On sale, Thursday June 6th - American Eagle 2024 one ounce gold and silver uncirculated coins
Goldbully
Posts: 17,093 ✭✭✭✭✭
Anyone buying these coins and why?
$3,170.00 for one ounce of gold is not in the cards for most folks.
I will not be a buyer, even though I love the Uncs.
1
Comments
See low below
@MilesWaits I don't know whether to laugh or cry in pain.
Of note, the 2024 mintage of the Unc AGE is 3,000 more than last year.
2023 - Mintage 10,000
2024 - Mintage 13,000
No. Because I don’t want to.
Having fun while switching things up and focusing on a next level PCGS slabbed 1950+ type set, while still looking for great examples for the 7070.
The "mintage limit" on 23EH was 10,000.
However, as of the latest sales report, they had only sold:
Source: https://www.usmint.gov/about/production-sales-figures/cumulative-sales
Other than the packaging, how are these different from the regular uncirculated AGE's being sold by bullion dealers? If you get one slabbed, will it get a special label or will it get the same label as the AGE's purchased from the bullion dealers?
Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
"Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
"Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire
It has a mint mark, and the finish is different. Uncirculated finish = burnished blanks. Reference
PCGS assigns different coin numbers (bullion vs. 'uncirculated/burnished'). For example, the 2023 version (base label) of the uncirculated was 922855.
I do not collect modern coins.
Although it would be nice to have a burnished gold coin, I'm passing, it's just too pricey.
Very few moderns here and I prefer classic comemms here, jmo
Source: https://www.wholesalecoinsdirect.com/2006-2023-burnished-gold-american-eagle-ms70-date-run
They are totally different coins. Finish, mint mark, mintage. It's the same as asking whether a proof coin is the same as a circulating one, other than the packaging.
That said, the premium for the gold coins is difficult to justify at current prices. The silver is a lot more reasonable, given how it's in line with what the Morgan and Peace dollars go for, as well as consistent with what slabbed bullion coins go for, with much lower mintages. By an order of magnitude of millions.
For the silver coins, bullion is for stackers and these are for graded coin collectors.
I do not understand the need to charge an $800 an ounce premium for these. The US Mint needs to take a serious look at its mission statement which is to "serve the American people", not price gouge them.
National Commemorative Medals of the U.S. Mint:
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/u-s-coins/medals-tokens/national-commemorative-medals-united-states-mint-1940-present/alltimeset/195526
The mission statement is served by producing coins for commerce. Numismatic sales could be terminated tomorrow with no impact on their mission statement whatsoever. They are really nothing more than a side hustle for the Mint.
As a result, unless otherwise set forth in legislation enacted by Congress, pricing and mintages are totally at their discretion, and price gouging is in the eye of the beholder. The term is generally used with respect to over charging for necessities during emergencies or times of shortage, e.g., $10 for a pint of bottled water or $20 for a gallon of gas during or immediately after a weather emergency.
Not charging $3200 for a specific one ounce gold coin when they are selling other one ounce gold coins for $2400. That's just market based pricing for a luxury, not a necessity, where the seller is determining a price and the market is deciding whether or not it is reasonable. Nothing to do with gouging, and certainly nothing to do with the Mint's mission, which is not to give us, collectors, what we want, at prices we want, and in quantities we want.
With respect to gouging, it is clear that they studied secondary market pricing for Mint products, as well as what other world mints get for similar products with similar relative mintages to bullion or circulating coinage, and chose to capture more (or all) of the premium for themselves while leaving less for collectors, dealers and flippers. If they are truly over charging, we can all just wait for prices to drop on the secondary market, as they do for many issues where the Mint and its dealer and flipping partners overestimate demand at a given price.
Unfortunately for us, if the goal for us is simply lower prices, the fix could be lower production at a given price, if the Mint wants to maintain pricing. Their sandbox, their rules.
It appears the rest of the world has fallen behind in pricing silver and gold. Good thing we have the Mint to show us the way.
HE>I
The mission statement is served by producing coins for commerce. Numismatic sales could be terminated tomorrow with no impact on their mission statement whatsoever. They are really nothing more than a side hustle for the Mint.
>
From the US Mint website:
"The mission of the U.S. Mint is to serve the American people by manufacturing and distributing circulating, precious metal and collectible coins and national medals and providing security over assets entrusted to us."
Their mission statement includes much more than "producing coins for commerce".
They may not be price gouging from a definition perspective, but they are asking a "market based" price so high that fewer and fewer people are willing to pay it.
National Commemorative Medals of the U.S. Mint:
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/u-s-coins/medals-tokens/national-commemorative-medals-united-states-mint-1940-present/alltimeset/195526
Are they cheaper by the roll?
Seriously, if I could afford a gold eagle in that price range, I would stretch a little and buy a 2006-W reverse proof, a unique coin (so far) with a mintage of 10,000.
My Adolph A. Weinman signature
I have one of the silver eagle coins on subscription for the uncirculated version. I stay away from the gold, and do get the two proof offerings from West Point and San Francisco as well each year, through subscription.
"It's their sandbox, their rules."
National Commemorative Medals of the U.S. Mint:
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/u-s-coins/medals-tokens/national-commemorative-medals-united-states-mint-1940-present/alltimeset/195526
If anyone desires a burnished AGE-as say for a type coin-they are readily available on the secondary market for a LOT less!
One can locate one of those relatively easy on the secondary for the $3170 price or even a little less with some looking.
No need to look very far if you really like these, and some are quite low actual mintages.
I know of a complete set of every single $50 burnished W mint mark gold eagle issued since 2006 in perfect SP70 PCGS holders (except this upcoming 2024, of course, LOL) available already graded for less than $3,170 a coin shipped.
I believe the 2012W had only 5,829 sold, and it is the lowest mintage, followed by the 2017W with 5,853. The Mint shows the 2020W at 6,284 and it is priced much higher than most individually when in the lower pop First Strike SP70, and the 2023W is still being sold at the Mint with 6,415 sales as of June 2nd.
Odds are fairly high, the 2024W might sell fewer than 5,829 and be the new low mintage key.
National Commemorative Medals of the U.S. Mint:
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/u-s-coins/medals-tokens/national-commemorative-medals-united-states-mint-1940-present/alltimeset/195526
$3170 for an oz. of gold, never thought I would see that.
It is a new world. Look at GameStop, Nvidia, and AI stocks. Look at the trend of US government, corporate, state, and private debt increases, annual deficits, and the money supply. The Aden sisters in a recent interview with Stuppler and Co. from their home in Puerto Rico, suggested a more likely target of closer to $7,000 gold by the end of 2027.
That $7,000/ounce would be a real "double eagle". I am buying gold and silver on dips, but not from the US Mint, who currently has the highest market prices compared to almost anyone selling in the US.
National Commemorative Medals of the U.S. Mint:
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/u-s-coins/medals-tokens/national-commemorative-medals-united-states-mint-1940-present/alltimeset/195526
At these prices, it would be shocking if it wasn't the new low mintage. "Key" is a loaded term, because if gold stays around here, or goes even higher, and if the Mint maintains the premium, demand is likely to fall off a cliff.
Prior issues in SP70 at less than $3200 are hardly a bargain, given how much they cost at release. That's the danger with these as investments. The premium is likely to disappear as the intrinsic value increases.
The reverse is also true. If gold goes back to $1,000 an ounce, a 2024 with a mintage of 5K or less is likely to sell for more than $1,800. But that will be cold comfort to anyone who pays $3200 now.
The simple fact is that these just make no sense at these prices. But, there are people willing to pay it, and it is consistent with what world mints charge for similar issues, so it is what it is.
The Mint has apparently gotten out of the business of giving new issues away at prices and/or mintages far below what the market will support, and apologizing while we complain about website crashes and getting shut out. Now they come close on some issues, like the Morgan and Peace dollars, and miss badly on things like these, where sales will fall far short of maximum mintages. Again, if gold prices collapse, these will be interesting at the maximum mintages, even with the inflated premiums.
Well, they went on sale today at noon and not one person on this forum says he bought one!!
Wonder how first day sales went.
If you tried to sell it, most dealers would only pay you melt, so not a very good nor wise purchase, in my opinion.
“I may not believe in myself but I believe in what I’m doing” ~Jimmy Page~
My Full Walker Registry Set (1916-1947):
https://www.ngccoin.com/registry/competitive-sets/16292/
‘’Odds are fairly high, the 2024W might sell fewer than 5,829 and be the new low mintage key.’’
When it breaks under a 3,000 mintage folks might start to care again.
Wondercoin
The 2011 coin was entirely neglected by all the dealers, and none of them submitted for first strikes that year. Turned out to be the lowest pop (other than the uber rare 2008 when regular collectors couldn’t submit for first strike labels). Very tough coin sub 100 pop. Here’s mine in case anyone is looking for one:
https://www.greatcollections.com/Coin/1602614/2011-W-50-One-Ounce-Gold-American-Eagle-Burnished-First-Strike-PCGS-SP-70
Source: https://www.usmint.gov/about/production-sales-figures/cumulative-sales
Ouch, that's one highly priced gold Freedom Chicken. Hot on it's heals, and release delayed once already, the gold buffalo stampedes to its releases 6/13.