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Chris Porter from Superior
Davalillo
Posts: 1,846 ✭✭
Recently I made some comments that stated that before consigning vintage sportscards to an auction house that sellers should advertise that they are selling on the Set Registry Message Board to see if the set can be sold directly and thus avoid the 20% or more commissions that would occur.. This is particularly true with more recent lower dollar value material such as gaspipes 1969 collection, gemmint's kelloggs sale and more recently Carlos's material that is coming up for recent sale.
Coincidentally, all these were sold or will be sold through Superior. Somehow my comments were misconstrued as a knock on Superior. Nothing could be further from the truth. Out of all the major auction houses, I think Superior is the best to deal with and I would heartily recommend them to anyone putting high grade vintage material up for sale. In particular, I consider Chris Porter a first class guy to deal with and he has been very helpful in finding cards for my sets.
Coincidentally, all these were sold or will be sold through Superior. Somehow my comments were misconstrued as a knock on Superior. Nothing could be further from the truth. Out of all the major auction houses, I think Superior is the best to deal with and I would heartily recommend them to anyone putting high grade vintage material up for sale. In particular, I consider Chris Porter a first class guy to deal with and he has been very helpful in finding cards for my sets.
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I think some of the guys misunderstood your point on this. I read your thread and I for one think your thread was fine. All you wanted was for the guys on this board to prove they can step up to the plate when it comes to vintage or semi vintage cards. I still agree with your original point and also feel you did nothing wrong. Stay the course.
Dave
"Lower dollar value" ???
Gee, it must be nice to be in the stratosphere dealing with PSA 8 sets of 1952 Topps etc.
I'm sorry that you feel that the collections assembled by these guys do not meet with your assessment of what truly qualifies as "high dollar sets". I'm sure that they assembled them by going through the sofas looking for loose change.
Sorry, bad choice of words--how about " semi-modern material that is plentiful".
Stump,
I didn't think so either but Chris said he had gotten a few calls on it and the last thing I want is to have one of my major sources for vintage cards mad at me.
Davalillo
1969 and 1970 baseball cards are "semi modern material". Uh ok if you say so
Hey you're entitled to view, but it's a little insulting to the collectors here when you suggest that their '69 and '70 sets are semi modern.
A fellow '56 Topps baseball registree (is this a word?) has just decided to change direction and sell his set with only 80 cards to go. His set is all PSA 8 with 10 PSA 9's including some rare ones (Kluszewski, Red Sox Team, and Minoso).
Chris at Superior has offered to buy his partial set at 85% SMR. Not wanting to sell off individually on ebay due to time constraints (listing, mailing, etc.), do you think this is the best way to go? And do you think this is a fair offer?
I advised him to counter by offering the 8's only and selling the 9's individually, though Superior's offer may include these rarities.
By the way, I think your cutoff for modern/vintage is correct at the mid-sixties only due to the larger print runs that Topps made around that time.
Always looking for 1957 Topps BB in PSA 9!
Is your friend willing to take offers? Where can I see a list of what he has available? Is it listed on the registry?
Regards,
Alan
To regard 60's and early 70's material as modern or even semi-modern is ludicrous though it certainly eases the pain of the years marching on now that I am in my 50's.
Time marches on and accomodations must be made accordingly. One cannot live in the past, one must adjust and realize that there is a whole other universe that one may choose to, but cannot ignore. Nor
I'm sure that somewhere there is a collector of Plow candies, T-206's etc,. who regards Goudy's as modern junk. He probably still listens to wax cylinder recordings on his Edison and regards 78's and color TV's as a passing fads.
I agree. It's just that we humans have a necessity for categorization, sometimes for all the wrong reasons.
Beckett has already made its determination though only for purposes of narrowing the desired market interest and the thickness of its priceguide.
I would assume that in a decade or two, even cards through the early 80's will be deemed "vintage".
I would pay a premium to smr for all the 25 cards in 8 I am missing fromm the set. I woukld also pay a premium for the 9s or better. Have him call or contact me directly for these caqrds and I am sure Chris will make him an offer for the remainder.
Don't mean to offend anyone guys. If you want to call your late 60s and 1970s stuff vintage go right ahead. I did not realize calling these sets semi-modern was offensive in any way.
I like the 60s stuff and am trying to collect them all in 8 or better. Except for a few low pop cards, I would hope to be there by the end of 2003--we'll see.
Ed
I am sure he will listen to offers. In our emails, I have made him premium offer for the few that I need too.
He is on registry:
Jeff's set
Davalillo,
if you post your contact info, I will inform him to check out this post. Thanks.
Thank you--I contacted him. Appreciate your help.
Davalillo
I won't say whether altogether I got what I felt what the cards were worth. My point is that after essentially doing as you said, I feel like I could very probably have gotten more money - for less work and hassle - had I elected to go with Superior or another auction house.
I think there are too many factors involved to say there's a "right" or "wrong" way of parting with a set. I'll be watching Carlos' 72 set closely with the wish that he makes out better than I did. But I disagree with calling either approach "right" or "wrong" just out-of-hand.
Mike
Good point. You may not believe this but I would have paid smr or close to it for your set--same thing with Carlos. My point is first advertise on registry for sale of whole set. If no takers, then can go to Superior. I think if you have in mind a certain price and someone is willing to meet that on the registry, why go to an auction house? Is someone really likely to pay 20% or more than your price by listing it with Superior???
Davalillo
Perhaps my earlier response did not make it clear that I posted here with intent to sell immediately upon choosing to break the set.
Mike
My impression was that by the time I heard that you were selling your set that you were already selling it in pieces. I know I did not hear sale of 1972 psa 8 set, nearly complete, intact.
Davalillo
In fact. . .on June 23, I posted to the Vintage Sportscard Trading Forum letting people know that I still had 466 PSA8s and another 37 PSA7s remaining - and even offered them as a bulk lot. Link to thread Got ZERO responses from that.
At the end of July, I still had nearly 400 PSA8s remaining. Since noone had inquired about any of them in nearly a month, I put 120 or so up on eBay. The remaining 270 or so were later sold as part of a private sale.
At this point, I can only wonder why I never heard anything from you if you were seriously interested.
Mike
I have read most of these Auction House threads and decided not to responed (until now). I feel no one has attack Chris Porter or myself directly but IMHO the overtone is there.
I chose Superior to sell my collection for many reasons, but watching the work that Mike put into his sales convinced me that an Auction House would be the best because I want the entire collection sold not just some of it. Mike sent out mass emails, listed his cards on his web site, posted the sale on this board, and even went the way of eBay. As he stated...After all that he still had a lot of cards remaining. As I stated before I tried many different routes to sell everything all at once, and I even emailed Davalillo my home phone number so he could call me to discuss the sale (I must add he said he never received this email although I didn't know that at the time, I just thought he wasn't interested.)
A lot goes into selling nearly 3000 PSA graded cards. The shipping supplies alone are bothersome, not to mention emails, post office, feedback, listing, packaging, post office, non payers, questions, post office, scans, descriptions, and did I mention the POST OFFICE.
When I called Chris at Superior, he was professional and polite. He drove to Ohio to pick up my cards (Saved me the shipping cost) and treated me like his number customer (Which I assume he does with everyone).
Superior offers a MONTH LONG ad campaign, and a nice catalog and web site. They accept bids via the internet, telephone, fax, email, and good old fashion snail mail. This is much more exposure then eBay or anything that I could do on my own without spending a ton of money.
To me the formulation is simple...If you were interested in buying a 1970 set for $11,500, you can with a private seller or an Auction House.
If you bid $10,000 + (15% fees) = $11,500 Or buy it directly from a pivate seller for $11,500...Same Out-Of-Pocket expence.
I really don't want to make waves here but I just don't understand why this is such an issue. I didn't call Chris about this but I did feel Superior was getting a bad rap. I also know that, because I'm selling cards on Superior right now, I may be a little defensive. However, I doubt it.
Carlos
I must have missed it. I was on vacation 6/22-7/7 and did not read message board regularly. I do not dispute anything you said--I'm sure you are right--I just missed it.
Carlos,
I am sure you will do well with Superior as they are a first class outfit. I will probably be bidding on a lot of your stuff and you have promised me first crack at some other of your stuff. So, good luck and sorry our communication got fouled up prior to your decision to use Superior.
Davalillo
One other thing I just noticed--maybe I am missing something but I never read the Vintage Sportscard Trading Forum.
Davalillo
Regards.
I will do a better job next time. I have some nice cards put away and will make a decision in January if I'm going to sell or not.
Carlos
After reading the earlier threads containing your comments about Gaspipes sale of his 69's and Carlos upcoming sale of this sets i can certainly see how someone could feel you were bashing superior and other auction houses. Not bashing their service but certainly their usefullness in obtaining maximum sale results for your cards.
Your offers to buy these cards often sound like johynny come lately offers . for example with Gaspipes sale right after he listed with superior you said he should of contacted you first. Then after the Superior sale ended you said i would of paid that much but you didnt want to pay the 15%. then in an earlier thread i read your comments concerning Carlos upcoming sale from superior . that you would of purchashed his sets. He contacted you directly and you replied that you didnt want them (later saying you meant you didnt want all of them). As for Mike's sale of his 1972's it was well publicised on these boards and if im correct he even had discounts for multiple purchases on his website.
Im thinking that instead of chastizing some peoples methods for selling step up to the plate and buy them so i dont have to read after their sold or sent to superior that you would buy them
It's no secret that I buy and sell sets as well as collect for myself. I offered my 60 FB set at less than SMR to Davalilo some time ago which was #1 on the registry at the time with several 1/1 PSA 9's etc. He emailed me back stating that he would prefer to pick and choose. Fair enough, but I chose to pass and sold the set elsewhere on a phone call for more.
I also purchased the 1972 lot from Castaldi as well as several other sets from board members.
So, as it seems to be fashionable in saying to all those sets that I didn't buy or that I was even offered, or those I didn't even know were for sale. "Gee I'd have paid more"
Would you like me to provide you with a list of all that I have bought this year?? Step up to the plate--are you kidding?? It would come off wrong if I told you what I spent this year and how often I have stepped up to the plate but if you really want to know or want a list of large lots I have bought, I will be happy to provide it to you. Certain of these lots were going to go to Mastro or Superior if I did not buy them.
Its hard to step up to the plate when you read about that it is already listed with Superior.
Lastly, I am not bashing Superior or others. I just want to buy the sellers stuff at a better price for me(and him). For those of you not paying attention, I said that offer it to set registry members first and if nobody responds then go to Superior. For something that could benefit everyone--particularly other registry members, I am amazed at the reaction of you and a couple of others.
Davalillo
You are correct. I will not bid on everything. I am submitting an ungraded 1960 set at Ft. Washington that should get a few 9s with most of the rest 8s, so I wanted to see the results of this first.
Davalillo
No doubt in my mind that you have made several large purchases in the last year . Your collection is truly remarkable.
My point is this if i was selling my cards through superior . the last thing i want to do is sign on to the registry boards and see that you have written you should of sold to me or in Bob's case you said it likely will sell for a certain price. There is no 100 % absolute correct way to maximize your return every time. but im guessing that selling through superior rather than you directly would likely be better for the seller more than 75 % of the time
I was just tired of reading after the fact especially after Carlos listed i would of purchased them
Many people may even question your methods for upgrading & downgrading your sets. For example giving up 1951 Bowman PSA 9 1of1's . and then taking that money to grade your so called modern sets " 1969 etc.
You may be right on your last point--Hard to say--but I think there is a price for everything and $3,500 for a common psa 9 1/1 seemed like a great price.
Plus, my goal is to build psa 8 and better sets. I am not out to compete to build the single best set in any year--simply at the end of the day--I am aiming at having 75-100 sets complete in psa 8 or better--maybe more.
Thanks for the good wishes Zardoz.
Everything you have said makes perfect sense. I don't understand the confusion. I posted my 69 set for sale on these boards and received several offers for pieces of the set and 1 offer for the whole. I kept the set intact and sold it as a whole. I was pleased with my results of offering for sale on these boards first. If you have a willing buyer and seller who can agree on a price then why pay an auction house? I don't consider that a slam against superior, mastro, or anybody else in the business. You made me an offer on my 65 set and I hedged on it - not you. I know that you aren't just throwing around words. But saying that folks should contact you first doesn't mean that you should buy every set that comes available. Good luck with completing your 1960's sets by next year.
Wayne
<< <i>There is no 100 % absolute correct way to maximize your return every time. but im guessing that selling through superior rather than you directly would likely be better for the seller more than 75 % of the time. >>
If you are talking about complete/near sets, then I would disagree. (If he needs the set...of course)....Davalillo will pay right around SMR and in some cases above it.
John
Buck
I can't get the link in the bottom to work. the site is www.robs61topps.com
Bob-gaspipe26
Your comments make me feel a little better about my decision.
Carlos