Are you looking for droopy twos, too?
sellitstore
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Who knows what I'm talking about and who knows but wants to keep it secret?
Collector and dealer in obsolete currency. Always buying all obsolete bank notes and scrip.
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I’m guessing that you’re talking about the font used on the serial numbers.
Correct, but what's the significance?
pre-star replacement note?
Exactly.
What do you think about these? Will they be as popular as the replacements with stars? Will values be comparable for similar rarities?
What about the gold certificates? The serial numbers on those look completely different. More research and more examples will eventually answer some questions.
PMG has been certifying these for six years now.
@sellitstore, interesting. Never heard of this before. So what exactly is a droopy two? Would you be able to show examples of droopy and regular twos for comparison, so I can get a better understanding? Thanks, Zack.
So this 2 isn’t droopy correct, because the upper loop doesn’t extend down as far?
Below is a screen shot from an SPMC article on this subject. You might need to join or get access through a member but here's a link to the article in the Jan/Feb 2024 issue.
The problem is that determining if a note is a pre star replacement isn't as easy and straightforward as the style of the serial number, but, yes, this is one indication. The two serial numbers must also be identical-printed from the same numbering head using two passes through the numbering press and not with ANY differences indicating two printing heads and a single pass. The pre star replacements were numbered on paging machines, which uses a single numbering head and two passes, so the numbers and spacing and position will be identical on both serial numbers.
Only the earlier signature combinations of the earliest 20th century large size notes are affected (1903-10). The pre star replacements are identified by the slightly different font. The Potter (1903-10) and Harris (1910-?) press numbering did not include the droopy 2, pregnant 3 or closed 5 fonts, so we're looking for paging machine numbered notes produced 1903-10.
@jfriedm56 Your above note shows slight differences between the two serial numbers indicating a Harris press with two numbering heads was used to number this note. Note that the "9" in the upper right serial number is just a little lower than the "D" and "8" on either side while the bottoms are aligned in the lower left serial number. The difference is slight but enough, I think, to disqualify it as a pre star replacement.
It also does not have a droopy "2", which is the easiest way to identify it as a regular issue note.
@sellitstore, got it. Thanks for the explanation. Appreciate it. Every day we learn something new. And I was a member of the SPMC for a while years back.
Interesting topic. I have to admit that I didn’t know the answer prior to a quick google search. Now I’ll have to be on the lookout for the off chance I ever see one😀.
This looks like it could be one to me. However the grade looks to be closer to XF.
Heritage sold another $1 black eagle with this signature combination and similar style serial numbers for $840 a few months ago. (not identified as a pre star replacement).
Glad I read this post. Thanks for the explanation.
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And here's another. Looking at these prices, they aren't slipping through the cracks.
Isn’t that the same one from last week?
Yes, it is. Sorry. Now I have to find you another.
This one is damaged but is sure looks like one.
What do you think?
Serial number is a bit too early right?
Yes, it appears to be out of the range. It does appear to have droopy 2s. And indeed I have seen other notes that do appear to have at least some of the replacement style digits but do not qualify for other reasons. This is mentioned in the SPMC article as a factor that makes these difficult to identify.
This looks like another with the droopy 2s and closed 5s but outside the serial number range.
Here's another with the right style 2s but out of range serial number.
Yep, the replacement notes (if I'm understanding this correctly) use the old font that was standard on the notes that came before them such as the note above. I've been looking on eBay the past few weeks and have gotten excited a few times when I've seen the old font but then hopes have been dashed after reviewing the serial # ranges lol.
I got outbid on this one:
That's OK-it's wallet stained and hard folded into eights. It doesn't look cheap, either, but I really don't know. Those closed 5s, 6s and 9s are distinctive.
Yeah, it went for about $100 more than what I was comfortable paying for it in that condition. The hard folds also look like they created the start of a split on the bottom right when looking at the reverse as well.
This was the first pre-star replacement note I came across after maybe 3 weeks of looking at all the applicable silver certs that popped up in my searches on eBay (1000 notes maybe?).
Interestingly, there were 3 other bidders who were also aware that this was a replacement note judging by their bids.