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(Silly) Frustration Dealing w/APMEX for a "Classic" PCGS Coin

winestevenwinesteven Posts: 4,524 ✭✭✭✭✭
edited July 1, 2024 8:37AM in U.S. Coin Forum

Each evening I conduct several different searches looking for coins on my Want List. Last night I found a potential one on APMEX, a "classic" coin, graded by PCGS, with a CAC sticker, in the grade I want, and the price was fair (but I'd still negotiate).. They have not yet posted a photo, as that might take a week or so. The cert # is not shown, either in their Product Details or Specifications. Their Product ID # is NOT the cert number.

Naturally, I won't buy a coin without seeing photos. I called them, and was surprised they will not have someone go to their vault to retrieve the coin to provide the cert number, so I can then research to see if there's a True View, and/or prior auction sales so I can then see a photo and make a determination to buy or pass.

Ugh!

Steve

A day without fine wine and working on your coin collection is like a day without sunshine!!!

My collecting “Pride & Joy” is my PCGS Registry Dansco 7070 Set:
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/type-sets/design-type-sets/complete-dansco-7070-modified-type-set-1796-date/publishedset/213996
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Comments

  • pmh1nicpmh1nic Posts: 3,279 ✭✭✭✭✭

    You would think that when they received the coin in that the grade, tpg and cert. number would have been recorded. It makes no sense the way the list coins in high grades (65 and higher) that they wouldn't show the actual coin. I'm with you, wouldn't touch it.

    The longer I live the more convincing proofs I see of this truth, that God governs in the affairs of men. And if a sparrow cannot fall to the ground without His notice is it possible for an empire to rise without His aid? Benjamin Franklin
  • GoldminersGoldminers Posts: 4,008 ✭✭✭✭✭

    This exact thing happened to me. No photos of what I was interested in buying and no actual certificate details that I asked for, so I did not buy it. This policy has nearly eliminated all my purchases there and I used to buy many thousands of dollars a year.

  • winestevenwinesteven Posts: 4,524 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @alefzero said:
    I stopped buying from them because they use stock photos; you never know what will arrive. If you do varieties, like me, or are fanatical about certain presentation qualities, that is pretty much unacceptable. Even if there is an on-approval return guaranty, it takes time and diverts attention from alternate specimens.

    Actually, it seems as of late they started using photos of the actual item being sold, but one has to make sure of that for that item before buying! I bought a Type coin from them 1-1/2 months ago, and they used a real photo of that coin.

    Steve

    A day without fine wine and working on your coin collection is like a day without sunshine!!!

    My collecting “Pride & Joy” is my PCGS Registry Dansco 7070 Set:
    https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/type-sets/design-type-sets/complete-dansco-7070-modified-type-set-1796-date/publishedset/213996
  • winestevenwinesteven Posts: 4,524 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @TrickleCharge said:
    If it has a CAC sticker are you sure that you even need to see the coin? ;)

    Ha! Yes, go ahead and make fun, it's ok ;)

    Steve

    A day without fine wine and working on your coin collection is like a day without sunshine!!!

    My collecting “Pride & Joy” is my PCGS Registry Dansco 7070 Set:
    https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/type-sets/design-type-sets/complete-dansco-7070-modified-type-set-1796-date/publishedset/213996
  • winestevenwinesteven Posts: 4,524 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @DeplorableDan said:
    Steve, if you want to send me the details I’ll get you the pictures. I have someone there that could help…

    Dan - thanks, that's great! See the pm.

    Steve

    A day without fine wine and working on your coin collection is like a day without sunshine!!!

    My collecting “Pride & Joy” is my PCGS Registry Dansco 7070 Set:
    https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/type-sets/design-type-sets/complete-dansco-7070-modified-type-set-1796-date/publishedset/213996
  • PeakRaritiesPeakRarities Posts: 3,700 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @winesteven said:

    @DeplorableDan said:
    Steve, if you want to send me the details I’ll get you the pictures. I have someone there that could help…

    Dan - thanks, that's great! See the pm.

    Steve

    Got it, I just made a call. Stand by.

    Founder- Peak Rarities
    Website
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  • winestevenwinesteven Posts: 4,524 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @DeplorableDan said:

    @winesteven said:

    @DeplorableDan said:
    Steve, if you want to send me the details I’ll get you the pictures. I have someone there that could help…

    Dan - thanks, that's great! See the pm.

    Steve

    Got it, I just made a call. Stand by.

    Dan - Please PM the cert #, rather than post it here.

    Steve

    A day without fine wine and working on your coin collection is like a day without sunshine!!!

    My collecting “Pride & Joy” is my PCGS Registry Dansco 7070 Set:
    https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/type-sets/design-type-sets/complete-dansco-7070-modified-type-set-1796-date/publishedset/213996
  • BarberianBarberian Posts: 3,582 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @winesteven said:

    @alefzero said:
    I stopped buying from them because they use stock photos; you never know what will arrive. If you do varieties, like me, or are fanatical about certain presentation qualities, that is pretty much unacceptable. Even if there is an on-approval return guaranty, it takes time and diverts attention from alternate specimens.

    Actually, it seems as of late they started using photos of the actual item being sold, but one has to make sure of that for that item before buying! I bought a Type coin from them 1-1/2 months ago, and they used a real photo of that coin.

    Steve

    But one can never be certain with them. They once had an NGC VF30 1855/54 half that was mislabeled as an 1855 normal date for sale for the price of the overdate. Will they send the mislabeled overdate, or will they send an actual 55 normal date worth 70% less? When informed of this needless buyer uncertainty, they did nothing.

    3 rim nicks away from Good
  • DisneyFanDisneyFan Posts: 2,069 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @winesteven said:

    @DeplorableDan said:

    @winesteven said:

    @DeplorableDan said:
    Steve, if you want to send me the details I’ll get you the pictures. I have someone there that could help…

    Dan - thanks, that's great! See the pm.

    Steve

    Got it, I just made a call. Stand by.

    Dan - Please PM the cert #, rather than post it here.

    Steve

    Yea! Given that @winesteven wants it, it's a good one and somebody might try to steal it out from under him.

  • pointfivezeropointfivezero Posts: 1,825 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I've contacted APMEX for similar scenarios and they have provided the cert number. I'm a VIP member so I'm not sure if that weighs into their decision making process.

    Good luck with your quest.

    Tim

  • PeakRaritiesPeakRarities Posts: 3,700 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @alaura22 said:
    Why would it take "I have a guy" to get information on a coin that they are selling???
    When I see their posts on Ebay I just keep going,
    Sorry Steve, I hope that Dan is able to find the info you need/want, but keep in mind, do you really want to do business with that company?

    +1

    Founder- Peak Rarities
    Website
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    Facebook

  • winestevenwinesteven Posts: 4,524 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @alaura22 said:
    Why would it take "I have a guy" to get information on a coin that they are selling???
    When I see their posts on Ebay I just keep going,
    Sorry Steve, I hope that Dan is able to find the info you need/want, but keep in mind, do you really want to do business with that company?

    Mike - I understand your point, but I don’t want to cut off my nose to spite my face. I’ve been searching for a potential upgrade for my existing lovely coin for quite a while. I have not yet looked at the photos Dan pm’d, but chances are, if I had to guess, I’ll end up passing as I did on over a dozen of others I’ve seen.

    Steve

    A day without fine wine and working on your coin collection is like a day without sunshine!!!

    My collecting “Pride & Joy” is my PCGS Registry Dansco 7070 Set:
    https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/type-sets/design-type-sets/complete-dansco-7070-modified-type-set-1796-date/publishedset/213996
  • lermishlermish Posts: 2,921 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @winesteven said:

    @alaura22 said:
    Why would it take "I have a guy" to get information on a coin that they are selling???
    When I see their posts on Ebay I just keep going,
    Sorry Steve, I hope that Dan is able to find the info you need/want, but keep in mind, do you really want to do business with that company?

    Mike - I understand your point, but I don’t want to cut off my nose to spite my face. I’ve been searching for a potential upgrade for my existing lovely coin for quite a while. I have not yet looked at the photos Dan pm’d, but chances are, if I had to guess, I’ll end up passing as I did on over a dozen of others I’ve seen.

    Steve

    Steve - You are 100% right as usual... but I did indeed choose to cut off my nose regardless. I had picked up a few coins from them but they sold me a chopmarked trade dollar and did not disclose using a stock photo (and hadn't used stock photos on prior chopped T$ purchases). Anyway, long story short, I am now blacklisted and can't buy from them. :|

  • lkeneficlkenefic Posts: 8,160 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I've inadvertently ended up with two APMEX coins... the first coin is a 1794 Liberty Cap LC PCGS VF20. I recognized the coin when I saw it at a Baltimore show on JJ Teapartys table. APMEX had it on ebay for $2200 and I had it on my watchlist for a couple of months... I got it from JJ Teaparty for $1800. The second coin was basically a bullion piece on ebay for around $100 over melt at the time... 1924 $20 Saint MS65... widget... its accurately graded with decent luster and a very common date... yawn... but it's real.

    Collecting: Dansco 7070; Middle Date Large Cents (VF-AU); Box of 20;

    Successful BST transactions with: SilverEagles92; Ahrensdad; Smitty; GregHansen; Lablade; Mercury10c; copperflopper; whatsup; KISHU1; scrapman1077, crispy, canadanz, smallchange, robkool, Mission16, ranshdow, ibzman350, Fallguy, Collectorcoins, SurfinxHI, jwitten, Walkerguy21D, dsessom.
  • TrickleChargeTrickleCharge Posts: 174 ✭✭✭

    @winesteven said:
    I saw the photos, and I’ll be passing, as I like my current coin’s eye appeal better, even though my coin is a plus, lower than the higher whole grade of this coin.

    DD, greatly appreciated!

    Thanks.

    Steve

    I joke about buying the coin unseen just because it has a CAC sticker, but in all seriousness I admire your collecting style Steve. Here you have a higher graded coin with CAC, but ultimately it falls short of your lower graded CAC one. We have lots of tools available to help size up a coin, but as you have often said it has to also be something that you like. Without even seeing the coin, that's the right decision for you and I hope a superior one worthy of your approval does come your way in the future.

  • winestevenwinesteven Posts: 4,524 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @TrickleCharge said:

    @winesteven said:
    I saw the photos, and I’ll be passing, as I like my current coin’s eye appeal better, even though my coin is a plus, lower than the higher whole grade of this coin.

    DD, greatly appreciated!

    Thanks.

    Steve

    I joke about buying the coin unseen just because it has a CAC sticker, but in all seriousness I admire your collecting style Steve. Here you have a higher graded coin with CAC, but ultimately it falls short of your lower graded CAC one. We have lots of tools available to help size up a coin, but as you have often said it has to also be something that you like. Without even seeing the coin, that's the right decision for you and I hope a superior one worthy of your approval does come your way in the future.

    Yes, I recognized your joke, and it made me chuckle with you, hence my “Ha” in my reply.

    Thanks for your kind words.

    Steve

    A day without fine wine and working on your coin collection is like a day without sunshine!!!

    My collecting “Pride & Joy” is my PCGS Registry Dansco 7070 Set:
    https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/type-sets/design-type-sets/complete-dansco-7070-modified-type-set-1796-date/publishedset/213996
  • ProofCollectionProofCollection Posts: 6,162 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 1, 2024 3:42PM

    Every business has its established processes and work flows which are designed to reduce screwups and increase efficiency, at least in their opinion. Some of these practices may not be customer friendly as is the case here. We can complain or suggest ways they can do things better but clearly there's a reason why they do it the way they do. Either live it it or boycott them for it.

  • goodmoney4badmoneygoodmoney4badmoney Posts: 1,236 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Proofmorgan said:
    I believe a lot of their inventory is consigned from a large dealer(s). If you could locate the source, you may be able to save some money.

    This is true, I have done it.

  • logger7logger7 Posts: 8,522 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 2, 2024 6:55AM

    They've been too big for too long to really manage quality control well of numismatics imo. I had good experiences with selling bullion to them though.

  • winestevenwinesteven Posts: 4,524 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @goodmoney4badmoney said:

    @Proofmorgan said:
    I believe a lot of their inventory is consigned from a large dealer(s). If you could locate the source, you may be able to save some money.

    This is true, I have done it.

    I’d appreciate if @Proofmorgan or @goodmoney4badmoney could teach me how to do this, if the pop of the coin I’m looking for is over 200, and no photos or cert number is provided. Once I have either, then I understand how to search, which I too regularly try to do.

    Thanks.

    Steve

    A day without fine wine and working on your coin collection is like a day without sunshine!!!

    My collecting “Pride & Joy” is my PCGS Registry Dansco 7070 Set:
    https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/type-sets/design-type-sets/complete-dansco-7070-modified-type-set-1796-date/publishedset/213996
  • ManorcourtmanManorcourtman Posts: 8,035 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 1, 2024 4:31PM

    The topic of APMEX has been discussed many times over the years. My last contact with them was several years ago. I called about purchasing a coin and asked if I would get the one pictured on the website. I asked them to verify the one pictured was the one the would get and they would not. They said I would get one graded the same. They would not verify or expend any effort whatsoever. That's the second time I asked them to verify a coin and they would not. I haven't done business with them since. They are apparently to big to care about very basic customer service.

  • 1madman1madman Posts: 1,473 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Proofmorgan said:
    I believe a lot of their inventory is consigned from a large dealer(s). If you could locate the source, you may be able to save some money.

    I know heritage is one of their sources

  • winestevenwinesteven Posts: 4,524 ✭✭✭✭✭

    But it seems to some extent their procedures have recently been modified (like L& C Coins too).

    Just 1-1/2 months ago I purchased a nice Type coin from APMEX, after easily having their product specialist confirm the coin being sold was the coin showed, along with that Cert number.

    Several months ago I bought a nice Morgan Dollar from L&C after they too confirmed the coin I would receive was the one in the holder with cert number shown. THAT coin was so nice, I sent it in for Reconsideration, and PCGS added on a plus, and CAC automatically restickered it.

    Steve

    A day without fine wine and working on your coin collection is like a day without sunshine!!!

    My collecting “Pride & Joy” is my PCGS Registry Dansco 7070 Set:
    https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/type-sets/design-type-sets/complete-dansco-7070-modified-type-set-1796-date/publishedset/213996
  • goodmoney4badmoneygoodmoney4badmoney Posts: 1,236 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @winesteven In my case it's because I specialize in only errors. Due to the unique nature of them it wasn't too difficult. It's very rare for them to have stock type photos in the coins and currency error listings.

  • ProofCollectionProofCollection Posts: 6,162 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @winesteven said:
    But it seems to some extent their procedures have recently been modified (like L& C Coins too).

    Just 1-1/2 months ago I purchased a nice Type coin from APMEX, after easily having their product specialist confirm the coin being sold was the coin showed, along with that Cert number.

    Several months ago I bought a nice Morgan Dollar from L&C after they too confirmed the coin I would receive was the one in the holder with cert number shown. THAT coin was so nice, I sent it in for Reconsideration, and PCGS added on a plus, and CAC automatically restickered it.

    Steve

    Now if only we can get both of them to post better pictures. I'm not sure how they expect to sell some of those high dollar coins with such lousy pictures.

  • SurfinxHISurfinxHI Posts: 2,458 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I know it was said here, but APMEX is primarily bullion….and their customer service has always been impeccable for me, on the buy or sell side. My guess is if you want a full service coin dealer, then APMEX might not be for you. But if you need to buy or sell bullion, they might be a good match.

    Surf

    Dead people tell interesting tales.
  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 34,247 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @SurfinxHI said:
    I know it was said here, but APMEX is primarily bullion….and their customer service has always been impeccable for me, on the buy or sell side. My guess is if you want a full service coin dealer, then APMEX might not be for you. But if you need to buy or sell bullion, they might be a good match.

    Surf

    This.

  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 34,247 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @MWallace said:
    I discovered a few years ago by pure chance that they list coins for sale with photos that are from another dealers stock, and at much higher prices. I posted that fact here with links to both sites and was berated for it. The biggest majority here saw nothing wrong with it. I do see something wrong with it.

    I still see nothing wrong with it. If I'm a dealer, I want eyeballs on my product. Are you also mad at the dealer that they have a relationship with?

  • knovak1976knovak1976 Posts: 402 ✭✭✭✭

    @lermish said:
    …………

    Steve

    Then how are we supposed to snipe it???

    ;)

    I have that new app called “Sniping coins that people won’t tell you what they are”……and it’s great! 🤪😂

  • BikergeekBikergeek Posts: 416 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Um, so now that @winesteven isn't buying the coin - how's about putting a darn picture in this thread? You can't actually expect me to just read words here and not see any pretty pictures?!?!

    New website: Groovycoins.com Capped Bust Half Dime registry set: Bikergeek CBHD LM Set

  • Manifest_DestinyManifest_Destiny Posts: 6,896 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @MWallace said:
    I discovered a few years ago by pure chance that they list coins for sale with photos that are from another dealers stock, and at much higher prices. I posted that fact here with links to both sites and was berated for it. The biggest majority here saw nothing wrong with it. I do see something wrong with it.

    I'm ok with it as long as they have a relationship with the other dealer and it's done with their knowledge. It's no different than all the drop shippers on ebay who fulfill orders through Amazon.

  • PeakRaritiesPeakRarities Posts: 3,700 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Bikergeek said:
    Um, so now that @winesteven isn't buying the coin - how's about putting a darn picture in this thread? You can't actually expect me to just read words here and not see any pretty pictures?!?!

    Founder- Peak Rarities
    Website
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  • winestevenwinesteven Posts: 4,524 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Bikergeek said:
    Um, so now that @winesteven isn't buying the coin - how's about putting a darn picture in this thread? You can't actually expect me to just read words here and not see any pretty pictures?!?!

    I'd prefer not to, because if someone else is interested in buying it, I don't think it's fair to the dealer for me to present publicly a negative comment on a coin currently for sale. However, I'll gladly pm it to you, on the condition that you do not post it.

    Steve

    A day without fine wine and working on your coin collection is like a day without sunshine!!!

    My collecting “Pride & Joy” is my PCGS Registry Dansco 7070 Set:
    https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/type-sets/design-type-sets/complete-dansco-7070-modified-type-set-1796-date/publishedset/213996
  • ProofCollectionProofCollection Posts: 6,162 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @winesteven said:

    @Bikergeek said:
    Um, so now that @winesteven isn't buying the coin - how's about putting a darn picture in this thread? You can't actually expect me to just read words here and not see any pretty pictures?!?!

    I'd prefer not to, because if someone else is interested in buying it, I don't think it's fair to the dealer for me to present publicly a negative comment on a coin currently for sale. However, I'll gladly pm it to you, on the condition that you do not post it.

    Steve

    It's really no different than an unflattering product review...

  • winestevenwinesteven Posts: 4,524 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited July 2, 2024 7:02AM

    I see DD posted the MS67 above.

    Here's my MS66+:

    Steve

    A day without fine wine and working on your coin collection is like a day without sunshine!!!

    My collecting “Pride & Joy” is my PCGS Registry Dansco 7070 Set:
    https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/type-sets/design-type-sets/complete-dansco-7070-modified-type-set-1796-date/publishedset/213996

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