u1's duds of 2024 (plus some lessons learned)
U1chicago
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A thread about blunders inspired me to look at some of my own from last year. We all have made less than optimal numismatic decisions and I was certainly part of the crowd.
What follows is a list of coins sold in 2024 where I took a hit or at best broke even. Some were purchased in prior years but all found new homes in 2024. Now none of these were bad coins; in fact, most were nice but as I will discuss, there were reasons that made them "duds" for me.
First up is this toned Morgan. It came from Legend Auctions and I certainly had to pay up. I bought into the rattler hype and the photo. In hand, this was a solid coin but with the price I had paid, it was a bit of a let down. It took a while to sell but I was able to get out of it with about an $80 loss. Several lessons here: don't be overly jubilant with a rattler (unless it's a scarce rattler and you collect slabs-that's for a different thread) and don't buy into the Legend hype (or any flowery auction description). Then again, Legend has shut down its auction business and they did have plenty of nice coins-most that I did not win because they went for multiples above my max (which leads to another lesson: don't bid on a coin just because you were shut out on others in the auction and want to come away with something).
Next up is another Morgan (that will be the theme pretty much through the entire thread). A GC purchase, I figured the color was nice and that it might be better in hand. The lack of a star puzzled me but I have seen multiple examples where NGC got it wrong (in both directions with the star). Well the coin turned out to just be ok when I received it. There was nothing wrong but it just did not have the "pop" I wanted for a keeper in my collection. After listing on several venues, I finally "sold" this at the Central States coin show for about a $30 loss. I put sold in quotes because it was actually a trade towards another Morgan (more to follow on that). As far as lessons learned, this one is a little more complicated. I don't regret bidding on it at GC and the lack of a star still won't stop me from getting a toned Morgan but I will up my level of "pickiness" when purchasing.
And as I mentioned with the prior coin, I traded it for this one. Again there is nothing inherently wrong with the coin but the price paid was more than I should have gone. The show lights also made it look a little better than the lights elsewhere. Luckily this one sold a month later at breakeven so I did not compound my error too badly. The lesson learned-be careful with coin show lights as they can make a coin "pop" more than it will under different conditions and don't compound one mistake into another (well I tried to learn the lesson but you will see there was another setback later).
Probably the worst of my duds this year was the Morgan below. I watched this same coin sell for about $200 more than I paid and that sale was in a weaker market for toned Morgans (both sales at GC). I also thought the photo was hiding a coin with strong PL characteristics and great colors. Well I was quite a bit off. The PL was weaker than I imagined and the breaks in the toning combined with the dark look did not make this coin look anywhere near what I thought it would. Despite getting the almost $200 "discount" from the initial auction, I ended up having to take another $100 cut to sell this coin and it took several months of waiting to find a buyer. The lessons learned: a discount doesn't always mean you are getting a good deal, be mindful of toning breaks, and be careful with darker toners at big premiums (certain near terminal Morgans with great luster can be nice coins but others are just not "all there").
This is a bit of a special case. The loss was the entire cost, around $150, but that is due to me using it as a giveaway prize on an Instagram contest I ran. Part of the reason for that was because I could not sell it. While an uncommon fantasy piece, it turned out to be darker than the TrueView photo and the holder came from Stacks with a crack. I might have been able to ask Stacks for compensation for the crack since they did not mention it but I did not think it was worth it (I hadn't had any issues with them before and any fix would take a long time with the current grading/holdering times at PCGS). This was another reaffirmation of not exclusively trusting TrueView photos (one has to consider all the photos available). In addition, I have to be better at not bidding on random items that, while rare, also tend to have little demand.
This Morgan was a date that is less common for toners and it had a nice TrueView picture. As mentioned previously, I have on a few occasions become too cozy with the PCGS photo and made myself believe a coin was better than it truly was. The better date part tends to get me sometimes as well. I do like to pick up toned examples of dates that I don't have but I have to be wiser to not compromise on the eye appeal. Luckily this coin was part of a group I was able to sell at a show for breakeven on the total deal.
This one was a show purchase that like the earlier example seemed better at the show. After falling for the show lights twice, I think I have now learned my lesson-no more optimistic show buys in 2025. To be fair though, I did have several nice buys at the same shows, so it was not all bad and I just have to continue to be better at what I pick. This coin was bundled with a nicer coin and I came out a bit ahead on the package deal (due to the other coin but the buyer did end up liking both coins).
Comments
I remember the 1881-S rattler and thought it was a great looking coin, but also thought the bidding level on it was more enthusiastic than what I thought it was worth. Regardless, you make a good point that a dud buy doesn't necessarily equate to a dud coin.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
It was actually one of the lower priced toners in that auction (at least among the group that I was following). That is where the lesson came in of don't bid on something just because I was shut out on the others (save the funds for something better down the road).
And price can certainly be a big part of the "dud" process. While it makes sense to chase some coins and "overpay" for quality, there are other coins that are best not chased at high price levels.
Edit: I did see the 81-S rattler show up on eBay a few months ago (from a different person than the one I sold it to) and the asking price was now almost 2x what I had originally paid at Legend. So someone was way more optimistic about the coin than me. I don't see it currently listed so I don't know if it sold off eBay or the seller chose to take it off the market.
Thanks for sharing some of your experiences.
Great post. Thank you
I appreciate your reflections. An interesting coin can manifest many feelings in ones head. Peace Roy
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Very well done post. Great pix . . . good lessons . . . and feelings many of us have had in the past, well voiced.
Drunner
Great post, the overall theme seems to be careful paying premiums for toned coins, especially Morgan’s.
Mr_Spud
To a degree that’s true. However, many of my top purchases of 2024 were also toned coins with premiums over “guide” value. So the lesson is to pay up for the right ones. And even with extra pickiness plus caution, there could still be duds but the idea is to limit those to as few as possible.
Very nice read, thanks for taking the time to post it. The one recurring theme I got was being too reliant on PCGS TV's, I can relate to that as I once bought a toned coin from a TV photo (Phil era) only and was disappointed when it arrived.
My Collection of Old Holders
Never a slave to one plastic brand will I ever be.
There were certainly some PCGS TV blunders. I had one several years ago with a Franklin that looked nothing like the coin (maybe it was a photo that was switched by accident when being uploaded) and several examples over the years where the photos turned out a little too optimistic. I have learned to not rely on the TV exclusively (seller photo or video is always helpful to have to compare to the TV).
The one thing that I did notice years ago (in the Phil era) was that certain people would not buy a toned coin if it did not have a nice TrueView. It seemed like they cared more about the photo being great than the coin living up to the photo. That has remained in my mind when it comes to selling coins. I will provide my own photos or videos but I also realize that a segment of the market wants the TV photo to be there too.
And back to my list, I would say only two of the coins were PCGS TV related errors. The only other coin that had a TV was bought at a show where I saw the coin before the TV.
I like a nice Morgan toner as much as the next guy but the premiums they sell for are just not worth it for me. I go for the blast white in 64 or 65 with lots of luster for the common date Morgans.
Casual collector, mostly Morgans & Peace Dollars.
Toned coins aren’t for everyone nor are high premiums; in fact, I’d recommend some research and really knowing what one likes before committing to a large premium. But if one decides that toners are what appeals their collector taste, then there will be times when a significant premium will have to be paid to acquire the better coins.
I bought a beautifully toned Pan-Pac AU-55 from U1 and was extremely pleased with the purchase. He’s the number one seller in my book, and I highly recommend him.
Many years ago—long before the toned coin market became popular—I purchased two beautifully toned 1881-S MS65 coins (they looked like twins) for $500 each from a dealer friend. At the time, I thought I had overpaid for them and ended up selling them back to the dealer at about break-even. To this day, I still kick myself for letting them go—they were so beautifully toned, and I should have kept them.
Thank you for the kind words!
And I’ve been in your position too. I recall two coins in particular. One was a colorful reverse toned Morgan with a cool pattern. I bought it early on in my toned Morgan days and later sold it at a show for a small gain. That same coin would go for 3x-4x now and I have not seen it resurface. The other coin was a blast white Mexico Caballito Peso. It had solid luster too. I figured I could upgrade it to a toned example or higher grade but then the market bump post-2020 made prices increase significantly and for lesser examples.
Loved the post. Like reading a how to ( or not😀) toner guide.