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Rare 1909 S VDB with "No mint mark"

ifthevamzarockinifthevamzarockin Posts: 8,498 ✭✭✭✭✭
edited January 25, 2024 8:55AM in U.S. Coin Forum

Wow! An S mint coin with no mint mark. :D
Anyone notice anything else wrong?

https://www.ebay.com/itm/296180636996

Comments

  • ifthevamzarockinifthevamzarockin Posts: 8,498 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @IkesT said:
    This one whispers, "Counterfeit". ;)

    I thought I could hear something. ;)

  • johnny9434johnny9434 Posts: 27,333 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Thank you (Bogus coin for whatever reason)

  • alaura22alaura22 Posts: 2,492 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @ifthevamzarockin said:
    Wow! An S mint coin with no mint mark. :D
    Anyone notice anything else wrong?

    DAH, it HAS a mint mark!

  • PipestonePetePipestonePete Posts: 1,903 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Looks like that special commemorative struck using Honest Abe's less well-known nickname "Berty".

  • ifthevamzarockinifthevamzarockin Posts: 8,498 ✭✭✭✭✭

    If we can get @mr1931S to confirm this one whispers we might be able to get @burfle23 to get it removed. ;)

  • ifthevamzarockinifthevamzarockin Posts: 8,498 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @robec said:

    His response:

    “Listen I take offense suggesting that I counterfeited this coin . The pictures of the VDB that you supplied are not even from my photos of the VDB as mention it’s sold as is Purchased at an Estate sale . So get your facts straight and I warn you not to suggest that I made this coin. I a form of slander to my reputation as a 100% feedback with over 4000 sales Keep up your inaccurate verbiage and you will be hearing from my Lawyer .”

    Makes me want to send him a message. :D>:)

  • privatecoinprivatecoin Posts: 3,142 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Reported

    Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value. Zero. Voltaire. Ebay coinbowlllc

  • ifthevamzarockinifthevamzarockin Posts: 8,498 ✭✭✭✭✭

    My message to the seller

    Your listing says "No mint mark" but it appears there is an S below the date.

    The coin is a counterfeit and you should remove your listing before it is removed for you.

    Response from the seller

    It a mic up because I have another 1909 VDB IP EITHOUT A MINT MARK THANKS GOR THE CATCH

    I'm not sure what that means??? :D

  • ifthevamzarockinifthevamzarockin Posts: 8,498 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Listing was ended by the seller. ;)

  • burfle23burfle23 Posts: 2,162 ✭✭✭✭✭

    He ended it and then relisted it:

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/305367791032?hash=item471956b5b8:g:xA8AAOSwrtNlrtit

    Harsh would be proud...

  • flyguyflflyguyfl Posts: 117 ✭✭

    Still the new listing shows a mint mark. Maybe this guy has no idea what a mint mark is?

  • JimnightJimnight Posts: 10,683 ✭✭✭✭✭

    A true criminal.

  • Manifest_DestinyManifest_Destiny Posts: 3,047 ✭✭✭✭✭

    reported

  • ifthevamzarockinifthevamzarockin Posts: 8,498 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Manifest_Destiny said:
    reported

    Let us know if you get the response that AI reviewed it and found nothing wrong. :D

  • robecrobec Posts: 6,542 ✭✭✭✭✭

    This was a message from the seller an hour ago.

    I don’t know if it’s a fake I am not a licensed coin dealer or inspector are you . If you are I will listen if not the disclaimer is up I am notifying. Any potential buyer about the coins condition It’s all within eBay’s rule and regulation with the disclaimers

  • ifthevamzarockinifthevamzarockin Posts: 8,498 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @robec said:
    This was a message from the seller an hour ago.

    I don’t know if it’s a fake I am not a licensed coin dealer or inspector are you . If you are I will listen if not the disclaimer is up I am notifying. Any potential buyer about the coins condition It’s all within eBay’s rule and regulation with the disclaimers

    I got the exact same reply to my last message.

  • IkesTIkesT Posts: 2,374 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Seller lists the coin as "unauthencated"...someone should tell him that's not how you spell "inauthentic". ;)

  • ifthevamzarockinifthevamzarockin Posts: 8,498 ✭✭✭✭✭

    The new listing has been removed. :)

  • robecrobec Posts: 6,542 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @ifthevamzarockin said:
    The new listing has been removed. :)

    Looking through his listings he’s nothing more than a snake oil salesman. Everyone of his coins are questionable. If you’re looking for a small date 1982 with no mint mark, he’s got two of ‘em.

  • ifthevamzarockinifthevamzarockin Posts: 8,498 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @robec said:

    @ifthevamzarockin said:
    The new listing has been removed. :)

    Looking through his listings he’s nothing more than a snake oil salesman. Everyone of his coins are questionable. If you’re looking for a small date 1982 with no mint mark, he’s got two of ‘em.

    Yeah, and plenty of the rare no mint mark coins. ;)

  • Manifest_DestinyManifest_Destiny Posts: 3,047 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @ifthevamzarockin said:

    @Manifest_Destiny said:
    reported

    Let us know if you get the response that AI reviewed it and found nothing wrong. :D

  • stevekstevek Posts: 27,474 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Even if the coin was authentic, which I don't think it is, it's a bit overpriced anyway. Of course he's trying to reel in a fish with a best offer.

    Before the advent of PCGS, a local coin shop dealer who I would patronize often, mostly for supplies and occasionally a coin purchase, told me this story. We were both members of the same coin club, and would have a friendly chat at times. So he told me about how a stranger had recently walked into his shop, and offered a 1909 S VDB for sale. Well standard procedure, he carefully scrutinized the S, determined that the S hadn't been added, made the guy an offer, the guy took the offer, and that was that.

    Turns out the VDB had been added. The dealer didn't even think to scrutinize that. I mean the 1909 S is still a key coin. Who would risk possibly damaging a key coin like that? Well the scammer did and fooled a coin dealer.

    Even back then, this story illustrates how clever and sophisticated scammers had become. and that was a long time ago. Thank goodness for PCGS starting their business. As much as I know about coins, there are some coins I would never buy unless it was in a PCGS holder, and the 1909 S VDB certainly is one of them.

  • johnny9434johnny9434 Posts: 27,333 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Poof

  • mr1931Smr1931S Posts: 5,932 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @johnny9434 said:
    Poof

    nooooooooo.......nothing that has been written in this thread so far is poofworthy. ;)

    Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein

  • jesbrokenjesbroken Posts: 9,044 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Not a fake 1909 VDB but wouldn't it be more rare if it was a 1909 SVDB without the mintmark? I bet that's his scheme. lol
    Jim


    When a man who is honestly mistaken hears the truth, he will either quit being mistaken or cease to be honest....Abraham Lincoln

    Patriotism is supporting your country all the time, and your government when it deserves it.....Mark Twain
  • ifthevamzarockinifthevamzarockin Posts: 8,498 ✭✭✭✭✭
  • ifthevamzarockinifthevamzarockin Posts: 8,498 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Might as well throw a 1916 D in with the mix. ;)

    https://www.ebay.com/itm/166562799857

  • johnny9434johnny9434 Posts: 27,333 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 24, 2024 10:41AM

    @mr1931S said:

    @johnny9434 said:
    Poof

    nooooooooo.......nothing that has been written in this thread so far is poofworthy. ;)

    i was rerefering to the thread saying the listing went poof. next time ill add more werds ;)

  • stevekstevek Posts: 27,474 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @jesbroken said:
    Not a fake 1909 VDB but wouldn't it be more rare if it was a 1909 SVDB without the mintmark? I bet that's his scheme. lol
    Jim

    I agree. Something in his convoluted mind made him come up with the idea.

    Next he'll be trying out clever ways to steal candy from babies.

  • stevekstevek Posts: 27,474 ✭✭✭✭✭

    "Don't let this deal get away!"

    I just did let this deal get away.

  • stevekstevek Posts: 27,474 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @ifthevamzarockin said:
    Might as well throw a 1916 D in with the mix. ;)

    I'm not familiar with Mercury Dimes.

    Does the D stand for Defective?

  • mr1931Smr1931S Posts: 5,932 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @stevek said:
    Even if the coin was authentic, which I don't think it is, it's a bit overpriced anyway. Of course he's trying to reel in a fish with a best offer.

    Before the advent of PCGS, a local coin shop dealer who I would patronize often, mostly for supplies and occasionally a coin purchase, told me this story. We were both members of the same coin club, and would have a friendly chat at times. So he told me about how a stranger had recently walked into his shop, and offered a 1909 S VDB for sale. Well standard procedure, he carefully scrutinized the S, determined that the S hadn't been added, made the guy an offer, the guy took the offer, and that was that.

    Turns out the VDB had been added. The dealer didn't even think to scrutinize that. I mean the 1909 S is still a key coin. Who would risk possibly damaging a key coin like that? Well the scammer did and fooled a coin dealer.

    Even back then, this story illustrates how clever and sophisticated scammers had become. and that was a long time ago. Thank goodness for PCGS starting their business. As much as I know about coins, there are some coins I would never buy unless it was in a PCGS holder, and the 1909 S VDB certainly is one of them.

    At the end of the day, it's all about the forever guarantee of authenticity one gets with a PCGS authenticated coin.

    Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein

  • FrazFraz Posts: 1,591 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 24, 2024 5:39PM

    Mint mark is a mark on a coin from the mint. If a coin from the mint has a mint mark, it is an error—if the coin does not come from the mint nor have a mint mark, that is also an error. Many of these coins have die on them. A die is something on coins’s surfaces and two of them on a coin (double die, dice) are gold in your pocket. Double die (dice) shows up with DDO, DDR, cuds, and ANACS on the coin as well. They’re easy to identify because they’re one of a kind. Many are certified without certification.
    You have to keep an open mind when you look at certain sellers’ coins now.

  • burfle23burfle23 Posts: 2,162 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Both listings were reported and removed.

  • burfle23burfle23 Posts: 2,162 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 24, 2024 5:46PM

    @ifthevamzarockin said:
    If we can get @mr1931S to confirm this one whispers we might be able to get @burfle23 to get it removed. ;)

    Nothing from mr1931S?

  • mr1931Smr1931S Posts: 5,932 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 25, 2024 8:47AM

    The second S V.D.B. shown here has an 'S' placement very, very close (if not right on) to PCGS #3 (or Harsche #2) for 1909-S V.D.B. The very slight right tilt of the 'S' even matches up favorably with PCGS#3/Harsche#2. Nonetheless, the 'S' looks "funny" to me. And so does the V.D.B. look odd for a 1909-S V.D.B. The V.D.B. appears to be authentic but is most likely from a 1909 Philadelphia mint cent.

    Not a coin that would interest me if I were in the market for another 1909-S V.D.B. Images are poor but good enough to see small gouges and digs on it, front and back. The only way for me to be certain about this coin being an authentic or fake 1909-S V.D.B. would be to do an in-hand detailed inspection of it with a 10x loupe. It's simply not worth the bother of buying this raw piece off a seller on ebay and then hope it's real.

    Give me an in-focus closeup pic of that 'S' and I would have more to say about this piece.

    Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein

  • mr1931Smr1931S Posts: 5,932 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 25, 2024 6:55AM

    The first piece would have "no mintmark" if the ebay buyer were to give it an acetone bath?

    Seller: "Look, I told you 'no mintmark' and now you want your money back?" :p

    Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein

  • mr1931Smr1931S Posts: 5,932 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 25, 2024 7:00AM

    Lincoln Memorial (1959-2008).

    mr1931S: "Run Forrest, run!"

    Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein

This discussion has been closed.