Coin Grading Involving AI

Goob

With the rise and evolution of AI, I've been wondering if it will ever be developed to grade coins for the major TPGs and/or any new companies that just might happen to rise up in the future

Goob

On top of this, would AI pose a threat to human graders or do you guys think that AI grading will stay forever separate?

Rule556

Just like any technology, I believe that it would be of great help as long as a human gets the last say.

TurtleCat

It’s an interesting question. For a long time machine learning was the goal for coin grading. In the last couple of years the possibilities have dramatically shifted. I can see it happening eventually but it will take a number of things to make it market acceptable, in my opinion. I am sure others will think of things I didn’t consider or value my list differently.

1. Consistent video capture. In order to do grading, there needs to be a way to have a reasonably consistent video capture in order to demonstrate the quality and magnitude of the surfaces.
2. Standardized language. There needs to be a consistent and repeatable language for each attribute of a coin (this is probably the most likely to occur)
3. Standardized “deficiencies”. For grading to occur and be repeatable there needs to be established quantifiable elements that go into each grade level
4. New scales. To have a repeatable AI automated process a new methodology for grading should be established with no relationship to the current Sheldon-ish scale.

That’s just the starting point. Once established a dedicated model could be put together that would “walk” a user through the steps and to provide a grade.

Some of the inherent problems that can’t be solved or would make this process less likely:
1. People like fudge factors
2. Grading has less to do with technical grading and is all about how it would be priced on the market
3. Won’t easily account for scenarios human graders can handle (e.g. this year/mint has this tendency…)
4. Some counterfeit detection is possible or at least a score but a human can more easily sense things like the weight or color being just off or knowing what is more likely counterfeit, etc.

So my final analysis: It’s possible but I don’t see human graders going anywhere until/unless the industry decides that coins should be graded and managed differently. I think the likelihood of that is pretty small.

ScarsdaleCoin

funny that I saw this thread... I was playing around with ChatGPT and pics of coins that I took just last night and honestly it graded better than a lot of people I know... it will be interesting to see as years go on how it develops...

Goob

@TurtleCat said:
It’s an interesting question. For a long time machine learning was the goal for coin grading. In the last couple of years the possibilities have dramatically shifted. I can see it happening eventually but it will take a number of things to make it market acceptable, in my opinion. I am sure others will think of things I didn’t consider or value my list differently.

1. Consistent video capture. In order to do grading, there needs to be a way to have a reasonably consistent video capture in order to demonstrate the quality and magnitude of the surfaces.
2. Standardized language. There needs to be a consistent and repeatable language for each attribute of a coin (this is probably the most likely to occur)
3. Standardized “deficiencies”. For grading to occur and be repeatable there needs to be established quantifiable elements that go into each grade level
4. New scales. To have a repeatable AI automated process a new methodology for grading should be established with no relationship to the current Sheldon-ish scale.

That’s just the starting point. Once established a dedicated model could be put together that would “walk” a user through the steps and to provide a grade.

Some of the inherent problems that can’t be solved or would make this process less likely:
1. People like fudge factors
2. Grading has less to do with technical grading and is all about how it would be priced on the market
3. Won’t easily account for scenarios human graders can handle (e.g. this year/mint has this tendency…)
4. Some counterfeit detection is possible or at least a score but a human can more easily sense things like the weight or color being just off or knowing what is more likely counterfeit, etc.

So my final analysis: It’s possible but I don’t see human graders going anywhere until/unless the industry decides that coins should be graded and managed differently. I think the likelihood of that is pretty small.

Honestly that is all really logical insight and I really think you are on to something with this topic.

Goob

@Rule556 said:
Just like any technology, I believe that it would be of great help as long as a human gets the last say.

True!

seatedlib3991

I can only restate what i have said previously. I cannot see a stand alone, third party grading service, using only AI to grade coins ; and have collectors accept it at this time. I can see a CAC type stickering option to have AI offer you enhanced grading and or to confirm grades in existing plastic. i will not be surprised if, like the first grading services, there are 2 or 3 parties that launch such options in the next year or two. Perhaps someday we will be discussing the strictness/loosness of some AI robots. James

PhillyJoe

Modern coins yes, classic coins no. AI would work for technical grading, but there's a lot more involved for classic which is partly subjective.

Peasantry

It'd be helpful for variety attribution. Imagine getting a notification asking if you want your coin, which you didn't know was a variety, attributed. I wouldn't mind that.

Maybe down the line it'll be doing it all but integration is the first phase: variety attribution, prescreening, sniffing, etc.

Goob

@Peasantry said:
It'd be helpful for variety attribution. Imagine getting a notification asking if you want your coin, which you didn't know was a variety, attributed. I wouldn't mind that.

Maybe down the line it'll be doing it all but integration is the first phase: variety attribution, prescreening, sniffing, etc.

Honestly that would definitely make a lot of sense...maybe even the most

Goob

@PhillyJoe said:
Modern coins yes, classic coins no. AI would work for technical grading, but there's a lot more involved for classic which is partly subjective.

I think in the future AI would be capable of both, but I think not too far in the future, AI will have to start somewhere, which is where I do definitely agree with your standpoint on this.