Local auction company
logger7
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These people sell mainly stamps, baseball cards, etc.. However a member of the Danbury club had a relative die who listed with them, the sale is tomorrow, a lot of old holder PCGS $5 and $10 Indians including a couple doilys. Thought there may be interest here. The real killer with this auction house is both the consignor and the bidders pay 20%! Plus online bidders through the stamp network is an additional percent. https://stampauctionnetwork.com/V/V801.cfm
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This auction is being conducted in conjunction with Archives International, sellers of currency, security printing and coins. They do not charge a 20% commission on both ends, as far as I know, and I have done much business with them. It's much easier to register and bid through their site who will be broadcasting the auction live today. Stamp auction network's site is a bit difficult.
https://archivesinternational.com/
Looks like they sold a 1 ounce Krugerrand at $1600 + BP-about $400 under melt near the end of the auction. Much else around melt or bullion. Hope some here got some buys. I didn't. I've been busy with other stuff all day.
K rand
I think that these work out below melt, too.
The 20% fee for both the consignor and bidders is a killer. $20 and 1 oz gold was hammering for around $2K today; so the consignors were getting $1600 and the bidders were paying $2400 or so. Plus bidders have to pay 22% over hammer and get a couple percent back if they pay within a week. Cash, bank check or wire only!!! I thought they'd be accepting credit cards and they told me after hearing back from the head that ccs would not be accepted. Coins did not sell very strong. I thought the Doily $10 Indian would go for more.
The consignors may NOT be paying 20% on bullion. Don't assume things. A local auction house near me had a special rate (7%) for bullion and they offer to just buy it outright.
This is the terms and conditions:
CONDITIONS OF SALE - Public Auction
**UPDATED T&C SPECIFIC TO SALE 801 only: Buyer's Premium of 22% added to every lot. Successful buyers that pay within 7 days of the date of invoice and pay by bank transfer will receive a 3% prompt payment discount.
THE PLACING OF A BID SHALL CONSTITUTE ACCEPTANCE OF THESE CONDITIONS OF SALE BETWEEN BIDDER AND DANIEL F. KELLEHER AUCTIONS, LLC ("KELLEHER")
https://stampauctionnetwork.com/V/terms.cfm
Their standard consignor rate is 20%, though there may be variations not spelled out.
"Our standard commission rates start at 20%, depending on the value, size, and nature of the material, the rates can vary. We strive to receive the highest possible price within the marketplace."
https://www.kelleherauctions.com/consign-with-us/
DANIEL F. KELLEHER AUCTIONS is an old time stamp auction that is diversifying into other collectibles. Their commission schedule is typical of auction firms for collectibles other than coins. The extreme competition among coin auction firms is what keeps the commissions down for coin collectors.
It says right there that the commission rate varies.
That may be true, but Mr. Kelleher is long dead. A 40% take on consigning plus bidding is more than any other auction company I know takes. Stacks Bowers and Heritage are around 20%. Great Collections charges the seller nothing if the certified sells over $1000 and the buyer pays around 10%.
In this auction of certified coins and collections today, with some lots including a lot of 90% silver, the lots hammered around spot/melt, the consignors got 20% behind that, even PCGS certified $5 and $10 Indian gold in low Unc. grades. The consignors would have done better shipping to a dealer who handles a lot of precious metals and semi-numismatics.
I'm not disagreeing with you at all. I'm just saying that the commission arrangement by Kelleher is pretty standard for stamp auction houses and other collectibles. I've paid those type of commissions. The extreme competition among coin auction firms is what keeps the commissions down for coin collectors. Stacks Bowers and Heritage buyer's commissions are 20% and they do have sellers commissions which can be aggressively negotiated.
I'll give you an example from one of the major auction houses. And they don't readily disclose this upfront.
"I would be happy to offer a 20% seller's commission rate instead of our standard 25%. I can also waive our photography and buy-back fee (a fee charged to an item that has a reserve and fails to sell). The buyers have a standard commission in the fine art, decorative and jewelry departments of 25%."
Aren't you glad you collect coins!
@DisneyFan has it exactly right.
As I stated above, I've done much business with Archives International and they do not charge 20% to sellers. The terms and conditions are Kellerher's and were written for stamp auctions and the stamp market. Dr. Schwartz, owner of Archives has done auctions in conjunction with Kellerher and others including Stack's (in Hong Kong, I think). Speak to Dr. Schwartz if you are interested and I expect that you won't pay 20% as a seller.
And $1600 hammer is way lower than the $2000 that others were bringing. The buyer paid under $2000 for an ounce of gold, if he pays within 7 days.
As much as some may badmouth these auctions, they can be profitable, if you are experienced, confident in your knowledge and know what you are doing. I've made my best scores at these sales. Most will stick to what they know but I'll bet that a few here will start looking at these auctions more. No competition for me. I don't buy this stuff anymore. Sorry if I've ruined the secret for those already exploiting this area, but I'm here to spread the knowledge that I no longer use.
You are arguing about whether they charge 20% to sellers but missing the point. There are deals and buys out there if one knows where to look and how to capitalize.