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Early Copper Question no. 2

ashelandasheland Posts: 22,572 ✭✭✭✭✭

On the reverse, pretty much in the word America is this dark, reddish color. Anyone know what that is? Or what causes it?
Would that be considered environmental damage?

Comments

  • johnny9434johnny9434 Posts: 27,332 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Ketchup stain from the grading room?

  • savoyspecialsavoyspecial Posts: 7,266 ✭✭✭✭

    this color has always scared me with copper

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  • RLSnapperRLSnapper Posts: 495 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I have seen that type of staining on Large Cents before. It is a hard pass for me.

  • calgolddivercalgolddiver Posts: 1,379 ✭✭✭✭✭

    plenty of other options - pass on the red material.

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  • jmlanzafjmlanzaf Posts: 31,338 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Yes, it is PROBABLY corrosion.

    I say probably because coins do get stained with other things but it will be hard to do anything in the slab.

    For example, I've had hundreds of coins over the years that came to me with various colors of wax on them. From different sources. I'm not sure why people were storing their coins with crayons or candles, but multiple people have. Lol.

  • Walkerguy21DWalkerguy21D Posts: 11,072 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 11, 2024 12:58PM

    @RLSnapper said:
    I have seen that type of staining on Large Cents before. It is a hard pass for me.

    Generally agree, but I’ve seen where sometimes the photography of copper can exaggerate this color as well.
    But there looks to be various issues going on with the reverse, stains, marks, etc.
    Despite the low mintage and popularity, there are plenty of 1857 large and small dates to choose from.

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  • coinbufcoinbuf Posts: 10,625 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I'm going to tie this to your other thread, this looks to me like a coin where someone removed the "gunk" as you called in in your other thread. When verdigris is removed it can reveal a surface that looks different in color and surface quality than the rest of the coin.

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  • ashelandasheland Posts: 22,572 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Interesting responses! This is another coin that’s just stock at the shop I work at, it wasn’t being considered at all, I’ve just always wondered what this color was…

  • SurfinxHISurfinxHI Posts: 2,327 ✭✭✭✭✭

    It’s a raised surface, so it isn’t a stain. Looks like old sealing wax or something like that. It is a gunk!

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  • jerseybenjerseyben Posts: 108 ✭✭✭

    Looks like corrosion that has been neutralized with some sort of solution and then possibly retoned. I would personally put this one at XF details.

  • lkeneficlkenefic Posts: 7,632 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I've seen this a lot on early copper... and I believe it's some form of corrosion too. Although it's not as aggressive as green corrosion (ie. Pitting) it does seem to linger after using acetone or Coin Conditioner. I've not tried a long olive oil soak yet... I have a cheap (relatively) 1832 that has a patch of this stuff I might try this on. As others have already said... 1857s were saved since they were the last large planchet Cents so finding a better specimen isnt to difficult...

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  • johnny9434johnny9434 Posts: 27,332 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 13, 2024 4:51PM

    looks almost like a wax or mix of something, jmo

  • telephoto1telephoto1 Posts: 4,704 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited January 12, 2024 9:19AM

    @jmlanzaf said:
    Yes, it is PROBABLY corrosion.

    I say probably because coins do get stained with other things, but it will be hard to do anything in the slab.

    For example, I've had hundreds of coins over the years that came to me with various colors of wax on them. From different sources. I'm not sure why people were storing their coins with crayons or candles, but multiple people have. Lol.

    Funny you mention that... From back when I was a kid I remember an elderly relative saying that in HIS childhood apparently it was not uncommon to put a few drops of hot wax on a larger size coin and quickly affix a skinny candle thereto, providing a stable base for the candle. Some folks didn't have fancy candle holders.

    Edit to add that in the case of the coin in question here better pics would help define the red stuff... not totally sure it's wax but it may well be.


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  • Coin FinderCoin Finder Posts: 6,933 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Looks like corrosion. These come nice. Last year of issue. Better examples can be found..

  • opportunityopportunity Posts: 989 ✭✭✭✭

    My guess, it probably sat touching something for a long time that caused it to turn that color in that spot. There's really no way back from that...it's environmentally damaged. Even if it could be removed, it would ruin an otherwise not so terrible coin.

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  • NewEnglandRaritiesNewEnglandRarities Posts: 1,017 ✭✭✭✭

    Back in the day we used to call green verdigris and red “oxidation”. Truthfully you see multiple colors on early copper because the copper itself was mixed with other metals more so than today, so many different things can happen when exposed to environment over 150-300 years!

    Generally you can find such a coin without this, but it most likely is inactive and will look exactly like that 200 years from now!

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  • Married2CoinsMarried2Coins Posts: 146 ✭✭✭

    The fact that it is raised on the coin leaves ONLY two answers, it is either corrosion or a residue.

    I've bought so many problem coins as a beginner that after thirty yoears, I consider myself to be pretty much an expert on plugs, corrosion, repairs. I bought counterfeits too but I'll leave that up to PCGS. Red corrosion is active corrosion. The fact that the coin's surfacesare so nice and the shape & location (trapped in the resesses of the design) of the red color PLUS its hard edges with what looks like a thin undercut at some points is confirmation enough for me that this is a residue that can be removed from the coin. As for what it is: There is a red polishing rouge that jewelers use so that would be my best guess. Some kind of wax would be my second guess. I don't think the coin is worth professional conservation. Sell it and get another one without the red stuff.

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