1975 Bob Gibson HL PSA 8
jackstraw
Posts: 3,863 ✭✭✭✭
I have been looking for a nicely centered 8 for a year now but this one seems over graded? I love the almost perfect centering but each corner is dinged, bent and rounded.. I also love this guys scanner! I wish PSA scanned like this 
https://www.ebay.com/itm/227184993383?_skw=1975+gibson+psa&epid=10055941836&itmmeta=01KJTMHQSZ63JJHFZCXT8XD9XY&hash=item34e547e467:g:CLEAAeSwo-RpcpDH&itmprp=enc:AQALAAAA8GfYFPkwiKCW4ZNSs2u11xBccM0I27ZVMGUOiE3uwc60tqnfMX0aGD2dAaJQk6Xu9DWliFNuC5z0seLaOqWp024Qo/leL+WGSwMRLo88YI+hlLPpIfb+/KmCmQs+GdSl2oR7C/Nvoksev4378W1xQB74qVrpBdEb+WkZi4GTucITsjY41zNw3L0LPv5G63bnqdaeJHfI3A2JHr3JQROJolkKuQst4mk3AlGeVehUteKfbtEZsFq7R+x2MhUQoREdSuHQ2D+UiOx2tYmln4XY0Gw86FdTnAM7YKntXHEVkBLUxcZkFqOjfZwMHnkPKDF5ug==|tkp:Bk9SR579xtSWZw
Comments
That is definitely over graded.
Ouch. Looks like a 3. The slab does not appear to have been tampered with because I don't see any frosting on the edges. Not sure why it would grade so high.
buying O-Pee-Chee (OPC) baseball cards
also collecting US & Canadian silver coins
Im guessing the case is fake.
This is good that we will never know.
Worst 8 I have ever seen. Most likely a 4SC submission.
Shouldn't this card have a PSA scan in the system? It is a current holder. I temporarily registered the cert number in my set to check the PSA scan but one did not appear next to the card. It's very strange. Not a surprise but the cert number does align to the Bob Gibson HL card.
No, they hadn’t started with the routine scans yet at this cert number. I think it was somewhere around 80 or 90.
Case was popped open, card replaced. Dealer probably took it on consignment or doesn't care. Almost exclusively a Pokemon card dealer.
That's not the card that was originally holdered or it's a mechanical error. Either way, the cert number should be deactivated.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
That looks like a tampered holder/card switcheroo to me.
Steve
That's not even Pro 8. That's a Pro 7.
You old timers will get it!
Shane
Yeah, that is definitely not legit lol
honest question here. I am not seeing any frosting on that case to indicate tampering. is there some other way to tell if a case has been tampered with?
there is no way that is an 8. or even close. possibly a fake case?
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
Same. I can't figure out how the case was tampered with. I'm grateful to the folks on the board who know and can point out evidence of tampering.
buying O-Pee-Chee (OPC) baseball cards
also collecting US & Canadian silver coins
The upper right portion of the case has a section above the grade and serial number which appears slightly milky. That's quite likely where a sharp object was used to pry it open. Also top center shows similar damage. The entire periphery of the holder looks like it was reattached.
I see a little something in the upper right, but the slabs i have seen tampered with it is very clear and obvious. I have seen slabs come directly from PSA with that amount of milkiness in the border of the holder.
I reserve the right to be wrong though...
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
I see it now, thanks ElMago.
Man, these crackouts are getting more stealth/elegant. I remember seeing ones from years ago with frosting all the way around.
buying O-Pee-Chee (OPC) baseball cards
also collecting US & Canadian silver coins
Maybe it was not cracked open. Maybe it was graded for a very very big submitter.
I cracked out a card the other day as I am going to resubmit. Case popped open with almost no effort and no "frosting"!
good to know it was tampered with and not poorly graded
I'm not sure how you guys are determining that the case was tampered with. If that case was tampered with, I don't think anybody can have faith in any graded card. Usually when guys crack cases they're cutting them with clippers literally breaking the case. This case doesn't look broken. Either way, it's not good.
New graders!
https://kennerstartinglineup.blogspot.com/
To clarify, for those who may not be as familiar with past history as some here have vast experience with handling PSA holdered cards and have seen the variance in types as the years have progressed. I don't claim to be an expert and only share my opinion based on past experience. Ancient PSA holders were very easy to pop open without much effort and could be resealed as such and presented in such a way that the average buyer might not know what to look for, whom to ask or where to find guidance like we can get here. I've handled thousands of graded cards and I know what it takes to get a card out of almost any holder, whether it be tools or just common knowledge. The oldest varieties of PSA holders still present a danger to the folks who think they're getting a deal, but really getting shtupped. The WIWAG scandal is good reference to this. For those who know.
This isn't an ancient PSA holder though.
And you think that would prevent the ne'er-do-wells from completing their appointed rounds? Haha.
Guys that are faking cards aren't using clippers.
Indeed, they are cracking their 7s to get a bump to an 8, but end up with a 5 or a 6. Poor babies.
good to know. so much for tamper evident!!!
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
Yeah, I dont think that's what happened in this case. 😉
And sorry but the centering is far from perfect also.
I'm leaning toward this being a mechanical error or misgrade on PSA's part. The reasons being a) the holder can rarely be cracked with such little damage and b) the fraudster would likely not try to pass off a PSA 2/3 card, which has colored borders, as an 8.
I happens. I remember there was a 1956 or 1960 Willie Mays PSA 10 that was likely meant to have a PSA 1 holder. It's rare but gross mechanical errors happen. I also remember a 1975 Bob Gibson regular card that was labeled as a "MINT 7".
Certainly could be. Lots of strange things happen at PSA.
I have never received a card graded 3-4 grades above what it deserved.
Darn it!
One (four?) thing I noticed is:
Look at the four corners on the slab in the OP, where the frosted double line surrounds the card. Then notice how the outer line is broken at each corner. On all of my own cards I looked at, with the same iteration of holder, that outer line is unbroken; there are no gaps at the corners.
Steve
To me the only part that really looks questionable is the top of the slab. I can also see that being normal though. Could go either way. Everything other than the top looks good to me though.
How are you measuring it? Side to side is easy but top to bottom? Top of the apostrophe to the border should be the same from the wording to the bottom border. At least that's how I like it. I did say "nicely centered" which in my opinion this one is .
ON ITS WAY TO NEWPORT BEACH, CA 92658
I vote that this is a thousand times more likely to be a mech error on the grade portion of the label by PSA, rather than a tampered case and card switch-out. Mech errors on the grade happen way more frequently than a lot of people seem to realize.
What I forsee is someone snapped open an older style slab of something crappy. Then same person cracks with clippers a newer style (lighthouse) slab with the PSA 8 gibson. That person then takes a jalopy Gibson and puts it in the "ancient" snapped case with the lighthouse PSA 8 flip and reseals it. Then resubmits the real PSA 8 card or something. Helps the perp that the new flip is before the free scanning, so can't compare it.
Aren't those labels glued to the case, or something? I don't think they're just loose in there, are they?
Labels could easily be removed from older cases without damage. I have a handful from crackouts, but most of the labels I just returned to them so they could presumably update the Pop Report.
Slabs not passing my authenticity smell check
Don't know about now, but def not for the 5xxxxx range. You'd end up with stickum blotches and bad placement if they actually stuck
I have only ever cracked out one card. The label didn't just fall out. I glued the top of the slab, containing the label, back together. I use it as a key chain. That was 10+ years ago. I'm sure the tech has only gotten better.