What Constitutes Being A Loyal Fan?
erikthredd
Posts: 9,208 ✭✭✭✭✭
@Darin made this comment below midway through the Patriots-Bills game over in the Pats thread yesterday and after the game ended I spent some time thinking about his last line.
It eventually had me wondering What Constitutes being a Loyal Fan here? Many of you that have kept up with the Pats thread in recent weeks know that once the Pats found themselves sitting in the prime position to land the first overall pick with one final game to go, some of us NE fans preferred to see a loss against Buffalo.
Wanting to see the team benefit more for the long term by losing a meaningless game in the short term somehow turned into a "Mockery of the Game." That led to some back & forth between Darin, Craig & I on this subject but I didn't start this thread to continue that topic (Seeing the team lose one last game and how it entirely would affect NE's draft situation at the top of the draft)
No, this thread was more to hear everyone's opinions on what should be considered as being a "loyal" fan.
Is it tuning in to watch every single game every season?
How about following and commenting about the team on a daily basis?
Some may say that its standing by the team through thick & thin like season ticket holders going to the game in week 17 when the team was 3-13.
But I'm guessing the most Captain Obvious answer would be to want to see the team win each and every game.
These were the four that first came to my mind and I wanted to ask anyone else here that feels like chiming in the question in the title. In your mind What Constitutes Being a Loyal Fan?
I plan on expanding on my answers but liked to hear what others have to say first.
(Darin, this is not an attempt to attack you for your comment in the other thread or for how it may have been perceived by us Pats fans, it just left me wondering the question I asked above.)
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
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Comments
I couldn't care less what Darin said, Craig is a loyal.fan
A loyal fan sticks with their team regardless of winning or losing seasons
Wanting them to lose a game to get a better draft position does not in any way mean your not a loyal fan
I dont know what the dictionary definition would be, but I watch every game (of course) but that is the least of it. I listen to local sports talk radio (about the patriots), I consume internet sports discussion (about NE and others) I follow the off season, FA, draft, pre season. If it has to do with NE Patriots, I am probably going to be listening, watching or reading about it.
As a kid, I remember the 86 SB drubbing and really started to get interested in football in around 88 or so. I well remember the 1-15 season back in 1990 and was so excited when they drafted Bledsoe in 93. I have been folloing them for quite awhile, but I am sure some guys have been following NE since before I was born!!
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
I wonder if Darin wanted his Chiefs to give it their all against Denver yesterday?
Spagnola'd game plan was the most vanilla he could make it and the entire world knew it but he didn't want to show anything before the Playoffs. he wasn't trying to win by any stretch
Thanks for the replies but I honestly wasn't trying to make this about Darin, I was just curious to what others thought about that question.
My football fandom is very similar to what Craig described...
Other than a handful where I either got the start of gametime wrong or had visitors like yesterday afternoon that caused me to miss the first half, I'm pretty sure I've missed just 1 regular season game since Parcells was here (did miss the Pats/Steelers playoffs game in '98 due to working that day but still listened to it.)
I consume way to much online content about the team (and even more about the Celtics) but I honestly stay away from sports talk radio. Most TV related news about the team is accessible on Youtube where you can watch a short segment about a subject that doesn't require you to tune in to hourly shows.
As far as standing by your teams through thick & thin, again, I've tuned in weekly for the past quarter of a century even though since Brady left NE, I knew that I would be watching some God awful football at times (and it was.)
Watching that second half yesterday while pondering this topic, I thought about the fans that went to the actual game which many would consider the most "loyal" of Pats fans who were spending their hard earned money knowing that the product on the field in 2024-5 has been a complete shitshow. At one point a very large majority of said fans were actually booing the team in the moment when NE took the lead then as it extended it by adding two more field goals later on.
New England Patriots fans, like any other knowledgeable fanbase, can be a fickle bunch and although wanting to see the team lose yesterday to land the best possible draft pick goes against everything you believe in as a fan, in the moment it was right thing to do. I'd say that the percentage of Pats fans that actually wanted to see the team win yesterday was very miniscule judging by the popular online consensus surrounding NE's situation with possibly landing the top draft pick. That was no exaggeration either.
Like I just posted in the other thread, Jerod Mayo actually either sat many of the better Pats players entirely or he greatly reduced the playing time of many others but those who did play just took some pride with their effort. We got the process that we were hoping for, just not the result. Wanting what was best for the organization over the long haul doesn't make a fan any less loyal.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
To be fair my perspective seems to be completely different simply because I place no importance at all in getting the overall number 1 pick in the draft. I suppose it does come with more trade value but teams usually don’t trade it away anyway. How many times has the number 1 turned out to be the best player in his draft class? Joe Burrow maybe recently. Teams are always picking Trubisky before Mahomes, Blackledge before Marino, 198 players went before Brady.
If I thought the entire future of my team depended on getting the number 1 pick I guess I would feel like Craig, but being a Chiefs fan I’ve seen how the rise of this KC dynasty began. We have the absolute best GM in the business, Brett Veach, doing the picking in the draft. And now I come to something else I said to Craig and Eric that has proven to be true time and again…..
The person making your teams draft picks is far more important than the order of your picks.
And I do think Craig and Eric and Pats fans who wanted the number 1 pick are loyal, but it is a foreign concept to me to actually want my team to lose. And like I said that just comes down to not believing the top pick is near as important as everyone else.
Perk I wanted the Chiefs to win but even I’m not dumb enough to want the starters playing and risk injury.
Of course it doesn’t bother me that the Bengals didn’t get in and now a lot of their idiot fans think it’s the Chiefs fault instead of Cincy always sucking in September and October.
Darin, thanks for the reply and I agree with a lot of what you said there especially the part about KC's run and their GM playing such as huge part in it. I also agree with that last line, the person picking is definitely more important than the order of picks. I posted a comment last night pointing out how their two WR picks from a year ago fared compared to the WR that they passed on and it was ugly. Pats GM Eliot Wolf's first draft results were absolutely horrible (Yes I know that draft classes are better being evaluated 2-3 years down the line and while he gets credit for Drake Maye, he really doesn't when Maye fell to 3 and was the no-brainer pick.)
What I do disagree with is how important owning that first pick would have been. I'll pass on explaining all of the tradeback scenarios again and how greatly beneficial they could have been and just point out that they almost certainly missed out on the ability to draft WR Travis Hunter. On a team that has been starving for a deep threat at WR since Randy Moss was traded away in 2011, this was their best chance to grab a can't miss player at that position (other than passing on Marvin Harrison Jr a year ago when they decided to go with what is hopefully their franchise QB in Maye at 3.)
Owning the first overall pick was no guarantee of any future success but their chances of having any success in the near future were better off than it currently is now while owning the 4th overall pick.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
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Like I posted above, I admit that wanting a loss there goes against everything that you believe in as a fan but for their future it would have been the better off move, we just didn't get the result that we wanted. We an agree to disagree on the importance of that pick.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
i can't find my clapping Snoop gif, otherwise i'd post it. great topic that's already making for a great discussion.
to answer Eric's question, i think it's subjective. only you know your true level of fandom. just because you don't actually go to games doesn't mean you're not an ardent follower of a team. and just because you do attend doesn't automatically mean you're more loyal than someone who doesn't. same applies for meaningless, end-of-season games that only have draft capital ramifications attached. again, very subjective, and only you know in your heart of hearts.
i personally like to attend various sporting events in person, but in the grand scheme of my life the outcome doesn't mean squat.........even if my favorite team is playing. sure i'll be rooting for them throughout, and for perhaps an hour afterward i'll experience jubilation or an extreme sting, but eventually that fades and it's as if it never happened. and i ascribe that to being 52 now.
back when i was a kid it was a completely different story. when the Bears lost on Sundays my entire week was wrecked. it consumed me. i'll never forget the final week of the 1979 season. the Bears had two possible paths to the playoffs -- they could win the division by beating the St. Louis Cardinals AND the Bucs losing to the Chiefs, OR they could beat St. Louis AND Washington loses to Dallas by a combined 33 points. an extremely convoluted scenario. the Bucs beat KC 6-3 in a monsoon, but we pounded St. Louis 42-6 and the Cowboys rose from the depths to clip the Redskins by one point, 35-34. we indeed made it to the playoffs, then Philly promptly disposed of us. how on earth do i remember all of that from 45 years ago when i was 7? three words: i cared deeply. amazing how much you can remember when an emotional investment is involved.
you'll never be able to outrun a bad diet
You know you're a loyal fan when you feel like chit after a loss. You know you're a bigger fan when you feel even worse after a playoff loss. And you're yet even a bigger fan when you still feel pain, years after a Super Bowl loss.
The bottom line is a loyal fan sticks by their team regardless if they are a Super Bowl winner or go 0-17
You stand by your team through thick and thin and I think everyone on CU subscribes to this thought process
@galaxy27 I can honestly say that there's only been one time that I let a pro sporting event loss ever affect me for more than the usual day or two and that was after the Giants beat the Pats in '07,which for obvious reasons had historic NFL ramifications. Even then, that bitter time was short lived. (edit: that's a lie above, losing out on the 1st overall NBA pick back in '97 and the ability to draft Tim Duncan hurt for years lol.)
I don't gamble on sports and its been about 3 years now since making my last trading card purchase so for me watching sports has always been for purely entertainment purposes.
Reading your last paragraph had me thinking back to a time years ago where I worked with this one Red Sox fan, Rich, during the pre-2004 days and he would literally constantly be driven miserable by all of the times where the team fell short of a championship. It was both sad and hilarious at times and I'd constantly be telling him that he was better off, health wise, to just stop watching Red Sox games entirely. Ironically, when they Sox finally won the WS in 2004 it was Rich that I was most happy for.
Losing out on the first overall pick stinks and (almost certainly) missing out on what would have been a pretty entertaining tandem in Maye/Hunter is a bummer but life will go on. I'll root for whoever the team drafts nonetheless and 12 months from now I'm sure there will be something else to gripe about. 😉
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
@galaxy27
Please not the '79 Bears...I don't need an additional headache today...
@Darin
Teams are always picking Trubisky before Mahomes,
@perkdog
That's where I buy my dip...
hey D...
Now I Know Better...
I'm not sure what I find more shocking
Wentz or Trubitsky still being on an NFL roster 🤷
A loyal fan is one who attends the last game of a losing season. Sitting there in 0 weather, no coat,hat,shirt,gloves on chugging a few brews. And constantly yelling their cheers. That's loyalty.
My weeks after a Cowboys loss are pretty miserable. I replay the games key plays over and over again in my mind, I curse out Jerry Jones for his ineptness, Mike McCarthy for not instilling one ounce of discipline etc. The sting lessens as the week progresses and the next game gets closer and then Jerry's crew breaks my heart once again. Vicious cycle.
When you never fail to run and hide when a fight breaks out at your job, but you swear you were "this close" to helping out "your team" by jumping the railing and swinging away at guys in pads and helmets. Lol
.
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My Dad subscribed to sports Illustrated and after this happened on Christmas Day 1971 I could barely stand to look at this issue when he received it. I still see it and think why couldn’t that be Jan Stenerud on the cover. 😡🤬
At this point I have come to the realization that I will never get over the SB loss that ended the 2007 season. I LOVED that team. I still have never watched the replay of that game even though it has been what, 17 years? I really think that some of these losses affect the fans more than the players. The amount of angst that single game has caused me over the years is greater than the joy any of the SB wins ever gave me.
alright, now to stop thinking about 2007...
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
The 2011 loss infuriated me more, I was more sad about 2007
The 2011 team just didn't show up, I remember Brady in the end zone launching a 50 yard bomb down the center of the field to get that safety, I was infuriated from that point on
yeah, that was the first drive right? I think 07 was worse for me because I had already counted my chickens. I was so sure they were going to cap off that season and felt like the game was a formality. then they had so many chances on that last NY drive. Samuel dropped that sure int. and they had Eli dead to rights for a sack and he was able to launch that miserable pass over the middle that was only about 3 inches from hitting the ground off that guys helmet...
man I hate that game. Favorite team I ever watched. they felt so unstoppable. until they were stopped.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
That one was brutal, no question about it, especially happening with the New York team.
I had forgotten, I just looked it up, The Patriots were 12 point favorites in that game. That's a lot of points for a Super Bowl.
The Philly loss I put all on Belichick
He refused to put in Butler regardless of whoever was getting torched incessantly in the defensive backfield
But we really got lucky in the Seattle Super Bowl and in all reality never should have won the Falcons Super Bowl so in a weird way it all evened out
My coping mechanism for this loss has always been to channel all of my hate towards Asante Samuel and his Get Paid tattoo. Back at that time he was heading into free agency at the end of that season and was always bragging about how he was the best CB in football, then in the biggest moment of his career, he dropped the ball.
I really can't hate Eli or the Giants when thinking back on those two losses when the team played with the heart of a champion both times and Eli made some incredible plays when his team needed them most.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
I can so clearly remember when NY started that last drive in the 07 SB thinking we have it in the bank. Eli will absolutely poop his pants in the biggest moment and we will win this thing. And the sad part is, he ALMOST did and then Samuel dropped that Int.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
Reviewing the video, a few quick points. He's a defensive back for a reason, because he can't dependably catch a football. Also he clearly saw the ball coming, likely knew he was close to the line, and tried to position his feet not to be out of bounds, and all that thought process caused him not to fully focus on catching the football. And finally, it's close but even if he caught the ball, he may have been out of bounds anyway.
A receiver yes, he has to make that catch. However a defensive back, that's a very tough play for him to make.
One thing that would always bother me is when some fans at Rupp Arena would leave blowouts early...because it is only in the last couple minutes of these blowouts that we get to see the "Rudys" (what I call our walk-ons) play! They don't want to stick around and see these guys fulfilling their boyhood dream of being able to always and forever say they were a Wildcat (even if it was just for a game or two or only a minute or two each) and see if they can make a basket?
D's: 54S,53P,50P,49S,45D+S,44S,43D,41S,40D+S,39D+S,38D+S,37D+S,36S,35D+S,all 16-34's
Q's: 52S,47S,46S,40S,39S,38S,37D+S,36D+S,35D,34D,32D+S
74T: 37,38,47,151,193,241,435,570,610,654,655 97 Finest silver: 115,135,139,145,310
73T:31,55,61,62,63,64,65,66,67,68,80,152,165,189,213,235,237,257,341,344,377,379,390,422,433,453,480,497,545,554,563,580,606,613,630
95 Ultra GM Sets: Golden Prospects,HR Kings,On-Base Leaders,Power Plus,RBI Kings,Rising Stars
That's okay, I'm sure you didn't mind getting the Jan 17, 1972 issue!
D's: 54S,53P,50P,49S,45D+S,44S,43D,41S,40D+S,39D+S,38D+S,37D+S,36S,35D+S,all 16-34's
Q's: 52S,47S,46S,40S,39S,38S,37D+S,36D+S,35D,34D,32D+S
74T: 37,38,47,151,193,241,435,570,610,654,655 97 Finest silver: 115,135,139,145,310
73T:31,55,61,62,63,64,65,66,67,68,80,152,165,189,213,235,237,257,341,344,377,379,390,422,433,453,480,497,545,554,563,580,606,613,630
95 Ultra GM Sets: Golden Prospects,HR Kings,On-Base Leaders,Power Plus,RBI Kings,Rising Stars
I don’t know anyone can call themselves a loyal fan if they don’t have a tattoo of their favorite team’s logo.
Its always a good idea to make sure that your favorite tattoo artist has passed first grade English at some point in life (or at least make sure that he's not a South Carolina fan.)
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
Half the Patriots fan from their glory years are now Chiefs fans.
Fair weather fans only come out when their team is winning.
How about a 60 year Bills fan through all the bad years never missing a game when he could. Now with the NFL package never missing a play. A fan that can name the 1964 starters on defense? Shoveling snow in the rock pole to get to his seat? That’s a true fan.
"I spent 50% of my money on alcohol, women, and gambling. The other half I wasted.
I don't know about Chiefs fans Joe, if anything old school Pats fans don't want the Chiefs to break our playoff records.
I became a part time Tampa fan when Brady was there and I think other Pats fans felt that way but not many that I know of are rooting for the chiefs.
Hell I might be the only Patriot fan rooting for your Bills to win it this year
No, you're not the only one and, honestly, the Patriots organization and its fans would be the last ones to be rooting for the Chiefs in any way, shape or form. Joe's age might be affecting his thought process with that one. 😎
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
Now that the Patriots are done this season, I am rooting for teams to win that have not been there for a long time. It would be really cool to see either the Lions or the Bills win.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
Or the Vikings as well
I'd like to see one of them pull. it off
i want Minny v Buffalo
one team is going 0-5, the other is getting off the schneid
you'll never be able to outrun a bad diet
@erikthredd said: What Constitutes Being A Loyal Fan?
I've thought about this question since I first saw it and came up with lots of answers, some the same as already posted a short while ago I stumbled onto the one that fits me. It's about 15 minutes before the Ohio State vs. Texas semi-final game and I find myself a little jittery with anticipation, like I've had too much coffee!!
I think that defines it for me, loyal fans, diehard fans tend to get like that before and during big, important games.
It hasn't happened to me for quite awhile, I like the feeling!!
I definitely know that feeling, good luck with your Buckeyes!
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
What I meant was fans of other teams became Patriots fans because they were winning. Now that the Chiefs are winning they are the new fan group.
No die hard fan would ever change but floaters like to be on the winning side. Sorry for the confusion
"I spent 50% of my money on alcohol, women, and gambling. The other half I wasted.
Wait, you’re telling me that so many fans jumped on the Pats bandwagon because they started winning?
Here I was, thinking it was all because of Robert Kraft’s drunken We Are All Patriots speech immediately after beating the Greatest Show on Turf. 😎
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
In that matchup the pressure on both teams would be immense. Badgering by the media for sure with the possible storylines.
Would each team play to win or not to lose?
Remember all the fair weather fans from the 90s?
So many Bulls and Cowboys hats, jackets, jerseys, shirts etc. I wonder where all those "fans" are 25-30 years later?
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
Can't speak for the Cowboys fans but those same Bulls fans are still around and have completely driven up the prices on Michael Jordan cards to the point that I stopped buying cards entirely. I see old Bulls collections (cards/magazines/wheaties boxes/championship stuff) go up for sale all of the time.
As for the hats. jackets, jerseys, shirts etc part, we're talking 25-30 years ago and most people aren't so thrifty that they're wearing that era of team gear many years later. Maybe the jerseys or a hat but when was the last time you came across anyone, let alone a Bulls or Cowboys fan, wearing a team Starter jacket?
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
Ahh ok totally misunderstood
I cannot stand bandwagon jumpers
but when was the last time you came across anyone, let alone a Bulls or Cowboys fan, wearing a team Starter jacket?
one of my guys takes his Bulls Starter Jacket to the cleaners once a year, and hangs it back up with the plastic sleeve from the cleaners...
Gimme a little time and or a reminder for me to go down in my vault and get my MJ Wheaties boxes...
Best that I could do on a short notice...
I have one of my own that was just sitting in a drawer too, although this one was very awkward to get a good photo of due to the weird stance. (doing a reverse dunk)
Weird sidenote: I did a quick ebay search to see if this was the '88 or '89 SLU, its the 1988 but apparently there are multiple versions i guess due to whether or not he has a white or red Bulls jersey on. Looks like the more common version is the white jersey figure. I have no clue if there's any difference in value.
I have a bunch of MJ/Bulls/Patriots Wheaties boxes buried somewhere in my house.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
Correction on the MJ figure above, its the 1993 figure that comes with two cards, 1 Stadium Club & 1 Topps. Looks like its the same exact pose as 1988 but in a red jersey,not white. I graded the Topps card from this set years ago and it came back a PSA 10 which I sold.
Eric
Erikthredd’s MJ Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/publishedset/395035
Erikthredd’s Nike Air Jordan Collection: https://www.psacard.com/psasetregistry/basketball/key-card-sets/nike-poster-cards-michael-jordan-1985-1992/alltimeset/408486
Just read portions of this thread and started pondering......................., resulting in the following questions.
If a person is a loyal fan of a sports team (i.e. the Patriots), but as time progresses the person fails to be a loyal fan and instead is just a fan, or a casual fan, or even no longer a fan does the sports team have any recourse to compel the person to become a loyal fan again?
If not, should the sports team have such recourse?
If a sports team does have such recourse, exactly what does that recourse consist of?