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MCMLVToppsMCMLVTopps Posts: 4,901 ✭✭✭✭✭

meanwhile Ortiz who actually was suspended for using PEDs

This is what you posted today at 3:15, in a thread below regarding the election of Wagner, Ichiro and Sabathia.
Could you please provide a specific reference with details about Ortiz's suspension?

I was not aware of such a suspension and despite exhaustive searching, nothing about Ortiz's suspension could be found, and Manfred was apparently very protective of Ortiz, right or wrong, I don't think there was any suspension, suspicions, but no suspension.

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Comments

  • Basebal21Basebal21 Posts: 3,822 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 23, 2025 3:34PM

    The early 2000s when he was in the Twins system before he got traded to the Red Sox. I dont have any issue with him being in the HOF I just dont like the inconsistency

    Wisconsin 2-6 against the SEC since 2007

  • bgrbgr Posts: 2,285 ✭✭✭✭✭

    You won’t find a specific reference because one doesn’t exist. This guy spreads lies.

  • Basebal21Basebal21 Posts: 3,822 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Edit to add it might have been late 90s I forget the actual year but it was when he was in the Twins system and he was suspected later on with other players that didnt get voted in

    Wisconsin 2-6 against the SEC since 2007

  • TabeTabe Posts: 6,172 ✭✭✭✭✭

    He's admitted failing a test in 2003 but I can find no reference to anything prior to that.

  • bgrbgr Posts: 2,285 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Yup he was one of the dudes whose name was released from the survey testing. He tested positive but there were no suspensions for players who tested positive during survey testing.

  • Basebal21Basebal21 Posts: 3,822 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Tabe said:
    He's admitted failing a test in 2003 but I can find no reference to anything prior to that.

    Minor leagues dont really get anything writing about them especially not back then. It was the late 90s ;lookimg up his career before he went to Boston.

    Even with all that buried hes still getting treated very differently that a lot of players are for the HOF because he is a likeable guy

    Wisconsin 2-6 against the SEC since 2007

  • bgrbgr Posts: 2,285 ✭✭✭✭✭

    ah... guess the courts sealed the records because he was a minor!

  • MCMLVToppsMCMLVTopps Posts: 4,901 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Basebal21 said:
    The early 2000s when he was in the Twins system before he got traded to the Red Sox. I dont have any issue with him being in the HOF I just dont like the inconsistency

    So, you are unable to support your statement "meanwhile Ortiz who actually was suspended for using PEDs". I have challenged you on other occasions where you were also unable to substantiate your statements, or provide a scintilla of support.

    I find you to be a person of very low character, one who seeks attention with seeming to post as Mr. Knowledge, when in fact you are nothing more than a vile smear agent. You made a direct, unequivocable statement that Ortiz was suspended for using PEDs, when in fact he was not.

    You owe this board an apology for falsely making a statement you had to know were untrue.
    I doubt you are man enough to do so!!

  • Basebal21Basebal21 Posts: 3,822 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @MCMLVTopps said:

    So, you are unable to support your statement "meanwhile Ortiz who actually was suspended for using PEDs". I have challenged you on other occasions where you were also unable to substantiate your statements, or provide a scintilla of support.

    I find you to be a person of very low character, one who seeks attention with seeming to post as Mr. Knowledge, when in fact you are nothing more than a vile smear agent. You made a direct, unequivocable statement that Ortiz was suspended for using PEDs, when in fact he was not.

    You owe this board an apology for falsely making a statement you had to know were untrue.
    I doubt you are man enough to do so!!

    That was certainly an unhinged response. I do find it truly sad that some people make things so personal and arent just able to talk sports

    It takes 2 seconds to find what Tabe did with https://www.espn.com/mlb/story/_/id/17706532/david-ortiz-says-did-wrong-03-failed-drug-test and see that Ortiz has been treated very differently than everyone else

    Wisconsin 2-6 against the SEC since 2007

  • MaywoodMaywood Posts: 2,452 ✭✭✭✭✭

    So, just to get this right @MCMLVTopps, you are calling out @Basebal21 for being a liar here at the Sports Forum?? I'll have to remember that and take everything he posts with a grain of salt. Thanks for the heads-up!! B)

  • MCMLVToppsMCMLVTopps Posts: 4,901 ✭✭✭✭✭

    So, just to get this right @MCMLVTopps, you are calling out @Basebal21 for being a liar here at the Sports Forum?? I'll have to remember that and take everything he posts with a grain of salt. Thanks for the heads-up!! B)

    My thing with Basebal21 is that he is prone to post stuff he can't back up. Ortiz was never suspended, although Basebal21 states clearly "meanwhile Ortiz who actually was suspended for using PEDs". I asked for a clarification because as a long time Red Sox fan, I have never heard of Ortiz being suspended. He did have a PED issue in 2003 that was never substantiated...basic research can tell you anything on this topic you care to read.

    Basebal21 is an embarrasment to this board and doesn't have the stones to simply apologize and state that he misspoke and we could move on. His response above was beyond lame and clearly indicative of the LOOOOOOOOOOOOZER he is.

  • MCMLVToppsMCMLVTopps Posts: 4,901 ✭✭✭✭✭

    That was certainly an unhinged response. I do find it truly sad that some people make things so personal and arent just able to talk sports

    As expected, a PATHETIC response. You are incapable of accepting responsibility for your posts, although you should be. I've made a mistake or two over my 20 years here and have corrected them. You OTOH simply can't humble yourself enough to do so.

    Do let me know when you find specific articles that say when and for how long Ortiz was suspended for PED use. It'll take you a very long time,it never happened, although you write it as fact. It is truly sad that you think you can post crap and get away with it by hiding behind your keyboard.

  • craig44craig44 Posts: 11,503 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I have been following the Sox for nearly 40 years now. Had Ortiz been suspended for PED I am pretty sure I would remember it. I dont.

    There was an instance (maybe around 2012?) when Ortiz was suspected of failing the 2003 testing. I have heard differing thoughts about that. Do I think Ortiz probably used? yes. Do I care? nope.

    If I had to guess, I would think most players were on gear at some point or another. I would imagine most current players are as well. remember, the PED developers are always 10 or 15 steps ahead of the testers. How can players be tested for PED that the testers dont even know exist?

    George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.

  • bgrbgr Posts: 2,285 ✭✭✭✭✭

    So we got the expected pivot from suspended to the “2003 testing” and just the “please accept these things as the same” and the lamentation “some people just want to talk sports”. Sad. Because many of us are here to talk sports and then captain disaster comes in and says something completely false, gets cornered, pretends like what he said was completely different, says he’s only here to talk sports. Poorly programmed Russian bot. Nothing more.

  • fergie23fergie23 Posts: 2,153 ✭✭✭✭

    Wait...basebal21 posts something is is irrefutably incorrect and then fails to acknowledge it? Color me shocked, lol.

    MCMLV this is simply his MO. Look at any thread he posts in and you will invariably see him post something that is simply not true and then refuse to admit he was wrong and/or had no idea what he was talking about. It is a pathological disorder he has most likely related to a lack of self-esteem. That said, the same tactic got someone elected to lead our country twice so maybe basebal's next step after the CU message boards is politics :smile:

    Robb

  • Basebal21Basebal21 Posts: 3,822 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 24, 2025 6:34AM

    @MCMLVTopps said:

    My thing with Basebal21 is that he is prone to post stuff he can't back up. Ortiz was never suspended,

    Even Ignoring things being wiped from the internet 30 years ago Ortiz was suspended and it takes 2 seconds to find it

    It also takes less than a minute to find that Ortiz was treated differently

    Its truly sad the people punching air that cant talk sports and go quiet when they are proven wrong

    Wisconsin 2-6 against the SEC since 2007

  • bgrbgr Posts: 2,285 ✭✭✭✭✭

    He asked you to prove it. Just prove it if it takes 2 seconds.

  • craig44craig44 Posts: 11,503 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I seriously dont remember of Ortiz being suspended for PED.

    @Basebal21 show us the receipts please.

    this is starting to feel like the mandela effect here

    George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.

  • Basebal21Basebal21 Posts: 3,822 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @craig44 said:
    I seriously dont remember of Ortiz being suspended for PED.

    @Basebal21 show us the receipts please.

    this is starting to feel like the mandela effect here

    I get that people are friends with each other, but should a player be treated differently just because the writers like him?

    Wisconsin 2-6 against the SEC since 2007

  • craig44craig44 Posts: 11,503 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Basebal21 said:

    I get that people are friends with each other, but should a player be treated differently just because the writers like him?

    100% no. a writers personal opinion should have zero impact on his HOF vote. I think Ortiz is rightfully in the HOF as should Bonds, Arod, Mcgwire etc.

    you really still need to show us the receipts for Ortiz being suspended for PED though. To big of a claim to make with no proof

    George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.

  • Basebal21Basebal21 Posts: 3,822 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @craig44 said:

    100% no. a writers personal opinion should have zero impact on his HOF vote. I think Ortiz is rightfully in the HOF as should Bonds, Arod, Mcgwire etc.

    you really still need to show us the receipts for Ortiz being suspended for PED though. To big of a claim to make with no proof

    I think all of those should be in the HOF as well

    Wisconsin 2-6 against the SEC since 2007

  • craig44craig44 Posts: 11,503 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Basebal21 said:

    I think all of those should be in the HOF as well

    You are still forgetting one thing. big claims need big proof.

    those pesky receipts....

    George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.

  • bgrbgr Posts: 2,285 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Dude is slippery. Diddy might be a bottle short.

  • Basebal21Basebal21 Posts: 3,822 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @craig44 said:

    You are still forgetting one thing. big claims need big proof.

    those pesky receipts....

    Mcgwire I might say no thinking about it more. He pretty much put up half his stats in 4 years

    The others though should defiantly be in

    Wisconsin 2-6 against the SEC since 2007

  • erikthredderikthredd Posts: 9,283 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Ortiz did get suspended for four games after participating in a brawl in Baltimore in 2011.

    I bet it was roid rage. 😎

  • bgrbgr Posts: 2,285 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @erikthredd said:
    Ortiz did get suspended for four games after participating in a brawl in Baltimore in 2011.

    I bet it was roid rage. 😎

    You just removed a piece from the board. I was certain that was going to be the next stop on this ride.

  • craig44craig44 Posts: 11,503 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Basebal21 said:

    Mcgwire I might say no thinking about it more. He pretty much put up half his stats in 4 years

    The others though should defiantly be in

    You keep deflecting

    Receipts man, Receipts...

    George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.

  • erikthredderikthredd Posts: 9,283 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @bgr said:

    You just removed a piece from the board. I was certain that was going to be the next stop on this ride.

    Ironically, that incident wasn't connected to the famous Ortiz phone smashing in Baltimore just a couple years later.

    Now that has to be roid rage! 😉

  • Basebal21Basebal21 Posts: 3,822 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @erikthredd said:

    Ironically, that incident wasn't connected to the famous Ortiz phone smashing in Baltimore just a couple years later.

    Now that has to be roid rage! 😉

    That was definitely an interesting one that was funny to an extent but also almost killed some people

    Wisconsin 2-6 against the SEC since 2007

  • JoeBanzaiJoeBanzai Posts: 12,003 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @bgr said:
    He asked you to prove it. Just prove it if it takes 2 seconds.

    I don't think there's a poster here, now or ever, who basically NEVER posts anything but his opinion.

    I don't remember ever seeing him back it up with evidence.

    On the Ortiz subject, I was a fan of his when he was with the Twins. At that time their hitting philosophy was, have everybody hit to the opposite field.

    I saw David absolutely crush some balls and thought he might be the next slugger the Twins had been looking for since.............🤔 Harmon Killebrew?

    I remember Ortiz struggled with injuries and consistency, but have no recollection of him being suspended during his time here.

    If it did happen, it wasn't reported.

    Let's see some evidence!

    Like that's going to happen.

    2013,14 and 15 Certificate Award Winner Harmon Killebrew Master Set and Master Topps Set
  • erikthredderikthredd Posts: 9,283 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Basebal21 said:

    That was definitely an interesting one that was funny to an extent but also almost killed some people

    I'm lobbing you a meatball right down the middle here, all you have to do is smash that Agree button like Big Papi smashed that phone....

  • Basebal21Basebal21 Posts: 3,822 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @erikthredd said:

    I'm lobbing you a meatball right down the middle here, all you have to do is smash that Agree button like Big Papi smashed that phone....

    My favorite thing for Big Popi is when his jersey was buried in the new Yankees stadium and they had to dig it up. Tip of the hat to those construction guys

    Wisconsin 2-6 against the SEC since 2007

  • bgrbgr Posts: 2,285 ✭✭✭✭✭

    This was the only article I could find which said Ortiz was suspended for PEDs.

    https://social.mtdv.me/articles/bitirgo-fact-warehouse-of-facts

  • TabeTabe Posts: 6,172 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Basebal21 said:

    That was definitely an interesting one that was funny to an extent but also almost killed some people

    Honestly, if I was the Red Sox, I would have suspended him for that. Can't be having guys doing stuff that's wildly unsafe like that.

  • TabeTabe Posts: 6,172 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Basebal21 said:

    Minor leagues dont really get anything writing about them especially not back then. It was the late 90s ;lookimg up his career before he went to Boston.

    True. There would likely not be a contemporary article of such a suspension. However, Ortiz has had THOUSANDS of articles written about him since. Surely at least one of them would have mentioned he'd previously been suspended? Yet none do?

  • TabeTabe Posts: 6,172 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @craig44 said:

    There was an instance (maybe around 2012?) when Ortiz was suspected of failing the 2003 testing. I have heard differing thoughts about that.

    There's no "suspected" about it. Ortiz himself has admitted he failed the test. He claims it was a bogus result but it's absolutely confirmed that he did, in fact, fail the test.

  • bgrbgr Posts: 2,285 ✭✭✭✭✭

    https://nesn.com/2016/10/david-ortizs-positive-ped-test-in-2003-wasnt-reliable-rob-manfred-says/

    Here’s what the MLB commissioner says. You know. It’s interesting when you read it because the testing they were doing during the survey testing wasn’t very discriminate with regard to the actual substance and whether it was a PED. So like MLB I would just ignore it.

    But you know there is something to be said about why the media focused on guys who were from the steroid era. There is a whole narrative behind the perspective on these guys and you can observe the emotional response right here on these forums. Like we heard this and now we KNOW! He’s out or he’s in or whatever side you’re on. I’m glad you guys are all so confident and all knowing. Just keep me in the loop.

  • TabeTabe Posts: 6,172 ✭✭✭✭✭

    That's just PR spin because Ortiz is well-liked. Weird how he hasn't defended anyone else whose name came up from that round of testing.

  • bgrbgr Posts: 2,285 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Tabe said:

    That's just PR spin because Ortiz is well-liked. Weird how he hasn't defended anyone else whose name came up from that round of testing.

    So what was the testing procedure? It sounds like we can interpret it however we want. I’m ignoring it because we don’t know the validity.

  • TabeTabe Posts: 6,172 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @bgr said:

    So what was the testing procedure? It sounds like we can interpret it however we want. I’m ignoring it because we don’t know the validity.

    You can ignore it. That's perfectly OK. What's not OK is to imply he didn't test positive or act like there's uncertainty or anything else of that nature. He tested positive - it's indisputable.

  • bgrbgr Posts: 2,285 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Tabe said:

    You can ignore it. That's perfectly OK. What's not OK is to imply he didn't test positive or act like there's uncertainty or anything else of that nature. He tested positive - it's indisputable.

    It would be fine to imply it but I didn’t. Maybe Manfred did by saying that his positive test should not be held against him because there were at least 10 false positives.

  • tommyrusty7tommyrusty7 Posts: 2,079 ✭✭✭✭

    Hey guys, all this arguing about Ortiz and did or did't he doesn't matter to me BUT
    it's almost time for baseball again!
    That Fenway truck will be loading up shortly heading for snowy Florida!
    I got a new comfortable chair for myself only steps from the kitchen where I keep my snacks.
    I tried it out watching a few football games and its perfect.
    Super bowl and Daytona 500 and then into baseball!
    Did the Red Sox do enough to win the World Series?
    I doubt it but it will keep me entertained for the summer.

  • bronco2078bronco2078 Posts: 10,274 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @craig44 said:
    I seriously dont remember of Ortiz being suspended for PED.

    @Basebal21 show us the receipts please.

    this is starting to feel like the mandela effect here

    are you saying ortiz put burning tires around people?

  • MCMLVToppsMCMLVTopps Posts: 4,901 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 27, 2025 6:10AM

    @tommyrusty7 said:
    Hey guys, all this arguing about Ortiz and did or did't he doesn't matter to me BUT
    it's almost time for baseball again!
    That Fenway truck will be loading up shortly heading for snowy Florida!
    I got a new comfortable chair for myself only steps from the kitchen where I keep my snacks.
    I tried it out watching a few football games and its perfect.
    Super bowl and Daytona 500 and then into baseball!
    Did the Red Sox do enough to win the World Series?
    I doubt it but it will keep me entertained for the summer.

    If someone slandering Ortiz (which he did!) doesn't matter to you, why then would you bore us with your post that was totally unrelated to the OP, me? Do you just need to generate attention? If so, start a new thread.

    It isn't arguing, its challenging a poster (Basebal21) who emphatically stated that Ortiz was banned for using PEDs. I personally found his post on this subject to be a serious breech of ethics and responsibilty as a poster here. I am surprised how you simply blew this off and called various posts "arguing".

    Nobody cares about the Fenway truck or where you keep your snacks or your new chair, or about your tv viewing plans. Contribute to the thread in a thoughtful manner, or just don't bother.

    BTW, Basebal21 has yet to acknowledge his slanderous post, he simply chooses to hide behind his keyboard. Failure to make a modicum of effort to apologize to the members of this board tell us what kind of person he is.

  • tommyrusty7tommyrusty7 Posts: 2,079 ✭✭✭✭

    I really don't care what his views are. Ortiz is Ortiz and we all love him. You are a perfectionist and will always look for the facts and that is fine. Me, I just enjoy baseball for what it is and will stay out of posts like this that contain argumentative unproven statements.

  • bronco2078bronco2078 Posts: 10,274 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @MCMLVTopps said:

    If someone slandering Ortiz (which he did!) doesn't matter to you, why then would you bore us with your post that was totally unrelated to the OP, me? Do you just need to generate attention? If so, start a new thread.

    It isn't arguing, its challenging a poster (Basebal21) who emphatically stated that Ortiz was banned for using PEDs. I personally found his post on this subject to be a serious breech of ethics and responsibilty as a poster here. I am surprised how you simply blew this off and called various posts "arguing".

    Nobody cares about the Fenway truck or where you keep your snacks or your new chair, or about your tv viewing plans. Contribute to the thread in a thoughtful manner, or just don't bother.

    BTW, Basebal21 has yet to acknowledge his slanderous post, he simply chooses to hide behind his keyboard. Failure to make a modicum of effort to apologize to the members of this board tell us what kind of person he is.

    Apologize?

    :D

  • GoldFinger1969GoldFinger1969 Posts: 2,132 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Hey BBall21, good to hook up with you again !! :)

  • GoldFinger1969GoldFinger1969 Posts: 2,132 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Me personally....FWIW...I would have a difficult time voting for PED candidates who also lied about it.

    If someone was a HOFer without the PEDs....and then 'fessed up....a bit different, IMO.

    These guys bastardized the record books and then lied about it. If you're going to use PEDs, then at least admit it and stop the lying if you think it's no big deal.

  • bgrbgr Posts: 2,285 ✭✭✭✭✭

    That only tells me that you value honesty over integrity. It's not very useful information.

  • bronco2078bronco2078 Posts: 10,274 ✭✭✭✭✭

    the sports forum has become a grand jury?

    basebal21 has been indicted

    at 315 the party of the first part was being mean to some guy

    THIS SHALL NOT STAND!

    lightenupfrancis.gif

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