an import from Australia) has good machines but they are quite expensive. I've used the same Garrett GTA-500 for ten years. It's beginnning to show its age and has always been "quirky", but I can't complain. It's paid for itself at least fourfold (and I found one thousand-dollar find with it, myself- see my eBay page for a few treasure tales and pics). That Garrett cost me $480 in 1992, but back then that was the cheapest computerized target ID machine on the market. Since then, target ID meters have become standard on all but the cheapest machines, and prices have come down. I really need to upgrade my machine (maybe to the White's Spectrum seen in ClarkOfKent's icon). Garrett Metal Detectors is based in your home state, as it happens, Neptune. If you are on a tight budget, a mid-line Bounty Hunter detector is OK- they are cheap but pack a lot of bang for the buck. I had a cheap $190 Bounty Hunter that sometimes used to outperform the $480 Garrett.
Billy found the big find using a Troy Shadow, apparently a bare-bones machine with no meter, made specifically for relic hunters. Troy detectors are a spinoff from Tesoro. Relic hunters care about one thing: depth. They dig practically every signal and usually shun meters and other fancy features on their detectors. (Coinshooters hunt more "civilized", trashy sites and really need a target ID meter- we are more selective in our targets. But the relic guys always seem to find the nicest coins.) Billy used an 11" searchcoil to go deep- as mentioned previously, these coins were at least 16 inches down, out of the range of most standard 8" searchcoils.
Clark- I would hate me, too.
To the top, so the Coin World reporter can find it.
BTW, I detected at the Lanier Oak site the other night.
You'll never guess what I found there...
Edit to add that the coin will be for sale on the B/S/T board (open for offers for a little while, anyway), before going to eBay.
Great find and great story!! The story makes the coin worth more in my opinion.
Tbig
Good luck!!
Tbig
<< <i>ANACs would probably call it au details and net it at vf-30 for planchet roughness. EAC guys would say ef40 details vf-20 for porisity on both sides. >>
Tbig, thanks. I would tend to concur with either of those opinions. I was hoping for a grade of "AU details, net EF40" (admittedly, a bit of a long shot), but realistically, I expected something closer to what you just said. In fact, the coin just returned from ANACS and I was disgusted with the grade they gave it. They netted it one grade for corrosion, as I had expected. What I did not expect was how low a "details" grade they assigned it, which resulted in an even lower net grade. (Absurd, in my opinion.)
They did confirm it as an S-152, however.
To top off my dissatisfaction, the 1775 British halfpenny that was found with this coin was returned from ANACS in my flip, as a no-grade, with the notation "Non-Valid Coin Type".
What the-? I have owned several 18th century Brit halfpennies in ANACS holders. Since when is that a "non-valid coin type"? The only thing I can figure is that ANACS thinks it is some Colonial issue like a Machin's Mills piece, though I believed it to be a standard BRITANNIA homeland issue. Maybe this is a blessing in disguise, as a lot of the contemporary counterfeit halfpennies can actually be worth more than the standard British issues of the same period, right? Maybe I need to pull Breen off the shelf tonight. I don't have any scans of the halfpenny, yet.