New PCGS Fee

MikeD

Just wanted to give everyone a heads-up, PCGS is charging a new fee for custom gaskets for (presumably) non-round coins. They don't include it in any of the fee pages, but I was charged for it twice in a recent submission without notice, on top of the oversized holder fee (so I was charged $17 for modern grading + $5 for gold shield + $20 for oversize + $20 for a gasket). They also don't indicate the fee on the invoice, so you won't know about it unless you check carefully. They are working to add it to the webpage, but no details on that were provided.

The two coins I was charged for (they are world coins, but some US/error coins might be hit by this fee?), for reference, are
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces185940.html
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces265063.html

Customer service also indicated to me that 'Customer acknowledges and agrees that PCGS may adjust/increase any fees as necessary without explicit customer notification.' So they can add or increase your fees in anyway they want without notice, including adding new fees that were never charged before, based on section 6 of the agreement. Good luck.

DocBenjamin

Hope that allnewsanchor doesn't see this.

MFeld

@DocBenjamin said:
Hope that allnewsanchor doesn't see this.

I hope anyone who submits coins to PCGS sees it.

braddick

@MFeld said:

@DocBenjamin said:
Hope that allnewsanchor doesn't see this.

I hope anyone who submits coins to PCGS sees it.

I hope all who submit odd shaped coins see this.
(For the rest of us, it doesn't matter.)

NJCoin

@MikeD said:
Just wanted to give everyone a heads-up, PCGS is charging a new fee for custom gaskets for (presumably) non-round coins. They don't include it in any of the fee pages, but I was charged for it twice in a recent submission without notice, on top of the oversized holder fee (so I was charged $17 for modern grading + $5 for gold shield + $20 for oversize + $20 for a gasket). They also don't indicate the fee on the invoice, so you won't know about it unless you check carefully. They are working to add it to the webpage, but no details on that were provided.

The two coins I was charged for (they are world coins, but some US/error coins might be hit by this fee?), for reference, are
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces185940.html
https://en.numista.com/catalogue/pieces265063.html

Customer service also indicated to me that 'Customer acknowledges and agrees that PCGS may adjust/increase any fees as necessary without explicit customer notification.' So they can add or increase your fees in anyway they want without notice, including adding new fees that were never charged before, based on section 6 of the agreement. Good luck.

Classy, rather than eating it before they get around to actually disclosing it, and getting explicit consent to charge it.

PE strikes again. Because the $20 is going to help them make their next quarter's numbers, and the $42 you were already charged wasn't already plenty. The old PCGS would never operate like that.

MFeld

@braddick said:

@MFeld said:

@DocBenjamin said:
Hope that allnewsanchor doesn't see this.

I hope anyone who submits coins to PCGS sees it.

I hope all who submit odd shaped coins see this.
(For the rest of us, it doesn't matter.)

If what customer service stated was reported here accurately, and this is something new, it doesn’t sound like additional fees would necessarily be limited to odd shaped coins.

pruebas

In a way, it makes sense though. Those non-round gaskets take work to cut correctly, and I want someone skilled to be doing the work.

I sent in a rectangular French Art Nouveau medal once. Upon grading, it showed MS63 for a few days, then it was changed to No Service-Refund. I think they could not get it into a gasket. This was during COVID and maybe didn’t have the staff to do the work.

Maybe with the new fee, they will try harder to get these things in holders.

MikeD

@MFeld said:
If what customer service stated was reported here accurately, and this is something new, it doesn’t sound like additional fees would necessarily be limited to odd shaped coins.

The exact details I got from customer service were: “Your coins in Lines 47 and 48 were charged $62 because it was $20 for the oversized holders and $20 for the custom gasket that was needed for each coin as well. This was in addition to the $22 grading fee per coin”

And when I pushed for more info: “This is a new service fee that we have added to our oversized holder. We are looking to update our website as soon as we can.”

So I don’t know if it’s just oversized coins, odd shaped coins, odd shaped oversized coins, coins that’s don’t fit the existing gasket sizes (e.g., too large or small), etc., but that would likely be explained on the webpage whenever they get around to describing the fee… It is definitely in addition to any oversized fee, as I was charged both.

MFeld

@MikeD said:

@MFeld said:
If what customer service stated was reported here accurately, and this is something new, it doesn’t sound like additional fees would necessarily be limited to odd shaped coins.

The exact details I got from customer service were: “Your coins in Lines 47 and 48 were charged $62 because it was $20 for the oversized holders and $20 for the custom gasket that was needed for each coin as well. This was in addition to the $22 grading fee per coin”

And when I pushed for more info: “This is a new service fee that we have added to our oversized holder. We are looking to update our website as soon as we can.”

So I don’t know if it’s just oversized coins, odd shaped coins, odd shaped oversized coins, coins that’s don’t fit the existing gasket sizes (e.g., too large or small), etc., but that would likely be explained on the webpage whenever they get around to describing the fee… It is definitely in addition to any oversized fee, as I was charged both.

Thank you.

MikeD

@pruebas said:
In a way, it makes sense though. Those non-round gaskets take work to cut correctly, and I want someone skilled to be doing the work.

I sent in a rectangular French Art Nouveau medal once. Upon grading, it showed MS63 for a few days, then it was changed to No Service-Refund. I think they could not get it into a gasket. This was during COVID and maybe didn’t have the staff to do the work.

Maybe with the new fee, they will try harder to get these things in holders.

I won’t comment on what makes sense or not, but I had this rectangular coin graded in 2021. The normal gasket, from memory, held it fine.

percyb

With the extra fees maybe they can hire someone to update their website. In their case we know the answer to the old chicken/egg or Fee/disclosure conundrum.

braddick

@MFeld said:

@MikeD said:

@MFeld said:
If what customer service stated was reported here accurately, and this is something new, it doesn’t sound like additional fees would necessarily be limited to odd shaped coins.

The exact details I got from customer service were: “Your coins in Lines 47 and 48 were charged $62 because it was $20 for the oversized holders and $20 for the custom gasket that was needed for each coin as well. This was in addition to the $22 grading fee per coin”

And when I pushed for more info: “This is a new service fee that we have added to our oversized holder. We are looking to update our website as soon as we can.”

So I don’t know if it’s just oversized coins, odd shaped coins, odd shaped oversized coins, coins that’s don’t fit the existing gasket sizes (e.g., too large or small), etc., but that would likely be explained on the webpage whenever they get around to describing the fee… It is definitely in addition to any oversized fee, as I was charged both.

Thank you.

You're welcome.

pruebas

I bought this already slabbed, but I'd gladly pay an extra $20 to get the gasket cut for this.

Edited to add: How long before NGC institutes this fee?

CRHer700

@pruebas said:

Edited to add: How long before NGC institutes this fee?

Never if they wish to best PCGS.

291fifth

The $20 fee for odd shaped gaskets sounds low. Non-standard gaskets take time to make and time is money. If you are going to play the slab game you have to be ready to pay.

logger7

Unexpected fees become a problem with any business. When I sent in some English sovereigns to PCGS I was told that they'd have to go through a costly tier so had them sent back which is always an option. Of course the PCGS slab is superior but I'd look at all options when considering getting items graded.

allnewsanchor

@DocBenjamin said:
Hope that allnewsanchor doesn't see this.

I'm glad I'm a punching bag for you, sir. You have a wonderful weekend, y'hear?

Copperindian

@abbyme24: Abby, do the Kobans require this extra charge? Just curious….
Thanks,
Ken

Sanddollar

Reasonable.
More work on a business' part should equate to a higher fee paid on the customer's end.

You don't expect PCGS to substitute their judgement for yours, do you?

MetroD

@Sanddollar said:
Reasonable.
More work on a business' part should equate to a higher fee paid on the customer's end.

You don't expect PCGS to substitute their judgement for yours, do you?

I agree that an extra fee for extra work is completely reasonable.

That said, I am not particularly enamored with the way the new fee is being introduced. I KNOW that PCGS has the right to adjust fees without notification. Doesn't mean that it is the best way to introduce a new 'fee/service'.

lermish

@Copperindian said:
@abbyme24: Abby, do the Kobans require this extra charge? Just curious….
Thanks,
Ken

They didn't as of 6/13/24

U1chicago

@Sanddollar said:
Reasonable.
More work on a business' part should equate to a higher fee paid on the customer's end.

You don't expect PCGS to substitute their judgement for yours, do you?

The problem is not having it clearly written that special gaskets will be charged a higher fee. If it was upfront, then everyone would know what to expect. And hiding behind a policy that says "may adjust/increase any fees as necessary without explicit customer notification" isn't going to win much trust or goodwill. That leads to the question of what is next? They spent a few more minutes on a certain coin to determine authenticity so that requires a $20 "extra work" fee? You called customer service, so there is a "call-in fee"?

OGDan

The other problem is, which already exists for "big holders", is when they choose to use a custom gasket and how this decision is communicated to the customer. Recent experience with this situation has been really bad.

It's almost as if they are now incentivized to use big holders and custom gaskets as much as possible. /sarcasm

abbyme24

@Copperindian said:
@abbyme24: Abby, do the Kobans require this extra charge? Just curious….
Thanks,
Ken

No they do not as they don't use a gasket perse. They have 4 small rubber-like "bars" surrounding the koban holding it in place. As far as I am aware this is included in the oversized holder fee (for Koban at least). I think what they are referring to is something like this Meiwa Gomonme. I recently had this graded and they called me to tell me about the $20 gasket fee. You can see that this is an actual custom-cut gasket vs. what the Koban use.

abbyme24

I definitely understand the charge, but I will say if they are going to charge a gasket fee they should atleast sand the edges a bit - the edges are pretty rough and make it look amateurish.

cameonut2011

This whole situation is unfortunate.

cameonut2011

Mike, you need to make your profile public so people can send you private messages.

MikeD

@cameonut2011 said:
Mike, you need to make your profile public so people can send you private messages.

Done

lermish

@Lunner posted this over on the Set Registry forum. New custom cut gasket. @Lunner - Did you get charged an additional fee for this?

jacrispies

@291fifth said:
The $20 fee for odd shaped gaskets sounds low. Non-standard gaskets take time to make and time is money. If you are going to play the slab game you have to be ready to pay.

Especially because most oversized custom gaskets look like they were hand carved with a butter knife. Must have taken all day!

abbyme24

Yeah looking at the one @lermish posted I should be thankful for the way mine looks

MikeD

Finally got a look at my custom gasket. I think they custom cut the hole too big...

Desert Moon

@MikeD said:

The exact details I got from customer service were: “Your coins in Lines 47 and 48 were charged $62 because it was $20 for the oversized holders and $20 for the custom gasket that was needed for each coin as well. This was in addition to the $22 grading fee per coin”

And when I pushed for more info: “This is a new service fee that we have added to our oversized holder. We are looking to update our website as soon as we can.”

So I don’t know if it’s just oversized coins, odd shaped coins, odd shaped oversized coins, coins that’s don’t fit the existing gasket sizes (e.g., too large or small), etc., but that would likely be explained on the webpage whenever they get around to describing the fee… It is definitely in addition to any oversized fee, as I was charged both.

One word - YIKES.

ProofCollection

Well if they are going to charge for a custom gasket then it should be expertly crafted. A few of the examples above are certainly not that.

ScarsdaleCoin

Sorry I can’t resist

A tisket
A tasket
Now PCGS
charges for the gasket…

davewesen

I had a service level adjustment on an economy submission I got back 6 months ago. It was the first time I have seen it or heard about it, but I do not mind. They charged me $10 because value exceeds selected service level.

It was a MS66 with PCGS guide of $850. I also had a same type MS65 in the submission with a PCGS guide of $240.