@Tabe said:
The average value of a WNBA franchise has increased 180% just since 2024 to $269m.
That has nothing to do with it. An employee's value to a business is what they are worth to the company as far as productivity, and what it would cost to replace them.
I expect the players to try to form a union. Not sure if they have brought that up or not? So yes, they could form a union. But if the players think that if their demands were too high, that the league would just shut down, then they are out of their dribbling minds.
Except for Caitlin Clark, and she's on the downside right now with injuries. the WNBA could easily lose every player, replace them with others, and I doubt if attendance or TV ratings would suffer at all.
Besides, if the union was formed, then broken, perhaps the first player to come back would be Angel Reese. LOL
You expect the players to try and form a union? You mean like the WNBPA? Crawl out from under your rock bud and hunt for a clue.
I never heard of the WNBPA. You hadn't either, until you just googled and found it. LOL
Who do you think negotiates the CBA for the players? So no. I was aware of a players union and before that I would have assumed there was one. It’s ubiquitous in professional sports.
If I hadn’t known, you’re correct that I would have fact checked. Guess you do have an agenda here. Surprise.
@CheckYourDiaper said:
You appear to have missed the point. The players want to have a reasonably similar percentage in their CBA. They’re not asking to be paid what NBA players are being paid.
We really need to fund public schools better.
At a glance, an equal percentage of league revenues seems like a reasonable request. But the problem is the fixed costs of running the league require a much higher percentage of league revenue in the WNBA because that revenue is so much smaller. As someone put it in another discussion:
@Tabe said:
The average value of a WNBA franchise has increased 180% just since 2024 to $269m.
That has nothing to do with it. An employee's value to a business is what they are worth to the company as far as productivity, and what it would cost to replace them.
I expect the players to try to form a union. Not sure if they have brought that up or not? So yes, they could form a union. But if the players think that if their demands were too high, that the league would just shut down, then they are out of their dribbling minds.
Except for Caitlin Clark, and she's on the downside right now with injuries. the WNBA could easily lose every player, replace them with others, and I doubt if attendance or TV ratings would suffer at all.
Besides, if the union was formed, then broken, perhaps the first player to come back would be Angel Reese. LOL
You expect the players to try and form a union? You mean like the WNBPA? Crawl out from under your rock bud and hunt for a clue.
I never heard of the WNBPA. You hadn't either, until you just googled and found it. LOL
Who do you think negotiates the CBA for the players? So no. I was aware of a players union and before that I would have assumed there was one. It’s ubiquitous in professional sports.
If I hadn’t known, you’re correct that I would have fact checked. Guess you do have an agenda here. Surprise.
"ubiquitous"
Just so you know. Profanity is not allowed on this forum.
@CheckYourDiaper said:
You appear to have missed the point. The players want to have a reasonably similar percentage in their CBA. They’re not asking to be paid what NBA players are being paid.
We really need to fund public schools better.
At a glance, an equal percentage of league revenues seems like a reasonable request. But the problem is the fixed costs of running the league require a much higher percentage of league revenue in the WNBA because that revenue is so much smaller. As someone put it in another discussion:
>
The cost to pay for Angel Reese's make-up must be staggering.
@CheckYourDiaper said:
You appear to have missed the point. The players want to have a reasonably similar percentage in their CBA. They’re not asking to be paid what NBA players are being paid.
We really need to fund public schools better.
At a glance, an equal percentage of league revenues seems like a reasonable request. But the problem is the fixed costs of running the league require a much higher percentage of league revenue in the WNBA because that revenue is so much smaller. As someone put it in another discussion:
That's generally not how businesses run. Labor costs are usually an type-specific percentage of the revenue those efforts generate. Which in this case would be skilled labor, of the revenue those efforts generate.
But let's be clear. I'm not speaking to what I think would be a viable percentage as I don't have the financial details of the league. We're left to make reasonable assumptions.
I assume that the owners and the NBA are acting in their own best interests. That they're not a cabal of feminists trying to advance women's sports out of innate goodness.
Since most of the teams rent their stadium access we have pretty good numbers on the stadium and facility costs for the WNBA teams. There are some teams which play, or played, in out-sized arenas which are certainly not viable economically, but those are the great exception. Conservatively costs would be under $20M per season for all teams, and likely much closer to $10M. Currently there is $20M set aside for salaries. Travel? What would charter for the teams cost? 13 teams play 22 games on the road - 286 round trip flights? Mix of shorter and longer charters for a team would cost you about $8K per flight or 2.3M. Additional lodging and travel? Just put in another $20M for travel per season.
When the league had revenue in the $30M-$70M for the better part of a decade, losing, according to the NBA, around $10M annually, that was a reasonable story. I don't follow the logistics of how expenses have gotten so out of control that as revenue has increased to $200M they are losing more. It's certainly not clever accounting.
@Tabe said:
The average value of a WNBA franchise has increased 180% just since 2024 to $269m.
That has nothing to do with it. An employee's value to a business is what they are worth to the company as far as productivity, and what it would cost to replace them.
I expect the players to try to form a union. Not sure if they have brought that up or not? So yes, they could form a union. But if the players think that if their demands were too high, that the league would just shut down, then they are out of their dribbling minds.
Except for Caitlin Clark, and she's on the downside right now with injuries. the WNBA could easily lose every player, replace them with others, and I doubt if attendance or TV ratings would suffer at all.
Besides, if the union was formed, then broken, perhaps the first player to come back would be Angel Reese. LOL
You expect the players to try and form a union? You mean like the WNBPA? Crawl out from under your rock bud and hunt for a clue.
I never heard of the WNBPA. You hadn't either, until you just googled and found it. LOL
Who do you think negotiates the CBA for the players? So no. I was aware of a players union and before that I would have assumed there was one. It’s ubiquitous in professional sports.
If I hadn’t known, you’re correct that I would have fact checked. Guess you do have an agenda here. Surprise.
"ubiquitous"
Just so you know. Profanity is not allowed on this forum.
Does this joke rely on "ubiquitous" being considered by many to be an obscure word? I didn't realize Philly was in the South!
Nothing wrong with trying to get as much as you can for yourself...but for their sake, I hope they are seeing clearly and their 'bluff' is not called, because I don't see the players of that league holding very much leverage.
@1948_Swell_Robinson said:
Nothing wrong with trying to get as much as you can for yourself...but for their sake, I hope they are seeing clearly and their 'bluff' is not called, because I don't see the players of that league holding very much leverage.
Both the MLB and NFL strikes, left a sour taste for many fans. Fans saw it as a bunch of rich, greedy, pampered players wanting even more, and the fans were right. The NFL even tried replacement players. I can't speak for other cities, but I know of no Eagles fan who got rid of their season's tickets, and weren't going to even if the replacement players became permanent.
It's not much different now for most fans. Let's take Angel Reese. She said her salary is 74k a year. Plus she makes between 1 and 2 million dollars in endorsements per year, and also made millions while in college. If Angel thinks she is going to get sympathy from the fans, she is sorely mistaken.
I don't know what is the minimum WNBA salary. But I'm sure it ain't bad. And if the benchwarmers have any sort of competent agent, I'm sure the agent gets endorsement money for them as well, at least on the local level.
Also let's not forget the 74k that Reese makes is for a part-time job. She is free for many other months during the year to make money doing something else. Maybe she could act in a Hollywood horror movie, and make some good money there. Play a female vampire or a female pirate. She wouldn't have to do much acting - LOL.
@1948_Swell_Robinson said:
Nothing wrong with trying to get as much as you can for yourself...but for their sake, I hope they are seeing clearly and their 'bluff' is not called, because I don't see the players of that league holding very much leverage.
Both the MLB and NFL strikes, left a sour taste for many fans. Fans saw it as a bunch of rich, greedy, pampered players wanting even more, and the fans were right. The NFL even tried replacement players. I can't speak for other cities, but I know of no Eagles fan who got rid of their season's tickets, and weren't going to even if the replacement players became permanent.
It's not much different now for most fans. Let's take Angel Reese. She said her salary is 74k a year. Plus she makes between 1 and 2 million dollars in endorsements per year, and also made millions while in college. If Angel thinks she is going to get sympathy from the fans, she is sorely mistaken.
I don't know what is the minimum WNBA salary. But I'm sure it ain't bad. And if the benchwarmers have any sort of competent agent, I'm sure the agent gets endorsement money for them as well, at least on the local level.
Also let's not forget the 74k that Reese makes is for a part-time job. She is free for many other months during the year to make money doing something else. Maybe she could act in a Hollywood horror movie, and make some good money there. Play a female vampire or a female pirate. She wouldn't have to do much acting - LOL.
Agree 100%. Strikes in the major sports left a sour taste in my mind too and those sports were engrained in our lives. WNBA is playing with fire because they are nowhere near engrained in the sports conscious.
Say what you want about the quality of the product, their salaries are low. Caitlin, Angel and every other player on a rookie contract make the same $74,000.
And while some of the better known players (Sabrina Ionescu for example) do well with endorsements, that is certainly not the case for the rank-and-file player.
As far as it being a part-time job, that's true, and many players for years have worked overseas during the off-season to increase their income. Unfortunately, the effect of that is not a positive one for the WNBA, as many players get tired and hurt in the off-season rather than devoting their time to conditioning and rest. They also sometimes have to miss time from training camp and even regular season games to honor higher paying overseas commitments. Makes the WNBA look like a chump league.
@1948_Swell_Robinson said:
Nothing wrong with trying to get as much as you can for yourself...but for their sake, I hope they are seeing clearly and their 'bluff' is not called, because I don't see the players of that league holding very much leverage.
Both the MLB and NFL strikes, left a sour taste for many fans. Fans saw it as a bunch of rich, greedy, pampered players wanting even more, and the fans were right. The NFL even tried replacement players. I can't speak for other cities, but I know of no Eagles fan who got rid of their season's tickets, and weren't going to even if the replacement players became permanent.
It's not much different now for most fans. Let's take Angel Reese. She said her salary is 74k a year. Plus she makes between 1 and 2 million dollars in endorsements per year, and also made millions while in college. If Angel thinks she is going to get sympathy from the fans, she is sorely mistaken.
I don't know what is the minimum WNBA salary. But I'm sure it ain't bad. And if the benchwarmers have any sort of competent agent, I'm sure the agent gets endorsement money for them as well, at least on the local level.
Also let's not forget the 74k that Reese makes is for a part-time job. She is free for many other months during the year to make money doing something else. Maybe she could act in a Hollywood horror movie, and make some good money there. Play a female vampire or a female pirate. She wouldn't have to do much acting - LOL.
Agree 100%. Strikes in the major sports left a sour taste in my mind too and those sports were engrained in our lives. WNBA is playing with fire because they are nowhere near engrained in the sports conscious.
A good buddy of mine, we were college roommates, was the biggest MLB fan I ever knew. He knows every baseball trivia question imaginable. He even became a sports writer for a major Pennsylvania newspaper.
He had quit the newspaper job well before the MLB strike, because he wasn't the key writer, and the pay wasn't all that great. So he pursued another career. However he remained a big MLB fan until the strike, which soured him a lot on MLB. Took him a number of years to fully get over it, and he became a big fan again.
He also has a magnificent baseball card collection. I've tried to get him to join this forum, but he just doesn't like posting on the internet.
@stevek said: However he remained a big MLB fan until the strike, which soured him a lot on MLB. Took him a number of years to fully get over it, and he became a big fan again.
Rob Manfred is doing more to alienate long time baseball fans than a strike ever could with his idiotic extra inning rules and All-Star game swing offs.
@PaulMaul said:
Say what you want about the quality of the product, their salaries are low. Caitlin, Angel and every other player on a rookie contract make the same $74,000.
And while some of the better known players (Sabrina Ionescu for example) do well with endorsements, that is certainly not the case for the rank-and-file player.
As far as it being a part-time job, that's true, and many players for years have worked overseas during the off-season to increase their income. Unfortunately, the effect of that is not a positive one for the WNBA, as many players get tired and hurt in the off-season rather than devoting their time to conditioning and rest. They also sometimes have to miss time from training camp and even regular season games to honor higher paying overseas commitments. Makes the WNBA look like a chump league.
I guess that's what Brittney Griner did.
That sure didn't turn out very well. Although she did become famous over it. But it must have been quite frightening.
@stevek said: However he remained a big MLB fan until the strike, which soured him a lot on MLB. Took him a number of years to fully get over it, and he became a big fan again.
Rob Manfred is doing more to alienate long time baseball fans than a strike ever could with his idiotic extra inning rules and All-Star game swing offs.
Frankly when we email each other these days and chat sports, it's usually not about baseball. It's almost always about football. Especially Penn State as we are both huge fans.
Perhaps his MLB interest has waned again? Not sure, but I think you may have made a point that perhaps my buddy has finally grown tired of MLB since he rarely mentions it.
I still like MLB, but don't follow it nearly as much as I did when I was younger, even though recently the Phillies are doing well. Football is by far my main sports interest.
@PaulMaul said:
Say what you want about the quality of the product, their salaries are low. Caitlin, Angel and every other player on a rookie contract make the same $74,000.
And while some of the better known players (Sabrina Ionescu for example) do well with endorsements, that is certainly not the case for the rank-and-file player.
As far as it being a part-time job, that's true, and many players for years have worked overseas during the off-season to increase their income. Unfortunately, the effect of that is not a positive one for the WNBA, as many players get tired and hurt in the off-season rather than devoting their time to conditioning and rest. They also sometimes have to miss time from training camp and even regular season games to honor higher paying overseas commitments. Makes the WNBA look like a chump league.
The salaries are actually high when you consider that the league lost 40 million dollars last year and again has never turned a profit. If the NBA wasnt providing support and the owners werent willing to lose some money for PR and hoping to build up franchise value to eventually sell and get their minimal investments back the league wouldnt exist. It would be bankrupt.
The flights are going to cost even more with the expansion coming up. They spend over 10 percent of their total revenue on flights which is just insane.
The lack of endorsements is purely on the player. If youre good and likeable/marketable you can get deals, if youre not likeable companies arent going to give you money, its that simple.
All leagues underpay rookies which is why teams arent keeping mediocre veterans around in MLB or the NFL anymore and are bringing in young guys that cost less. NBA is doing the same thing. But again given the WNBA has never made a profit 74k is generous and the majority of the country lives off less than that a year, if they cant live off that thats because of their own choices with how they spend their money
I’m not saying they necessarily deserve more, though it is trending in that direction. Just pushing back on Steve saying the minimum WNBA salary “ain’t bad.” It’s pretty bad, certainly in the context of a sport that is broadcast on ABC, CBS and ESPN.
@PaulMaul said:
I’m not saying they necessarily deserve more, though it is trending in that direction. Just pushing back on Steve saying the minimum WNBA salary “ain’t bad.” It’s pretty bad, certainly in the context of a sport that is broadcast on ABC, CBS and ESPN.
Again the league loses money. Their minimum salary is more than the average salary in the USA. MLB, NFL, NBA all make over 10 billion, MLS makes over a billion, they bring in 200 million.
Their salaries are very disproportionate in the players favor compared to league revenue and lack of profit.
"The median salary for an NBA player in the 2024-25 season is $6,696,429. This figure represents the middle point of all salaries in the league, meaning half of the players earn more than this amount, and half earn less. This median salary is the highest among the four major professional sports leagues in the US."
Including endorsements, Caitlin already in total, makes more than around half the NBA players.
Hopefully she can stay away from shyster business managers and cryptocurrency scams.
"The median salary for an NBA player in the 2024-25 season is $6,696,429. This figure represents the middle point of all salaries in the league, meaning half of the players earn more than this amount, and half earn less. This median salary is the highest among the four major professional sports leagues in the US."
Including endorsements, Caitlin already in total, makes more than around half the NBA players.
Hopefully she can stay away from shyster business managers and cryptocurrency scams.
Nope, sorry, I'm afraid it's too late. The movement has already started.
Whenever the median is presented my ears perk up. That usually means both the data and the context are skewed. I would imagine that the median is the lower of the 2 by a significant amount. I don’t know if that means anything relative to the previous discussion though.
"The median salary for an NBA player in the 2024-25 season is $6,696,429. This figure represents the middle point of all salaries in the league, meaning half of the players earn more than this amount, and half earn less. This median salary is the highest among the four major professional sports leagues in the US."
Including endorsements, Caitlin already in total, makes more than around half the NBA players.
Hopefully she can stay away from shyster business managers and cryptocurrency scams.
Nope, sorry, I'm afraid it's too late. The movement has already started.
Well fortunately right now in America, there is a very positive business climate, in which all of us should become more prosperous.
So if these sports ladies can join in, it's fine by me.
@Saint Ezzard said: @stevek, Get yours on eBay now while supplies last, but hurry, they're selling like hotcakes!
Interesting idea, especially from a 104 feedback seller.
The only problem is using Caitlin's name in the description. That is not a "Caitlin Clark shirt" and if Ebay sees it, his seller account on Ebay is going to be very short lived.
"The median salary for an NBA player in the 2024-25 season is $6,696,429. This figure represents the middle point of all salaries in the league, meaning half of the players earn more than this amount, and half earn less. This median salary is the highest among the four major professional sports leagues in the US."
NBA should be the highest for the major sports given that their rosters are significantly smaller than any other major sports league
"The median salary for an NBA player in the 2024-25 season is $6,696,429. This figure represents the middle point of all salaries in the league, meaning half of the players earn more than this amount, and half earn less. This median salary is the highest among the four major professional sports leagues in the US."
Including endorsements, Caitlin already in total, makes more than around half the NBA players.
Hopefully she can stay away from shyster business managers and cryptocurrency scams.
Nope, sorry, I'm afraid it's too late. The movement has already started.
Well fortunately right now in America, there is a very positive business climate, in which all of us should become more prosperous.
So if these sports ladies can join in, it's fine by me.
"The median salary for an NBA player in the 2024-25 season is $6,696,429. This figure represents the middle point of all salaries in the league, meaning half of the players earn more than this amount, and half earn less. This median salary is the highest among the four major professional sports leagues in the US."
Including endorsements, Caitlin already in total, makes more than around half the NBA players.
Hopefully she can stay away from shyster business managers and cryptocurrency scams.
Nope, sorry, I'm afraid it's too late. The movement has already started.
Well fortunately right now in America, there is a very positive business climate, in which all of us should become more prosperous.
So if these sports ladies can join in, it's fine by me.
Hopefully the economic fear mongering from the early Spring is in the past.
Inflation is tame. Might uptick a hair temporarily.
People are participating in the economy. A nice quick REAL indicator...TSA throughput saw three different days in July of this year eclipse 3 million+ air travelers for a single day, a record amount of times for a month. I suspect there will be another one this coming last weekend in July.
For reference, 3 million travelers in a day happened once this past June 2025, once May 2025, once last December 2024, and once last July 2024. Thats it.
OPEC+ agreed to another round of oil output increases in August due to worldwide useage outlooks. They have already increased earlier this year. Hopefully that sticks because the gas prices while lower than this time last year, still could go lower more once those output effects kick in...of course a state could add an even higher gas tax to hide that drop a little.
Summer of 2022 saw a National gas price average high of $5.016 a gallon It is $3.155 today.
Now cue the world event that hurts the market...but when the happens(and it will), my philosophy is to follow the path of Mel Gibson 's character in The Patriot when their troops were getting beaten back, he was yelling "Hold the line."
Then he grabbed the flag and yelled "Push forward!" Then they won. Push forward and ignore the noise.
"The median salary for an NBA player in the 2024-25 season is $6,696,429. This figure represents the middle point of all salaries in the league, meaning half of the players earn more than this amount, and half earn less. This median salary is the highest among the four major professional sports leagues in the US."
Including endorsements, Caitlin already in total, makes more than around half the NBA players.
Hopefully she can stay away from shyster business managers and cryptocurrency scams.
Nope, sorry, I'm afraid it's too late. The movement has already started.
Well fortunately right now in America, there is a very positive business climate, in which all of us should become more prosperous.
So if these sports ladies can join in, it's fine by me.
Hopefully the economic fear mongering from the early Spring is in the past.
Inflation is tame. Might uptick a hair temporarily.
People are participating in the economy. A nice quick REAL indicator...TSA throughput saw three different days in July of this year eclipse 3 million+ air travelers for a single day, a record amount of times for a month. I suspect there will be another one this coming last weekend in July.
For reference, 3 million travelers in a day happened once this past June 2025, once May 2025, once last December 2024, and once last July 2024. Thats it.
OPEC+ agreed to another round of oil output increases in August due to worldwide useage outlooks. They have already increased earlier this year. Hopefully that sticks because the gas prices while lower than this time last year, still could go lower more once those output effects kick in...of course a state could add an even higher gas tax to hide that drop a little.
Summer of 2022 saw a National gas price average high of $5.016 a gallon It is $3.155 today.
Now cue the world event that hurts the market...but when the happens(and it will), my philosophy is to follow the path of Mel Gibson 's character in The Patriot when their troops were getting beaten back, he was yelling "Hold the line."
Then he grabbed the flag and yelled "Push forward!" Then they won. Push forward and ignore the noise.
Completely agree, and I see good things happening in the collectibles market as well, especially with our CU hobbies.
Perhaps the biggest wild card in the card market right now is Caitlin Clark. I mean some of her PSA cards have been selling for nosebleed prices. If she continues to get harassed and/or badly hurt, she may decide to quit basketball and maybe start a family. That would be nice for her, but certainly not too nice for her card values. Could be a 1929 type crash, but that's life in the fast lane for the whales investing in those ultra expensive cards.
If I owned a business and it was losing big money year after year and you asked for a raise, I would say there is the door.
These players should be kissing C.C's ass. She does not need more money from the WNBA. She is standing up for players who want to wring her neck.
If the league is truly losing money they should sit down everyone in the league and it should be shown that it it truly losing money and it should be shown where all the money comes and goes. Cost of running the league.
@perkdog said:
I think the biggest take away from this thread is we should all welcome back our snarky side dish that nobody ordered Mr.Bgr
Don't assume my pronouns. Post flagged!
I got to be transparent, it wasn't me who sniffed you out although you were SUS from the get go
You have this great way of having an Intelligent conversation but you can't help. yourself from throwing in snide remarks trying to make someone guess if your being rude to them or not.
Ofcourse this is a safe space for you to practice that since there is no fear of knuckles to eat during said intelligent conversations lol
no one knows less about the wnba than me. and no one cares less. no one. not once have i ever witnessed reese or clark dribble a basketball, and i doubt i ever will. but i had to check on my girl Teaira to see how she was doing two years removed from meeting her. apparently she doesn't start for the Wings anymore. for the first 6 years of her career she practically averaged a double-double, but her stats & playing time are way down this year.
she sat down next to me at the bar at a Pappadeaux's and started watching a game on her phone. when i noticed what she was doing and how tall she was (6'7"), i was like, yup, i'm about to be that guy. had to know who she was. total sweetheart. got her to sign a coaster and, for the most part, left her alone. i did offer to buy her a drink, but in very responsible fashion she said she was only having one because the only way she was safely getting home was her ability to do so.
politest refusal of a drink by a female sitting at a bar by herself of my miserable life.
@galaxy27 said:
no one knows less about the wnba than me. and no one cares less. no one. not once have i ever witnessed reese or clark dribble a basketball, and i doubt i ever will. but i had to check on my girl Teaira to see how she was doing two years removed from meeting her. apparently she doesn't start for the Wings anymore. for the first 6 years of her career she practically averaged a double-double, but her stats & playing time are way down this year.
she sat down next to me at the bar at a Pappadeaux's and started watching a game on her phone. when i noticed what she was doing and how tall she was (6'7"), i was like, yup, i'm about to be that guy. had to know who she was. total sweetheart. got her to sign a coaster and, for the most part, left her alone. i did offer to buy her a drink, but in very responsible fashion she said she was only having one because the only way she was safely getting home was her ability to do so.
politest refusal of a drink by a female sitting at a bar by herself of my miserable life.
@perkdog said:
I think the biggest take away from this thread is we should all welcome back our snarky side dish that nobody ordered Mr.Bgr
Don't assume my pronouns. Post flagged!
I got to be transparent, it wasn't me who sniffed you out although you were SUS from the get go
You have this great way of having an Intelligent conversation but you can't help. yourself from throwing in snide remarks trying to make someone guess if your being rude to them or not.
Ofcourse this is a safe space for you to practice that since there is no fear of knuckles to eat during said intelligent conversations lol
I wasn't trying to trick anyone. That some here might be confused does not surprise me though. Please don't hurt me. I'm a vegan.
Or you could fly here to Indiana, we get a flight out of Chicago...Tell the pilot that we want to land over near the Patriots hood... I'll Bubble Up 💬💬 @perkdog and we could get the real ones right out of the Atlantic...🦪🦪🦪
I love seafood, and especially oysters... so I was really bummed out when I learned how those are "fished". Tragic. Ruined it for me. The ignorant are nothing if not blessed.
@perkdog said:
I think the biggest take away from this thread is we should all welcome back our snarky side dish that nobody ordered Mr.Bgr
Don't assume my pronouns. Post flagged!
I got to be transparent, it wasn't me who sniffed you out although you were SUS from the get go
You have this great way of having an Intelligent conversation but you can't help. yourself from throwing in snide remarks trying to make someone guess if your being rude to them or not.
Ofcourse this is a safe space for you to practice that since there is no fear of knuckles to eat during said intelligent conversations lol
I wasn't trying to trick anyone. That some here might be confused does not surprise me though. Please don't hurt me. I'm a vegan.
Oh there was no confusion, in fact nobody gave you a second thought when you took your bgr ball and went home, you come back with some weird handle and after a few conversations it was like ahh ok that snarky bgr came back
Your not that much of a topic so no confusion involved lol
@perkdog said:
I think the biggest take away from this thread is we should all welcome back our snarky side dish that nobody ordered Mr.Bgr
Don't assume my pronouns. Post flagged!
I got to be transparent, it wasn't me who sniffed you out although you were SUS from the get go
You have this great way of having an Intelligent conversation but you can't help. yourself from throwing in snide remarks trying to make someone guess if your being rude to them or not.
Ofcourse this is a safe space for you to practice that since there is no fear of knuckles to eat during said intelligent conversations lol
I wasn't trying to trick anyone. That some here might be confused does not surprise me though. Please don't hurt me. I'm a vegan.
Oh there was no confusion, in fact nobody gave you a second thought when you took your bgr ball and went home, you come back with some weird handle and after a few conversations it was like ahh ok that snarky bgr came back
Your not that much of a topic so no confusion involved lol
You made a point of it so that you could say no one cares? That's absurd, petty, and indicative of weakness. Please lose yourself in the music.
@perkdog said:
I think the biggest take away from this thread is we should all welcome back our snarky side dish that nobody ordered Mr.Bgr
Don't assume my pronouns. Post flagged!
I got to be transparent, it wasn't me who sniffed you out although you were SUS from the get go
You have this great way of having an Intelligent conversation but you can't help. yourself from throwing in snide remarks trying to make someone guess if your being rude to them or not.
Ofcourse this is a safe space for you to practice that since there is no fear of knuckles to eat during said intelligent conversations lol
I wasn't trying to trick anyone. That some here might be confused does not surprise me though. Please don't hurt me. I'm a vegan.
Oh there was no confusion, in fact nobody gave you a second thought when you took your bgr ball and went home, you come back with some weird handle and after a few conversations it was like ahh ok that snarky bgr came back
Your not that much of a topic so no confusion involved lol
You made a point of it so that you could say no one cares? That's absurd, petty, and indicative of weakness. Please lose yourself in the music.
My point was your not as sneaky as you think, I figured it was obvious that nobody cares
@perkdog said:
I think the biggest take away from this thread is we should all welcome back our snarky side dish that nobody ordered Mr.Bgr
Don't assume my pronouns. Post flagged!
I got to be transparent, it wasn't me who sniffed you out although you were SUS from the get go
You have this great way of having an Intelligent conversation but you can't help. yourself from throwing in snide remarks trying to make someone guess if your being rude to them or not.
Ofcourse this is a safe space for you to practice that since there is no fear of knuckles to eat during said intelligent conversations lol
I wasn't trying to trick anyone. That some here might be confused does not surprise me though. Please don't hurt me. I'm a vegan.
Oh there was no confusion, in fact nobody gave you a second thought when you took your bgr ball and went home, you come back with some weird handle and after a few conversations it was like ahh ok that snarky bgr came back
Your not that much of a topic so no confusion involved lol
You made a point of it so that you could say no one cares? That's absurd, petty, and indicative of weakness. Please lose yourself in the music.
My point was your not as sneaky as you think, I figured it was obvious that nobody cares
I know that was your point which is why I said. "I wasn't trying to trick anyone". Are you OK boss? We're on the same page. No one cares, including me.
@perkdog said:
I think the biggest take away from this thread is we should all welcome back our snarky side dish that nobody ordered Mr.Bgr
Don't assume my pronouns. Post flagged!
I got to be transparent, it wasn't me who sniffed you out although you were SUS from the get go
You have this great way of having an Intelligent conversation but you can't help. yourself from throwing in snide remarks trying to make someone guess if your being rude to them or not.
Ofcourse this is a safe space for you to practice that since there is no fear of knuckles to eat during said intelligent conversations lol
I wasn't trying to trick anyone. That some here might be confused does not surprise me though. Please don't hurt me. I'm a vegan.
Oh there was no confusion, in fact nobody gave you a second thought when you took your bgr ball and went home, you come back with some weird handle and after a few conversations it was like ahh ok that snarky bgr came back
Your not that much of a topic so no confusion involved lol
You made a point of it so that you could say no one cares? That's absurd, petty, and indicative of weakness. Please lose yourself in the music.
My point was your not as sneaky as you think, I figured it was obvious that nobody cares
I know that was your point which is why I said. "I wasn't trying to trick anyone". Are you OK boss? We're on the same page. No one cares, including me.
Oh I'm not your boss, your free to change your name as much as you want I don't care lol
Anyways I can see this discussion is important to you since you keep quoting me and don't want to let it go
Quote me again and get the last word in so we can please move on
@perkdog said:
I think the biggest take away from this thread is we should all welcome back our snarky side dish that nobody ordered Mr.Bgr
Don't assume my pronouns. Post flagged!
I got to be transparent, it wasn't me who sniffed you out although you were SUS from the get go
You have this great way of having an Intelligent conversation but you can't help. yourself from throwing in snide remarks trying to make someone guess if your being rude to them or not.
Ofcourse this is a safe space for you to practice that since there is no fear of knuckles to eat during said intelligent conversations lol
I wasn't trying to trick anyone. That some here might be confused does not surprise me though. Please don't hurt me. I'm a vegan.
Oh there was no confusion, in fact nobody gave you a second thought when you took your bgr ball and went home, you come back with some weird handle and after a few conversations it was like ahh ok that snarky bgr came back
Your not that much of a topic so no confusion involved lol
You made a point of it so that you could say no one cares? That's absurd, petty, and indicative of weakness. Please lose yourself in the music.
My point was your not as sneaky as you think, I figured it was obvious that nobody cares
I know that was your point which is why I said. "I wasn't trying to trick anyone". Are you OK boss? We're on the same page. No one cares, including me.
Oh I'm not your boss, your free to change your name as much as you want I don't care lol
Anyways I can see this discussion is important to you since you keep quoting me and don't want to let it go
Quote me again and get the last word in so we can please move on
You're a weird dude. Telling me how little you care about something you brought up... OK. I guess we can't be friends. Oh bother.
Comments
Who do you think negotiates the CBA for the players? So no. I was aware of a players union and before that I would have assumed there was one. It’s ubiquitous in professional sports.
If I hadn’t known, you’re correct that I would have fact checked. Guess you do have an agenda here. Surprise.
At a glance, an equal percentage of league revenues seems like a reasonable request. But the problem is the fixed costs of running the league require a much higher percentage of league revenue in the WNBA because that revenue is so much smaller. As someone put it in another discussion:
"ubiquitous"
Just so you know. Profanity is not allowed on this forum.
>
The cost to pay for Angel Reese's make-up must be staggering.
That takes a large bite out of them profits.
That's generally not how businesses run. Labor costs are usually an type-specific percentage of the revenue those efforts generate. Which in this case would be skilled labor, of the revenue those efforts generate.
But let's be clear. I'm not speaking to what I think would be a viable percentage as I don't have the financial details of the league. We're left to make reasonable assumptions.
I assume that the owners and the NBA are acting in their own best interests. That they're not a cabal of feminists trying to advance women's sports out of innate goodness.
Since most of the teams rent their stadium access we have pretty good numbers on the stadium and facility costs for the WNBA teams. There are some teams which play, or played, in out-sized arenas which are certainly not viable economically, but those are the great exception. Conservatively costs would be under $20M per season for all teams, and likely much closer to $10M. Currently there is $20M set aside for salaries. Travel? What would charter for the teams cost? 13 teams play 22 games on the road - 286 round trip flights? Mix of shorter and longer charters for a team would cost you about $8K per flight or 2.3M. Additional lodging and travel? Just put in another $20M for travel per season.
When the league had revenue in the $30M-$70M for the better part of a decade, losing, according to the NBA, around $10M annually, that was a reasonable story. I don't follow the logistics of how expenses have gotten so out of control that as revenue has increased to $200M they are losing more. It's certainly not clever accounting.
Does not add up to me.
Paul Giamatti
Does this joke rely on "ubiquitous" being considered by many to be an obscure word? I didn't realize Philly was in the South!
Nothing wrong with trying to get as much as you can for yourself...but for their sake, I hope they are seeing clearly and their 'bluff' is not called, because I don't see the players of that league holding very much leverage.
@CheckYourDiaper
Apparently the charter flights alone cost $25 mil/season.
Both the MLB and NFL strikes, left a sour taste for many fans. Fans saw it as a bunch of rich, greedy, pampered players wanting even more, and the fans were right. The NFL even tried replacement players. I can't speak for other cities, but I know of no Eagles fan who got rid of their season's tickets, and weren't going to even if the replacement players became permanent.
It's not much different now for most fans. Let's take Angel Reese. She said her salary is 74k a year. Plus she makes between 1 and 2 million dollars in endorsements per year, and also made millions while in college. If Angel thinks she is going to get sympathy from the fans, she is sorely mistaken.
I don't know what is the minimum WNBA salary. But I'm sure it ain't bad. And if the benchwarmers have any sort of competent agent, I'm sure the agent gets endorsement money for them as well, at least on the local level.
Also let's not forget the 74k that Reese makes is for a part-time job. She is free for many other months during the year to make money doing something else. Maybe she could act in a Hollywood horror movie, and make some good money there. Play a female vampire or a female pirate. She wouldn't have to do much acting - LOL.
Agree 100%. Strikes in the major sports left a sour taste in my mind too and those sports were engrained in our lives. WNBA is playing with fire because they are nowhere near engrained in the sports conscious.
Say what you want about the quality of the product, their salaries are low. Caitlin, Angel and every other player on a rookie contract make the same $74,000.
And while some of the better known players (Sabrina Ionescu for example) do well with endorsements, that is certainly not the case for the rank-and-file player.
As far as it being a part-time job, that's true, and many players for years have worked overseas during the off-season to increase their income. Unfortunately, the effect of that is not a positive one for the WNBA, as many players get tired and hurt in the off-season rather than devoting their time to conditioning and rest. They also sometimes have to miss time from training camp and even regular season games to honor higher paying overseas commitments. Makes the WNBA look like a chump league.
A good buddy of mine, we were college roommates, was the biggest MLB fan I ever knew. He knows every baseball trivia question imaginable. He even became a sports writer for a major Pennsylvania newspaper.
He had quit the newspaper job well before the MLB strike, because he wasn't the key writer, and the pay wasn't all that great. So he pursued another career. However he remained a big MLB fan until the strike, which soured him a lot on MLB. Took him a number of years to fully get over it, and he became a big fan again.
He also has a magnificent baseball card collection. I've tried to get him to join this forum, but he just doesn't like posting on the internet.
Rob Manfred is doing more to alienate long time baseball fans than a strike ever could with his idiotic extra inning rules and All-Star game swing offs.
I guess that's what Brittney Griner did.
That sure didn't turn out very well. Although she did become famous over it. But it must have been quite frightening.
Frankly when we email each other these days and chat sports, it's usually not about baseball. It's almost always about football. Especially Penn State as we are both huge fans.
Perhaps his MLB interest has waned again? Not sure, but I think you may have made a point that perhaps my buddy has finally grown tired of MLB since he rarely mentions it.
I still like MLB, but don't follow it nearly as much as I did when I was younger, even though recently the Phillies are doing well. Football is by far my main sports interest.
The salaries are actually high when you consider that the league lost 40 million dollars last year and again has never turned a profit. If the NBA wasnt providing support and the owners werent willing to lose some money for PR and hoping to build up franchise value to eventually sell and get their minimal investments back the league wouldnt exist. It would be bankrupt.
The flights are going to cost even more with the expansion coming up. They spend over 10 percent of their total revenue on flights which is just insane.
The lack of endorsements is purely on the player. If youre good and likeable/marketable you can get deals, if youre not likeable companies arent going to give you money, its that simple.
All leagues underpay rookies which is why teams arent keeping mediocre veterans around in MLB or the NFL anymore and are bringing in young guys that cost less. NBA is doing the same thing. But again given the WNBA has never made a profit 74k is generous and the majority of the country lives off less than that a year, if they cant live off that thats because of their own choices with how they spend their money
I’m not saying they necessarily deserve more, though it is trending in that direction. Just pushing back on Steve saying the minimum WNBA salary “ain’t bad.” It’s pretty bad, certainly in the context of a sport that is broadcast on ABC, CBS and ESPN.
Again the league loses money. Their minimum salary is more than the average salary in the USA. MLB, NFL, NBA all make over 10 billion, MLS makes over a billion, they bring in 200 million.
Their salaries are very disproportionate in the players favor compared to league revenue and lack of profit.
Out of curiosity... do you blend the BS up before you drink it down or just swallow whole?
"The median salary for an NBA player in the 2024-25 season is $6,696,429. This figure represents the middle point of all salaries in the league, meaning half of the players earn more than this amount, and half earn less. This median salary is the highest among the four major professional sports leagues in the US."
Including endorsements, Caitlin already in total, makes more than around half the NBA players.
Hopefully she can stay away from shyster business managers and cryptocurrency scams.
Nope, sorry, I'm afraid it's too late. The movement has already started.
Whenever the median is presented my ears perk up. That usually means both the data and the context are skewed. I would imagine that the median is the lower of the 2 by a significant amount. I don’t know if that means anything relative to the previous discussion though.
@stevek, Get yours on eBay now while supplies last, but hurry, they're selling like hotcakes!
Well fortunately right now in America, there is a very positive business climate, in which all of us should become more prosperous.
So if these sports ladies can join in, it's fine by me.
Interesting idea, especially from a 104 feedback seller.
The only problem is using Caitlin's name in the description. That is not a "Caitlin Clark shirt" and if Ebay sees it, his seller account on Ebay is going to be very short lived.
NBA should be the highest for the major sports given that their rosters are significantly smaller than any other major sports league
Agree.
Hopefully the economic fear mongering from the early Spring is in the past.
Inflation is tame. Might uptick a hair temporarily.
People are participating in the economy. A nice quick REAL indicator...TSA throughput saw three different days in July of this year eclipse 3 million+ air travelers for a single day, a record amount of times for a month. I suspect there will be another one this coming last weekend in July.
For reference, 3 million travelers in a day happened once this past June 2025, once May 2025, once last December 2024, and once last July 2024. Thats it.
OPEC+ agreed to another round of oil output increases in August due to worldwide useage outlooks. They have already increased earlier this year. Hopefully that sticks because the gas prices while lower than this time last year, still could go lower more once those output effects kick in...of course a state could add an even higher gas tax to hide that drop a little.
Summer of 2022 saw a National gas price average high of $5.016 a gallon It is $3.155 today.
Now cue the world event that hurts the market...but when the happens(and it will), my philosophy is to follow the path of Mel Gibson 's character in The Patriot when their troops were getting beaten back, he was yelling "Hold the line."
Then he grabbed the flag and yelled "Push forward!" Then they won. Push forward and ignore the noise.
Completely agree, and I see good things happening in the collectibles market as well, especially with our CU hobbies.
Perhaps the biggest wild card in the card market right now is Caitlin Clark. I mean some of her PSA cards have been selling for nosebleed prices. If she continues to get harassed and/or badly hurt, she may decide to quit basketball and maybe start a family. That would be nice for her, but certainly not too nice for her card values. Could be a 1929 type crash, but that's life in the fast lane for the whales investing in those ultra expensive cards.
If I owned a business and it was losing big money year after year and you asked for a raise, I would say there is the door.
These players should be kissing C.C's ass. She does not need more money from the WNBA. She is standing up for players who want to wring her neck.
If the league is truly losing money they should sit down everyone in the league and it should be shown that it it truly losing money and it should be shown where all the money comes and goes. Cost of running the league.
I think the biggest take away from this thread is we should all welcome back our snarky side dish that nobody ordered Mr.Bgr
Don't assume my pronouns. Post flagged!
I got to be transparent, it wasn't me who sniffed you out although you were SUS from the get go
You have this great way of having an Intelligent conversation but you can't help. yourself from throwing in snide remarks trying to make someone guess if your being rude to them or not.
Ofcourse this is a safe space for you to practice that since there is no fear of knuckles to eat during said intelligent conversations lol
no fear of knuckles to eat...
🤣😭🙃🤣😭🙃
That was Pretty Good...
no one knows less about the wnba than me. and no one cares less. no one. not once have i ever witnessed reese or clark dribble a basketball, and i doubt i ever will. but i had to check on my girl Teaira to see how she was doing two years removed from meeting her. apparently she doesn't start for the Wings anymore. for the first 6 years of her career she practically averaged a double-double, but her stats & playing time are way down this year.
she sat down next to me at the bar at a Pappadeaux's and started watching a game on her phone. when i noticed what she was doing and how tall she was (6'7"), i was like, yup, i'm about to be that guy. had to know who she was. total sweetheart. got her to sign a coaster and, for the most part, left her alone. i did offer to buy her a drink, but in very responsible fashion she said she was only having one because the only way she was safely getting home was her ability to do so.
politest refusal of a drink by a female sitting at a bar by herself of my miserable life.
you'll never be able to outrun a bad diet
Cool sig! 👍
I wasn't trying to trick anyone. That some here might be confused does not surprise me though. Please don't hurt me. I'm a vegan.
hey ya @galaxy27 🚀🌠🛸☄️👾
Pretty Cool on the Autograph Coaster...👍👍👍
Could ya hook me up with some Oyster's ??? 🦪🦪🦪
Or you could fly here to Indiana, we get a flight out of Chicago...Tell the pilot that we want to land over near the Patriots hood... I'll Bubble Up 💬💬 @perkdog and we could get the real ones right out of the Atlantic...🦪🦪🦪
That would be Too Cool...
🥃🥃🥃🛥️🛥️🛥️🦪🦪🦪
I love seafood, and especially oysters... so I was really bummed out when I learned how those are "fished". Tragic. Ruined it for me. The ignorant are nothing if not blessed.
@GroceryRackPack
dude that sounds like a sausage fest for the annals 😅
methinks we need to find a female to at least make a cameo at some point
"it's all fun and games until you start flying all over the country together collecting oysters"
you'll never be able to outrun a bad diet
Oh there was no confusion, in fact nobody gave you a second thought when you took your bgr ball and went home, you come back with some weird handle and after a few conversations it was like ahh ok that snarky bgr came back
Your not that much of a topic so no confusion involved lol
You made a point of it so that you could say no one cares? That's absurd, petty, and indicative of weakness. Please lose yourself in the music.
My point was your not as sneaky as you think, I figured it was obvious that nobody cares
A Sausage Fest Would Be Perfect..
When we fly out of Midway near Oaklawn-ish...
We need to stop at Joe & Frank's...
Dam, that's a lot of money for one crab cake.
It had better taste unbelievable. LOL
I know that was your point which is why I said. "I wasn't trying to trick anyone". Are you OK boss? We're on the same page. No one cares, including me.
Oh I'm not your boss, your free to change your name as much as you want I don't care lol
Anyways I can see this discussion is important to you since you keep quoting me and don't want to let it go
Quote me again and get the last word in so we can please move on
You're a weird dude. Telling me how little you care about something you brought up... OK. I guess we can't be friends. Oh bother.