1866 Shield Nickel - Unusual Die variety

USA240

Has anyone ever seen this particular 1866 Shield Nickel Die Variety before?
There is an odd-looking circular ring going through the reverse stars.
The closest description I could find is possible lathe line markings - The number 5 also shows some interesting looking recutting.
Thank you!

CaptHenway

I have seen that die before. I have no idea what caused those lines.

yosclimber

On NGC Variety Plus, there are a couple of varieties they call "lathe lines":

1. 1866 RAYS LATHE LINES VP-011 5C MS
   NGC Attribution: LATHE LINES VP-011
   Diagnostics
   Concentric circles of raised lines are visible on the reverse from the lathe turning process.

Comments
Such lines typically are polished off of the die before coining begins, but this die appears to have been rushed to the press.

2. 1866 RAYS LATHE LINES VP-014 5C MS
   NGC Attribution: LATHE LINES VP-014
   Diagnostics
   Unlike the VP-008 and VP-011, which show lathe lines on the obverse or reverse respectively, this shows the lines from the lathe turning process on both the obverse and the reverse. On the obverse, semi-circular lines are visible within the shield as a remnant of the lathe turning process. Meanwhile on the reverse, concentric circles of raised lines are visible from the lathe turning process.

Comments
These lines are typically polished off before coining. While occasionally an obverse or a reverse die would not be polished before coining, resulting in something similar to both VP-008 and VP-011, it seems that in this die marriage neither the obverse nor reverse die were polished resulting in both sides showing lines from the lathe turning process.

https://www.ngccoin.com/variety-plus/united-states/nickels/shield-five-cents-1866-1883/

I'm not sure about the explanation.
It seems like lathe lines could be on the hub,
or on the die prior to hubbing.
For a die, any polishing to remove lathe lines should happen prior to hubbing.

sellitstore

Interesting variety and visible enough that I'm surprised that it hasn't received wider attention earlier.

Repunched stars and numerals can be seen as well, which is quite typical of this particular new design and hard metal. Die breaks and clashed dies are common, too, among well used dies on early 3 and 5 cent nickel coins.

USA240

@yosclimber said:
On NGC Variety Plus, there are a couple of varieties they call "lathe lines":

1. 1866 RAYS LATHE LINES VP-011 5C MS
   NGC Attribution: LATHE LINES VP-011
   Diagnostics
   Concentric circles of raised lines are visible on the reverse from the lathe turning process.

Comments
Such lines typically are polished off of the die before coining begins, but this die appears to have been rushed to the press.

2. 1866 RAYS LATHE LINES VP-014 5C MS
   NGC Attribution: LATHE LINES VP-014
   Diagnostics
   Unlike the VP-008 and VP-011, which show lathe lines on the obverse or reverse respectively, this shows the lines from the lathe turning process on both the obverse and the reverse. On the obverse, semi-circular lines are visible within the shield as a remnant of the lathe turning process. Meanwhile on the reverse, concentric circles of raised lines are visible from the lathe turning process.

Comments
These lines are typically polished off before coining. While occasionally an obverse or a reverse die would not be polished before coining, resulting in something similar to both VP-008 and VP-011, it seems that in this die marriage neither the obverse nor reverse die were polished resulting in both sides showing lines from the lathe turning process.

https://www.ngccoin.com/variety-plus/united-states/nickels/shield-five-cents-1866-1883/

I'm not sure about the explanation.
It seems like lathe lines could be on the hub,
or on the die prior to hubbing.
For a die, any polishing to remove lathe lines should happen prior to hubbing.

Those images do look similar - Thank you for the information!

USA240

@sellitstore said:
Interesting variety and visible enough that I'm surprised that it hasn't received wider attention earlier.

Repunched stars and numerals can be seen as well, which is quite typical of this particular new design and hard metal. Die breaks and clashed dies are common, too, among well used dies on early 3 and 5 cent nickel coins.

I agree - Maybe the die was removed or reworked soon after use?

USA240

@CaptHenway said:
I have seen that die before. I have no idea what caused those lines.

Seems pretty noticeable - Surprised that more have not been reported.

OAKSTAR

I just check my 7070. I have it also but not as dramatic as yours.

CaptHenway

@USA240 said:

@CaptHenway said:
I have seen that die before. I have no idea what caused those lines.

Seems pretty noticeable - Surprised that more have not been reported.

Yes, but there are so many amazing die varieties on Shield Nickels, many of them highly popular doubled dies and/or blundered dates, that a die processing anomaly like this could easily get less attention than you might think.