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what's the odds of this being legit.....
donpaul
Posts: 5 ✭
ryan on top and on back... and the flip does not say ryan on front or back,
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I mean they made how many packs at some point there were some like this with 2 Ryan's. Does not look fake to me. I could be wrong.
I agree with you about a player on top and bottom of a pack being possible, but with no mention on the flip of this superstar on top and back ? If I was submitting this pack I would for sure want the flip to say ryan front and back.
Maybe they asked and PSA simply did not do it....happens. And maybe they did not ask.
Lets wait and see what some pack experts have to say. I am not a pack expert.
I found out the hard way a few years ago - those labels make it so you can’t add the pack to some registry sets. Got a bunch of 1985 OPC hockey packs slabbed after meticulously identifying all front and back cards and having the ones with better players labeled on the flip - no dice on adding them to the registry sets related to OPC hockey packs. Had to be vanilla “1985 OPC” with no named players for the registry.
Jim
A Jose special?
Was my first thought as well.
Should not be possible for the same card to be on top and bottom. Cards should be from different sheets.
Tightly wrapped 1980 cellos should exhibit a collation pattern of ABC/DEF (assuming this one is tightly wrapped; if not, it should exhibit DEF/ABC collation). Collation anomalies like this one where all cards within the pack are from ABC sheets (Ryan is on C sheet) are not unheard of (I've seen many 79 cellos with ABC cards throughout), but the fact that the same card is on front and back and that Ryan is the card in question is pretty far-fetched. In any event, this pack was graded many years ago and would have zero chance at passing authentication today.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
Did they offer card names on graded packs labels on the oldest flip types (probably from the first years they graded packs)?
I'm a novice when it comes to unopened material so could you please explain why this item would not pass authentication today? Thank you.
Like Grote15 stated, it's because the collation is off. Apparently, about 12 years ago, the "experts" discovered new information. It was decided that only players from certain printing sheets should be on the top and bottom. For decades before that, packs with different sequences were deemed authentic.
So this means that the pack for sale is definitely bogus or might be bogus?
Back in June, I essentially asked the same questions regarding 1975 cellos with Yount on top. The consensus seems to be that it could very well be legit, but because it would be an exception to the collation, authenticators won't touch it with a 10 foot pole, if submitted today. I actually pointed out that PSA actually has more 1975 cellos authenticated with Yount on top, than on the back.
You should look at that post to get the exact information. It seems to apply to cellos from the mid 70's to 1980.
PSA will no longer authenticate cello packs that do not follow standard collation for the year in question.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
I agree with your statement , but ?
Here are 2 different cello packs both topps 1983 newly graded 1 with sandberg on top , and the 2 nd pack with sandberg on the back ..
I am seeing this as it is possible to have the same card on top and on back of same cello pack. It may be unlikely but according to the professional graders it is possible too ..
I have gotten 2 of the same card in one pack. I believe it may happened to me several times back in the 1970's - 1980's.
Of course never any star player, always seems to be a common card.
The peak of my childhood collection was from 1975-1980, and my friends (some a few years older) and I all used to search the stores for the packs with stars showing. We all agree that there were definitely exceptions to the "standard" collation. We are almost certain that there were packs with the same player on front and back. The hobby seemed to agree with that until about 12 years ago.
Collation for 1983 is different from cellos in the 1970s. For the same reason, any card can fall on front or back of a 1980 cello pack (depending on the wrap). If you check the other side of those Sandberg cellos, you should see cards from opposing sheets which would negate the same card on front and back.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
I have ripped rack (not cello) packs from BBCE sealed boxes from 1985, 1986, 1987, 1989 and 1990.
For the most part, collation seems to follow a pattern, however every once in a while you find a cell with a bunch of duplicates.
I'm by no means claiming to be an expert, but I think it's quite possible a cell could have the same player on the top and the bottom.
So the bottom line is: The possibility of legitimacy for any top/bottom exists, however, PSA is no longer willing to assume the risk of being wrong.
Farewell Ryno.
Yes, in large part because the likelihood of that occurring with a collation anomaly especially with a star card is much more remote than the odds such a pack was altered post production.
Collecting 1970s Topps baseball wax, rack and cello packs, as well as PCGS graded Half Cents, Large Cents, Two Cent pieces and Three Cent Silver pieces.
And that makes complete sense.