Looking to Buy a Mid-Grade Satchell Paige Rookie...and Asking for Input. Which do you Like?
mintonlypls
Posts: 2,148 ✭✭✭✭✭
I like the color and centering on the SGC...but have to go with PSA on the corners.
mint_only_pls
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Those are both so cool. My favorite is the 4 but the 6 is a nice card.
The 4 just because centering is spot on. The top to bottom centering on the 6 isn't bad enough to keep me away from it but what bothers me the most of it is that top left corner.
I prefer the SGC 4.
Colors almost too strong on the 4, but I like it a little better.
1 -- COST WOULD BE A FACTOR
2 -- the sgc 4 looks better -- the holder really sets sgc apart from the psa card.
3 -- the psa 6 is very nice also.
4 -- if the price is the same, I would go with the 6 obviously.
The images are taken from PSA and SGC certification sites…
$11,000 OBO on the PSA
$7750 on the SGC
SGC 4. The centering and color stand out compared to the other one.
I think both look excellent for the grade. I like the 6 more partly because I just like the higher grade that looks like a nice example of the grade and its pretty cool looking. Feels like a 7 many years ago and on a very good fortunate day maybe an 8. If spending the additional money to get it over the 4 is not quality of life changing, would be for me 😄, I would get the 6.
But the 4 is incredible too. Think its a win win whichever you pick. I may also keep in mind the 4 may have something that is hard to pick up in a scan but when you have it in hand with a loupe it would be more clear. I would not think SGC would give it a 4 when it looks that nice without some small crease, surface wrinkle etc. Taking a closer look, I think that upper right corner could be a little more dinged creased than it presents in the scan. At first glance I did not notice it but if I stare at it I can see how it could be the reason to pull the grade down. But still a nice 4. Each seems to have a little something going on on the back with staining or print issues but that is less of a deal breaker for me. I'd much rather have any flaws be on the back.
Keep the input coming…my collection is predominantly 8 or better. So…I have little experience looking at mid grades…and deciding which presents better.
I agree that the 4 looks so nice with the exceptional color and centering that I am concerned that there is a “hidden” crease or wrinkle not showing up on the scan. I have asked such a question last night to the seller…but have yet to hear back.
SGC4 presents above its grade due to nigh perfect centering. Ultimately of course there is reason for the 4 grade!
PSA6 is nice but to me lacks in Je ne sais quoi department.
Good luck with whichever you choose.
It's the singer not the song - Peter Townshend (1972)
Monte - I would go with the SGC although both of them are very nice. I think the SGC was downgraded due to the back and a few print areas that are miniscule. Possible staining on upper left back area under Leroy and bats right areas. The word “he’s” might have a little smudge, and right side there is a white area over the word “ring”. IMO opinion having something minor on the back can be a blessing since nobody really looks at the back, and saving $3-5k for those minor areas to get a front with outstanding centering and eye appeal is worth it. Just my two cents - your mileage may vary. 😉
I am suspect of the area on the back on which there is a possible stain in the upper left , noted by Keith. Or is the lower grade due strictly to the corner wear which is visible on the scan? I am leaning toward staining as the color and centering are so beautiful.
I feel the PSA is graded lower than high end strictly due to corner wear.
I must decide if I am acceptable with a card on which there is staining….as the SGC clearly has outstanding eye appeal on the front.
4 > 6
Instagram: mattyc_collection
I’m leaning toward the 6.
Thanks,
David (LD_Ferg)
1985 Topps Football (starting in psa 8) - #9 - started 05/21/06
I don’t think you could go wrong buying either one of these because I think they are both very nice examples for the designated grade.
If I owned either card I would enjoy looking at it because in my opinion there are not any distracting flaws that takes away from all important eye appeal.
If you buy either one congrats in advance. 👍
What? Mid-grade? IMO, anything less than a 6 in a PSA holder might look out of place in your portfolio.
I have my spending limits. I am fortunate to have been collecting seriously since the early 2000s…and would not have so many high end pricey cards in my collection if I had not done so.
wow you sound educated. LOL!!
it was either that or the only other french I know, Omelette Du fromage, courtesy of Dexters Lab
It's the singer not the song - Peter Townshend (1972)
Personally I like the PSA 6 better, the corners are sharp and the slightly low centering doesn't detract from the card. The top corners on the 4 look a little soft. May be a wrinkle too unless the white spot on the back dropped it to a 4. Can't go wrong either way though!
If it's in within your budget, and maybe you can get the seller down to $10 - $10.5K with Best Offer, thenI'd go for the PSA 6. Great card.
Exactly, I think the PSA 6 will provide more upside potential vs SGC 4 for the investment portfolio. Folks buying "the grade", new/recently graded slab, PSA still more sought after and garnering better prices.
Both are nice cards. The PSA 6 has a bit of a color shift in the blue field (visible along the top edge of the card, Paige's shoulders and above the cap). The SGC 4 is just a special card with such strong color and perfect centering. My only concern would be toning of the borders. It is hard to tell from the picture if they are yellowed.
Rainbow Rim...
Good catch on the color shift to the cap and shoulders....I only caught the obvious shift on the top of the card.
What concerns me about the 4 is that it is so exceptional with respect to color and centering…that the corners alone probably do not account for the 4. Is there a crease/wrinkle and/or staining on the back?? The seller also will not answer those questions…that is concerning and silence speaks volumes that those flaws may be the case.
Also take note of the neckline difference between uniform and skin. The 6 only left side. The 4 both sides. Color is a orange yellowish. The 4 has that color on both sides.
Good catch Bluejayway! I assume the orange-yellow color is NOT suppose to be on both sides. Correct?
PSA 6
NFL: Buffalo Bills & Green Bay Packers
The 6 is simply off centered both ways and has that unsightly registration shift into the top border. I'd pass on that 6. The four has more eye appeal and is cheaper. On centering alone, in shopping and sifting through them, how many examples are as centered as that 4? Whatever example is chosen, I'd insist on that level of centering or pass.
Instagram: mattyc_collection
I finally received an answer from the seller on staining and/or wrinkle/crease. There are no stains on the card…front or back. There is a feint wrinkle which is hard to find. I have asked where it is on the card …and how long the wrinkle is….waiting on answers to those last two questions.
How do the readers of this thread feel about a surface wrinkle? Does it scare anyone away even though the color and centering are exceptional for the issue?
I have not seen enough examples to get a read on whether it is supposed to be there on both sides or not. Just a difference on these 2 examples that I noticed.
I welcome any flaw that does not detract from my eye's enjoyment of the card, while also lowering price. My 4.5 1952T Mick has just such a faint "spider wrinkle" along the top left edge; I have to angle the card in severe light to see it, and as I otherwise don't even notice it, I thank the Card Gods daily as otherwise it would not have been affordable
Instagram: mattyc_collection
I might see this card in person. The seller is from Ft Wayne IN...and is doing a show in Xenia, OH this weekend, not far from Mason, OH (my location).
That should help, on site viewing,in your determination. Use lots of light, and pack a magnifier.
I just looked at these cards on a different computer and was able to zoom in on the images. The orange yellow on the neckline mentioned by Bluejayway is actually part of a bigger color shift that affects his eyes and makes the whole portrait a bit mushy compared to the 6. I can also see foxing on the borders of the 4. I would pass on the 4 and reconsider the 6.
What is meant by “foxing”?
Also on the bill of the hat on the 4 , there is blue on his left . None on the 6. All red bill .
I would hold off on the 4 no idea what the white circle on the back of the 4 is between an and 6-1 record and next to ring. Could be something was removed. Just doesn't look natural to me.
By "foxing" I mean yellowing, browning, or age toning. Under magnification it can appear speckled. The more I look at it, I think the 4 is yellowed and it really shows on the white borders.
Looking at the card in hand…I will have a chance to closely examine the back, the acknowledged wrinkle by the seller, and any other issues which appear in hand.
Weighing on my decision about a 1949 Bowman Paige RC is what it will cost me to make a run at a very nice, upcoming 1948 Leaf Jackie Robinson RC. I will have to sell 16 cards including 7 Mantle cards, 2 Mays cards, 2 Clemente cards, 2 Ryan cards, 1 Aaron card, 1 Koufax card and a gorgeous Marichal RC in my collection for the purchase of the Robinson RC. The Paige RC will have to be around $7000-10,000, not causing me to further deplete my collection.
The SGC is very appealing to me due to the extraordinary centering and color…and I will have to see in person how subtle the wrinkle is as well as closely examine the back for staining (which the seller has told me is stain-free) and make sure there is no paper loss. Corner wear + subtle wrinkle seems reasonable flaws to downgrade the Paige RC to a 4 …despite extraordinary color and centering.
If I did not have the opportunity to view the SGC Paige in person…I probably would not consider it.
Thoughts?
An in person meeting with the card will sort it all out for you. It's all about how a card looks from your usual real-life viewing vantage point. I view my cards in a wall display from about a foot away, or in hand, sometimes in little stands on my desk. So since I don't ever look at them enlarged, that renders certain flaws irrelevant to my enjoyment of them.
These cards below all have spider wrinkes I cannot see with the naked eye unless I look very hard under harsh light at a specific angle. In real life/non enlarged scan/non magnification they hit the spot so bring on the hidden wrinkles and savings
Allows me to put the gunpowder toward much bigger game.
Instagram: mattyc_collection
Nice selection of spider-wrinkled cards, Matt.
Thx bro 👍 Hope in hand it looks great and you get a beauty for a great price.
For me the best is when the wrinkle is on the back! Even better is some clear glue residue on back that knocks the grade way down like on this "2"...
Instagram: mattyc_collection
Wow, the Ruth is eye-popping!
Wrinkles that are hard to see are your friend Monte. These two both had them and did not detract from the eye appeal of the card IMO.
Wow, Keith! I knew you had bought a Cobb, but not a Mantle RC. Beautiful cards...
Thank you for the nice note. Older cards from a few years back. First and only Bowman card I have eiver owned to boot.
I personally viewed the SGC-4 1949 Bowman Paige. Color and centering are amazing...registration is not an issue with the PSA-6 only subtly better. Key factors in deciding to buy or not are...corner wear (not use to this much corner wear, though seemed right for a mid-grade card), toning is above average, and two (2) spider wrinkles (I had to ask where at, then I noticed it w/loupe)---one is strictly on the back and a 2nd strictly on the front. Don't know what to do...other than to focus on an upcoming nice 1948 Leaf Jackie Robinson...and just wait to see how much the Jackie will cost me.
Driving up to see the SGC Paige…I emailed the owner of the PSA Paige to see what price might be acceptable to him…well the owner was at a show…and apparently a walk up bought it.