GOLD EAGLES CANT BE CALLED BULLION!

wallstreetman

Bullion has to be at least 99.5% pure, so how can Gold Eagles be refered to as Bullion?

kranky

Perhaps they don't meet the strict legal definition of "bullion", but it's a convenient term to use to differentiate them from coins. Would "Bullion Lite" be more suitable?

TheNumish

I think the definition of a gold bullion coin is anything that trades for less than a 15% premium over spot. I think the purity is secondary. Gold Eagles trade for about 3-4% over gold so they are considered bullion.

wallstreetman

Funny you should say differentiate from coins, just the opposite, they have to be refered to as BULLION COIN legally! Why? Because they are LEGAL TENDER! So I hope this answers the question as to whether these are coins or not!

jhar

Technically, I believe all Gold and Silver Eagles are considered Non Circulating Legal Tender. Not sure how that designation effects the Bullion definition.

jtryka

WSM, what got you all riled up on eagles today? If you look at it, the eagle bullion coin program is designed in such a way that you could say almost anything about it and be correct. Technically, the definition of bullion is uncoined metal generally in bars or ingots, without the necessity of being pure. I could give you 1.1111 ounces of 90% silver bullion, and that would be the same as giving you 1 ounce of .9999 fine silver. With eagles, they do meet the definition of coins in my opinion, even though they do not circulate. But they are considered bullion by the act of Congress that created them. Hence, whether you like it or not, if some President someday issues an executive order like FDR's of 1933, all your business strike eagles must be surrendered to the treasury regardless of the grade on the slab. Proof eagles are a different story as they are recognized as legitimate collector coins by the Mint and the legislation. By definition in the legislation, these coins have no collector value whatsoever, and represent only the bullion content as stated on their face. Though I believe that if gold was confiscated again, you might be better off spending them at face rather than being paid the official price of just over $42 an ounce. Are they coins? Yes. Are they bullion? Yes. No matter what side you take, you're right!

dbldie55

Bullion Coins For Investors -- Overview


American Eagle Bullion Coins

Congressionally authorized American Eagle Bullion coins provide investors with a convenient and cost effective way to add a small amount of physical platinum, gold, or silver to their investment portfolios. The American Eagle Bullion program was launched in 1986 with the sale of gold and silver bullion coins. Platinum was added to the American Eagle Bullion family in 1997. A bullion coin is a coin that is valued by its weight in a specific precious metal. Unlike commemorative or numismatic coins valued by limited mintage, rarity, condition and age, bullion coins are purchased by investors seeking a simple and tangible means to own and invest in the gold, silver, and platinum markets. American Eagle Gold and Platinum Bullion coins are available in four denominations: one ounce, one-half ounce, one-quarter ounce, and one-tenth ounce while the silver bullion coin is only available in the one ounce size. American Eagle Bullion Coins are not sold to the general public directly from the United States Mint. Rather, they are available through a network of distributors.


From the makers of the Eagles. They call them bullion!

ara

I agree with jtryka that technically the definition of bullion is uncoined precious metal generally in bars or ingots. One thing that I would add is that is has to be offially assayed to certify/guarantee its purity and actual precious metal content. In the case of bullion coins like the Krugerrand, Maple Leaf, Britannia, Onza, Angel, Noble, Panda, Eagle, etc., the issuing government or mint acts as the assayer certfying/guaranteeing the prurity and actual precious metal content of the coin.

pmh1nic

WSM

Where did you find this "technical" definition of bullion (99.5% pure)?

gemseeker

I thought bullion was something not sold by the US Mint?

jtryka

gem, bullion isn't sold by the US Mint, "Rather, they are available through a network of distributors."

presleyh

They are bullion because they contain a very definate measure of the metal. Exactly one ounce of .999 gold in the eagle. The purpose of modern gold coins is to allow you to invest in gold bullion at market price plus a mintage premium. You will win or lose with the world market. Although gold doenst easily tarnish, its value can drop like a rock. just like bullion.

coynclecter

Someone has confused the legal definition of "pure" with that of "bullion." Legally gold must be 99 and 44/100% gold to be called "pure gold" It can be called bullion if its value lies totally in the value of the metal. Considering the 4% premium which is a minting and delivery charge, eagles , legal tender or not, are worth thier weight in gold, nothing more.

Aslo , if they were intended to be used for commerce instead of being used as bullion they would not have been minted in exact fraction of an ounce. No circulating coin is.

wallstreetman

pmh 1nic, The Gold Guide from The World Gold Council! Glossary of Gold Terms:

Bullion: Refined Gold that is at least 99.5% pure, usually in the form of bars, wafers or ingots.

Bullion Coin: A legal tender coin whose market price depends on its Gold content, rather than its rarity or face value.

Looks to me that you cant call Gold Eagles Bullion, Silver and Platinum yes, Gold no!

wallstreetman

jtryka, When you go to cash in some Gold jewelry for its weight, your telling me the purity doesnt matter? Would I sell at $42? NO! Would I sell at face value? NO! Would I tell the Federal Govt where to go? YES!

RNCHSN

The face values given to the Eagle bullion coins was set dramaticly lower than the bullion value for a specific purpose. The coins are supposed to be a way for people to own silver, not meant to be circulated as currency.

If the silver Eagles were given a face value of $3.50 (randon number), and silver dropped to $3/oz., people would start turning them in for the $3.50 face value, thus they would in effect become circulating legal tender. The government gave them a legal tender value of $1 because they are confident that silver will NOT drop below that price level!

Steve27

"Legally gold must be 99 and 44/100% gold to be called "pure gold"..." I thought the only thing 99 and 44/100 pure was Ivory soap.

hookooekoo

Bullion Coin: A legal tender coin whose market price depends on its Gold content, rather than its rarity or face value.

Looks to me that you cant call Gold Eagles Bullion

???

These two statements seem to contradict each other.

Are not modern Gold Eagles...
...legal tender?
...a coin?
...price deends on its Gold content?
...are not "rare"?
...have a face value well below the value of the gold content?

This definition of "Bullion Coin" seems to scream that business strike Gold Eagles ARE bullion.

wallstreetman

hookooekoo, There is a difference between Bullion and Bullion Coin, according to these deffinitions, although I still think that you shouldnt be able to put the two words Bullion and Coin together after knowing Bullion has to be 99.5% pure. The word PURE can refer to pure(99.9/ 24KT) or a % of!

wallstreetman

I sure hope they start melting these coins! $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$..............................................................................................................................................................YOU WONT SEE ME TURNING MY GOLD IN LIKE ALL THE FOOLS THAT DID IN 1933!

cladking

"Bullion" is frequently used to refer to coined metal which has no value
over it's intrinsic value. Some of the eagles command much more than
their gold value, hence for this reason you can say they aren't "bullion".
"Coin" is just one more term we won't get agreement on. At least we
can agree that they are called eagles.