steroids -- a whole new take

olb31

no

craig44

I have come to the point in the journey that I really do not care if a player used steroids/hgh/ped etc. we will NEVER know the full extent of it and who really did or did not. they all had access. I believe that many more used than we would ever imagine. it wasnt even against the collectively bargained rules until 2006

by the way. you can bet your bottom dollar that the PED "era" has never ended. the guys today are doubtlessly using PED. they are certainly new designer stuff that they dont even have tests for yet.

players have always looked for an advantage. from the begining and they always will.

olb31

>

JoeBanzai

@olb31 said:

@craig44 said:
I have come to the point in the journey that I really do not care if a player used steroids/hgh/ped etc. we will NEVER know the full extent of it and who really did or did not. they all had access. I believe that many more used than we would ever imagine. it wasnt even against the collectively bargained rules until 2006

by the way. you can bet your bottom dollar that the PED "era" has never ended. the guys today are doubtlessly using PED. they are certainly new designer stuff that they dont even have tests for yet.

players have always looked for an advantage. from the begining and they always will.

no question, too much money involved. My point kind of hinges on the effectiveness of roids on general health for dudes like you and me right now. How good are they us? There was such a clamor not to take them, they made them sound like poison. However my research showed just the opposite.

You do realize most of these guys are taking WAY TOO MUCH for their bodies to handle long term, don't you?

Here's some of the side effects of using steroids improperly;
Large male breast development
Disease of the liver or spleen
High blood pressure
Increased cholesterol
Blood clots
Heart disease, and of course "roid rage"

Nobody cares about cheating anymore. Sounds like you guys actually ADMIRE guys breaking the rules. Great.

I was brought up in the dark ages. I learned that if you have to cheat to win, you didn't really win. Today's attitude is; if your not cheating, your not trying.

As far as LEGAL use of steroids are concerned, I am currently under a doctor's care for low testosterone and have a prescription for it and get monitored regularly.

YOU WOULD NOT BELIEVE HOW GREAT THIS STUFF IS!

I'll be 69 this summer and I feel at least 10 years younger! My energy is much better but my pain is also greatly diminished. Believe me, by the time your in your 60's (earlier for many) you will most likely be in constant pain to some degree. My shoulders are worn out from work, lifting weights as a young man and throwing baseballs and other objects. That shoulder pain is greatly diminished with my twice a month testosterone injections.

In Canseco's first book, he says steroids should be part of our long term medical treatment, but only under a doctor's care.

I agree.

olb31

no

lahmejoon

Why can't you name them?

olb31

no

Crashingwaves

If the steriods were taken to help heal an injury faster and get the player back in the game quicker and healthier, I am all for it (assuming under a doctors supervision). Or... just like the SNL skit, have the all drug olympics

JoeBanzai

@Crashingwaves said:
If the steriods were taken to help heal an injury faster and get the player back in the game quicker and healthier, I am all for it (assuming under a doctors supervision). Or... just like the SNL skit, have the all drug olympics

That's what McGwire said he was doing. It was an accident he gained 40 lbs of muscle.

JoeBanzai

@olb31 said:
yeah i said moderate or prescribed amounts. Wonder if it works as good as the 2 2020-2022 drugs that were supposed to be bad for you but weren't.

It's hard to discuss when you aren't telling us what your referring to!

1982FootballWax

@JoeBanzai said:

@Crashingwaves said:
If the steriods were taken to help heal an injury faster and get the player back in the game quicker and healthier, I am all for it (assuming under a doctors supervision). Or... just like the SNL skit, have the all drug olympics

That's what McGwire said he was doing. It was an accident he gained 40 lbs of muscle.

He's not here to talk about the past.

Apparently the Roids make one gutless

lahmejoon

olb31

no

bgr

Considering every rigorous study on those drugs found negative or null benefit you might try sodium hypochlorite. Can you drink it? I don't know? Can you? Hrm. Not sure? It's used for cleaning... so? Probably.

olb31

no

CardGeek

My understanding is that they didn't want baseball to become a contest of who can take the most steroids.

When players trying to play a fair game have to compete with people who are willing put their health on the line to hit a little better, it creates a downward spiral.

Back in the 80s and 90s there were tons of stories about the health risks of steroids. When Lyle Alzado got sick, from my perspective, it kind of sparked the whole anti steroid discussion. He's just the highest profile one I know of. I believe there were a lot of cases like that though.

olb31

no

olb31

no

2014bestservice

Steroids, whether natural or synthetic, are desiged to assist weakened immmune systems. Healthy people should never take = doctor care or not.

My own healthy idiot brother took under a doctors care = yeah big boy was the result. Turned his Ectomorph body into a mesomorph look. Years later - think he was 35, Suffered Heart attack #1 caused by enlarged heart = traced back to usage. Suffered 2 more heart attacks then got open heart surgery. Worth it ???

Victor Terra. Former Mr Universe. Dated my twin sister. They broke up early 90's. In 1994 he went to prison for distributing. Worth it?

I"d ask if heart attacks and prison are worth it to look good, but its obvious the answer to too many people has been yes.

Let them use. All the major sports have kept every dishonest record on the books and have never done anything worth a crap to change it. Still in the record books. No awards taken. No records stricken. No bans given. No wins vacated or championships given back for other cheaters. No owners or commisioners taken to task for employing them

Every sports already got the sneaky users in anyways, mind as well open it up for the actual outed ones. They've been publicly humiliated, live with the resultant damage to their bodies, and already have the cheater label.

CardGeek

When I was a kid Greg Lemond was the greatest American Cyclist of all time. Then came Lance Armstrong. Now nobody knows who Greg Lemond was.

Groo

@olb31 said:

Keep posting thinly veiled politics and a suspension may be brewing.

olb31

2

olb31

t

1982FootballWax

olb31,

1) From which University is your Medical Degree?

2) Which State(s) have issued you a Medical License?

olb31

@1982FBWaxMemories said:
olb31,

1) From which University is your Medical Degree?

2) Which State(s) have issued you a Medical License?

LOL!!! hard for you to have a discussion constructively, huh.

where do you play college ball at?

or maybe you played in the pros?

because if you didn't -- don't talk about sports anymore, theres no way you can know anything about it unless you actually played.

bgr

whether you have a degree in anything matters little if you can't make a proper argument. I mean... I know stupid doctors so they exist too.

1982FootballWax

Huge diff between giving opinions on Sports/Cards and in effect offering Medical Advice.

OLP wont agree with that but my guess is good folk here will.

olb31

@1982FBWaxMemories said:
Huge diff between giving opinions on Sports/Cards and in effect floating Medical Advice. OLP wont agree with that but by guess is good folk here will.

i guess your answer is that you have never really played ball.

bgr

as they say..

knife, cracker, arrow.

Seaverfan

Just for clarity...

Mark McGwire (R) 1985- 21 years old, 220 lb, 1995 31 years old 245 lb (+25lb)

Vlad Guerrero (R) 1995- 19 years old, 158 lb, 2005- 29 years old, 238 lb (+80 lb); HOF 2018

Derek Jeter (R) 1993- 19 years old, 170 lb, 2003 29 years old, 195 lb (+25 lb): HOF 2020

olb31

@Seaverfan said:
Just for clarity...

Mark McGwire (R) 1985- 21 years old, 220 lb, 1995 31 years old 245 lb (+25lb)

Vlad Guerrero (R) 1995- 19 years old, 158 lb, 2005- 29 years old, 238 lb (+80 lb); HOF 2018

Derek Jeter (R) 1993- 19 years old, 170 lb, 2003 29 years old, 195 lb (+25 lb): HOF 2020

Look at ohtani from his 2018 cards until now. They all do it. Always have have or at least since the 60's and early 70's. Just different forms and different dosages.

I removed my posts above because I knew there would be people who can't really have discussions outside the box and want to threaten political discord. Have a great day everyone..

1982FootballWax

@Seaverfan said:
Just for clarity...

Mark McGwire (R) 1985- 21 years old, 220 lb, 1995 31 years old 245 lb (+25lb)

Vlad Guerrero (R) 1995- 19 years old, 158 lb, 2005- 29 years old, 238 lb (+80 lb); HOF 2018

Derek Jeter (R) 1993- 19 years old, 170 lb, 2003 29 years old, 195 lb (+25 lb): HOF 2020

The following is NOT medical advice or fact merely my own personal occurrence and observation

I would have thought McGwire was a bunch more weight than that. Based on those numbers McGwire and Jeter seem totally congruent with age. I was 140 my senior year of high school, when I was 27 I was 180 (+40LB) - it wasn't 'roids or cheeseburgers it was simply filling out.

Vlad really sticks out, an 80LB differential seem like either 'roids and or cheeseburgers

JoeBanzai

@1982FBWaxMemories said:

@Seaverfan said:
Just for clarity...

Mark McGwire (R) 1985- 21 years old, 220 lb, 1995 31 years old 245 lb (+25lb)

Vlad Guerrero (R) 1995- 19 years old, 158 lb, 2005- 29 years old, 238 lb (+80 lb); HOF 2018

Derek Jeter (R) 1993- 19 years old, 170 lb, 2003 29 years old, 195 lb (+25 lb): HOF 2020

The following is NOT medical advice or fact merely my own personal occurrence and observation

I would have thought McGwire was a bunch more weight than that. Based on those numbers McGwire and Jeter seem totally congruent with age. I was 140 my senior year of high school, when I was 27 I was 180 (+40LB) - it wasn't 'roids or cheeseburgers it was simply filling out.

Vlad really sticks out, an 80LB differential seem like either 'roids and or cheeseburgers

McGwire always had a fat a$$ and average shoulders. Maybe he just had liposuction on his but and then injected into his shoulders.

bgr

so... what was this thread about then? wow.

1982FootballWax

@bgr said:
so... what was this thread about then? wow.

Mark McGwire had a big ol' butt

lahmejoon

@2014bestservice said:
Steroids, whether natural or synthetic, are desiged to assist weakened immmune systems. Healthy people should never take = doctor care or not.

>

I"d ask if heart attacks and prison are worth it to look good, but its obvious the answer to too many people has been yes.

.
I think of all the wrestlers I grew up watching. Most of these guys don't make it past 70. While there are many instances of drug overdose, there are quite a few that succumbed to heart attacks or heart failure at relatively young ages. I'd have to think steroid use had a role to play:

Macho Man
Ravaging Rick Rude
Roddy Piper
Ultimate Warrior
Eddie Guerrero
Big Boss Man
Davey Boy Smith

CardGeek

What if you don't mind dying before 70 if you're remembered as a sports hero?

lahmejoon

@CardGeek said:
What if you don't mind dying before 70 if you're remembered as a sports hero?

LOL, I guess shoot up, then. But, in the wrestler list, quite a few of these guys were much younger. I wouldn't want to croak at 38, which in my case, would mean I'd have been dead for quite a few years now.

Macho Man - 58 years
Ravaging Rick Rude - 40 years
Roddy Piper - 61 years
Ultimate Warrior - 54 years
Eddie Guerrero - 38 years
Big Boss Man - 41 years
Davey Boy Smith - 39 years

mnkevin

@lahmejoon said:

@2014bestservice said:
Steroids, whether natural or synthetic, are desiged to assist weakened immmune systems. Healthy people should never take = doctor care or not.

>

I"d ask if heart attacks and prison are worth it to look good, but its obvious the answer to too many people has been yes.

.
I think of all the wrestlers I grew up watching. Most of these guys don't make it past 70. While there are many instances of drug overdose, there are quite a few that succumbed to heart attacks or heart failure at relatively young ages. I'd have to think steroid use had a role to play:

Macho Man
Ravaging Rick Rude
Roddy Piper
Ultimate Warrior
Eddie Guerrero
Big Boss Man
Davey Boy Smith

You can't forget two of the Twin Cities' best wrestlers ever -
THE ROAD WARRIORS - HAWK and ANIMAL
Both gone too soon also

olb31

those dudes partied hard too.