Is this a new "grade" by PCGS?

AUandAG

I've not seen any announcement on a new description of ULTRA. What is going on here, is PCGS behind this marketing plan and packaging?
bob

Fraz

Re: packaging—

@emeraldATV said:
Lets see...
Brown paper bag.
A Match.
Whatever the contents.
........Somewhere there must be a doorbell to add.
You little rascal you.

U1chicago

Here is the PCGS article:

https://www.pcgs.com/news/introducing-ultrabreaks

Mr_Spud

Downtown1974

Has the allure of sports cards pack ripping if that’s your jam.

TimNH

That looks pretty clever to me. Zillions of kids are addicted to sports/pokemon type cards, they love tearing open that bag and getting the surprise of what's inside.. Here not much surprise I suppose, but there's that "1 in 100" INFINTY label chance that gives the extra fun of gambling. I bet they hook a lot of young new customers.

erscolo

Just another marketing gimmick to make more money,

fluffy155

AUandAG

Thanks, missed that announcement.

bob

VanHalen

Only $149.95 per slab! ultrabreaks.com/costyou$149.95ea

TimNH

@VanHalen said:
Only $149.95 per slab! ultrabreaks.com/costyou$149.95ea

For 1 oz of silver ok forget what i said up there about hooking lots of kids.

CaptHenway

I have a Spanish coin that says NE PLUS ULTRA on it. What’s it worth?

jmlanzaf

Vault Box...

Fraz

Vault Box!

Slowly, I turned, step by step, inch by…

Connecticoin

Gambling (legal or marginally legal) seems to have infiltrated all corners of American life these days.

AlanSki

So you pay up for some silly logo?

VanHalen

@TimNH said:

@VanHalen said:
Only $149.95 per slab! ultrabreaks.com/costyou$149.95ea

For 1 oz of silver ok forget what i said up there about hooking lots of kids.

But mine's gonna have an ounce of gold in it!

1madman

I get the feeling these are designed and made for sample slab collectors to strive for the small pop labels, but I also get the feeling sample slab collectors have no interest in these.

Please chime in to let me know if I’m way off base here

MarkInDavis

It seems to me this should have come out 5 days ago.

emeraldATV

Cool.
Kid tested ?
Brother approved,.....In progress.
Still waiting for the nine out of ten Veterinarian's approval seal. (That's of non-human animals (@ wiki)

blitzdude

@AlanSki said:
So you pay up for some silly logo?

Yep. Logos, labels, stickers, plastic slab types etc. Coin collecting seems to have gone out the window years ago. RGDS!

Walkerfan

Maybe the kids will dig it. It's certainly not my jam....

BStrauss3

@1madman said:
I get the feeling these are designed and made for sample slab collectors to strive for the small pop labels, but I also get the feeling sample slab collectors have no interest in these.

Please chime in to let me know if I’m way off base here

As far away from Sample Slab collecting as possible. We look for the spread - as many shows as possible, as many grading companies, etc.

This is more - as said above - aimed at the sports card break crowd.

Smudge

It’s best to stay in your lane.

Catbert

A thread that should thrill @NJCoin

I await a 100 post plus thread!

World67

@fluffy155 That's comedy gold.

NJCoin

@Catbert said:
A thread that should thrill @NJCoin

I await a 100 post plus thread!

It's not new, and we've already discussed it in the VB threads. It's just that the OP just woke up.

There is absolutely no reason for this thread, nothing new that has not been discussed before, and no way this thread makes it to 100 posts.

VB at least offers coins with value, albeit with a terrible house edge. These are just artificially rare pieces of paper that are printed at will. More power to anyone who wants to place value on them, but, long term, they are worth absolutely nothing because they are not even FS, FDOI, an original signature, or anything actually tied to the coin.

It's just a label and a coin. Might as well just see if there is a market for naked labels in a wrapper, because it's hard to see how common coins add any value to them, or why even casual coin collectors would place a premium on these slabs.

These are strictly being marketed to people looking for a bigger sucker to pawn them off on in the future. No one serious would place a value on some generic piece of paper they could create at home with the cheapest of color printers and a set of foil labels.

MetroD

@NJCoin said:

[...]

VB at least offers coins with value, albeit with a terrible house edge. These are just artificially rare pieces of paper that are printed at will. More power to anyone who wants to place value on them, but, long term, they are worth absolutely nothing because they are not even FS, FDOI, an original signature, or anything actually tied to the coin.

[...]

I am not, repeat NOT, challenging anything that you have said about the UB labels (i.e., ultra, gold, and infinity).

That said, it appears that UB is experimenting, and have started to add some gold coins to their most recent offerings as random 'winners' (i.e., the gold chase coins).

Example:

Source: https://ultrabreaks.com/products/ultrabreaks-around-the-world-silver-ms70-gold-chase-coins

Odds: https://ultrabreaks.com/blogs/odds/2024-silver-eagle-around-the-world-ultrabreaks

NJCoin

@MetroD said:

@NJCoin said:

[...]

VB at least offers coins with value, albeit with a terrible house edge. These are just artificially rare pieces of paper that are printed at will. More power to anyone who wants to place value on them, but, long term, they are worth absolutely nothing because they are not even FS, FDOI, an original signature, or anything actually tied to the coin.

[...]

I am not, repeat NOT, challenging anything that you have said about the UB labels (i.e., ultra, gold, and infinity).

That said, it appears that UB is experimenting, and have started to add some gold coins to their most recent offerings as random 'winners' (i.e., the gold chase coins).

Example:

Source: https://ultrabreaks.com/products/ultrabreaks-around-the-world-silver-ms70-gold-chase-coins

Odds: https://ultrabreaks.com/blogs/odds/2024-silver-eagle-around-the-world-ultrabreaks

Whatever. So, now they're taking a page out of VB's book and giving people something other than labels to chase? Good for them.

So now, for $150, people get to go after a label and a 12:3012 to get a $2300 prize, in addition to the ~$50 silver coin they are selling. I guess the steam already ran out of getting people interested in chasing the labels, so they added $27,000 to the prize pool.

Again, great for anyone who is actually interested. I honestly don't know how to value the labels, since they are literally worth $0 to me, so I'm sticking with that.

That makes this a lot less interesting than VB. At least to me. People are buying a $50 coin and spending $100 for a 12 in 3012 chance to score $2300, less the $50 coin they won't be getting if they win. Fair value suggests the price should be around $9 for a 12/3012 shot at $2250. Anyone who wants to spend $100 for that because, labels, is certainly free to do so.

Does not seem attractive at all to me, but, again, people are free to do whatever they want with their money, including throwing it straight down the toilet. I don't get the whole label thing, but this just seems straightforward enough on its face that no one needs someone like me educating them on it.

As compared to VB, that made all sorts of representations regarding distribution, values, buybacks, etc. that made it difficult for the naive or uninitiated to realize just how bad the value was until several rounds played out. Even with that, though, everything anyone would want to say about it has been said, so these threads are just not going to get the attention the earlier ones did. The last VB threads were perfect examples.

This product is just not as interesting, since it's really just labels. Again, that have absolutely nothing to do with the coins in the slabs. I'd really love it if someone can explain to me the connection, other than cards have parallel sets similar to these labels.

The distinction to me is that the cards are the product there. Here it's coins. You don't create parallel coins by putting them in a slab with label, do you? It's still just a label that has nothing to do with the coin.

So, who is supposed to value it, and why? Card collectors? Coin collectors? Label collectors? Slab collectors?

It's hard for me to see anyone valuing it, at all, once these guys stop marketing it. And they'll be gone soon enough once people balk at paying $100 for a 0.4% chance at winning $2250, or caring about artificially rare pieces of foil that literally anyone can ask PCGS to create for them. Or just create for themselves at home.

PerryHall

I wonder if it's possible to weigh the unopened package to get an indication of what's inside. I wonder if the unopened package will increase in value in the future long after this marketing gimmick runs its course.

..

Packaging, inserts and slabs oh my! 🎶🎵

tcollects

@PerryHall said:
I wonder if it's possible to weigh the unopened package to get an indication of what's inside. I wonder if the unopened package will increase in value in the future long after this marketing gimmick runs its course.

I was thinking about that, too, but everything should weigh an ounce, right?

PerryHall

@tcollects said:

@PerryHall said:
I wonder if it's possible to weigh the unopened package to get an indication of what's inside. I wonder if the unopened package will increase in value in the future long after this marketing gimmick runs its course.

I was thinking about that, too, but everything should weigh an ounce, right?

The silver one ounce coins are larger than the gold once ounce coins so the insert retainer ring for the gold coin should weight slightly more than the one for the silver coin. It was more of a hypothetical question and it may not be practical to use the package weight to determine what coin is inside.

Goldbully

@NJCoin said:

@Catbert said:
A thread that should thrill @NJCoin

I await a 100 post plus thread!

It's not new, and we've already discussed it in the VB threads. It's just that the OP just woke up.

There is absolutely no reason for this thread, nothing new that has not been discussed before, and no way this thread makes it to 100 posts.

VB at least offers coins with value, albeit with a terrible house edge. These are just artificially rare pieces of paper that are printed at will. More power to anyone who wants to place value on them, but, long term, they are worth absolutely nothing because they are not even FS, FDOI, an original signature, or anything actually tied to the coin.

It's just a label and a coin. Might as well just see if there is a market for naked labels in a wrapper, because it's hard to see how common coins add any value to them, or why even casual coin collectors would place a premium on these slabs.

These are strictly being marketed to people looking for a bigger sucker to pawn them off on in the future. No one serious would place a value on some generic piece of paper they could create at home with the cheapest of color printers and a set of foil labels.

---

Previous Large Thread from September 2023

BStrauss3

@NJCoin legal lottery or illegal lottery, it's still a {cost,tax} on those who slept through maths classes.

NJCoin

@BStrauss3 said:
@NJCoin legal lottery or illegal lottery, it's still a {cost,tax} on those who slept through maths classes.

Yup. But, it's very straightforward, so I have no problem letting people do what they want with this.

I absolutely don't get it, but many don't get FDOI, FS, etc., and the grading companies have turned those labels into a thriving business. Again, those labels have something to do with the coins in the slabs while these don't, but people are free to chase labels, 0.4% chance at an ounce of gold, tulip bulbs, whatever,

Quite frankly, anyone who slept through math and is attracted to spending $150 for a $50 coin in a slab, some shot at a label variation, and a 0.4% shot at an ounce of gold in exchange for their $50 coin deserves exactly what they get. Maybe their kids will witness it and stay awake in math class. 😀