Recent purchase - Counterfeit CBH coins
Herb_T
Posts: 1,754 ✭✭✭✭✭
Recently, Stacks had some counterfeit CBH coins that they sold. These coins were listed as counterfeit and were not slabbed. I got an 1823, 1833 and 1838.
All 3 coins had edges that were just plain wrong.
The 1838 had a lettered edge, but is supposed to have a reeded edge.
The 1833 had a messed up edge. It wasn’t lettered or with reed. Just messed up. Supposed to have lettered edge.
The 1823 was the best of the bunch at least at first blush. The edge was close but among the few letters there were S I N. Go figure.
I will try to post some photos in next few days.
2
Comments
Why did they sell counterfeit coins? What verifying info was associated with each fake? Looking forward to your pics.
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Assume these were contemporary counterfeit bust halves, which are highly collectible.
If you want to know more about the contemporary counterfeit halves there is a book by Keith Davignon on them. The second edition is the current issue.
A: The year they spend more on their library than their coin collection.
A numismatist is judged more on the content of their library than the content of their cabinet.
BHNC #248 … 130 and counting.
Here are the 3 lots they sold…
Contemporary counterfeits are avidly bought, sold and collected and there is a tremendous reference work on the issues by Keith Davignon. These are a great niche.
In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson
The closing prices on those lots seem low as to compared to past sales of these. I'd think each would have done better if sold as single lots instead of in groupings.
peacockcoins
Did you pay for the counterfeit coins with counterfeit money, lol? 😂
Steve
My collecting “Pride & Joy” is my PCGS Registry Dansco 7070 Set:
https://www.pcgs.com/setregistry/type-sets/design-type-sets/complete-dansco-7070-modified-type-set-1796-date/publishedset/213996
Although you are certainly correct, Stack's assembles their lots with a target minimum price.
"But seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things shall be added unto you" Matthew 6:33. Young fellow suffering from Bust Half fever.
BHNC #AN-10
JRCS #1606
They're leaving money on the table not only against themselves but also their loyal consigners.
peacockcoins
I totally agree. The consigner most likely done better at Great Collections on these. Ebay is funny about contemporary counterfeits and may or may not allow the listings. I did not know about these being offered. I would have bid higher myself!
I think the forgeries are more interesting than the originals sometimes. Some of them are fairly crude with lettering, milled edges etc - amazing to think that the people who created them passed them.
one of the few I have left...
Even worse, he used a check that bounced!!
Real
Counterfeit
Real
Counterfeit
Real
Counterfeit
@HerbT for contemporary counterfeits, those first two are full of detail and eye appealing! Thanks for sharing those.
"But seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things shall be added unto you" Matthew 6:33. Young fellow suffering from Bust Half fever.
BHNC #AN-10
JRCS #1606
ICG actually offered to buy one of my counterfeit Bust halves for their educational work.
That counterfeit 1823 is very well made!
Definitely some > @Walkerguy21D said:
Maybe a little to well?
Inclined to think it a modern counterfeit.
Davignon number?
1-A
"But seek ye first the kingdom of God and His righteousness and all these things shall be added unto you" Matthew 6:33. Young fellow suffering from Bust Half fever.
BHNC #AN-10
JRCS #1606
I tried to get photos of the edges, but easier said than done. The 1823 had the best edge of the 3. However, there was an area on the edge that looked like the metal had been bunched up (how it might look if it had been hanging from a chain, but clearly wasn’t). I haven’t seen an edge like that on any of the CBH I have or even looked at.
My understanding is that Great Collections only sells coins slabbed by PCGS, NGC and ANACS.
And I believe none of these slabbing companies will (knowingly) slab a counterfeit coin.
Well I'll be darned...
Haven't seen CC busties look that close to what they're supposed to.
You won't.
These were made way back in the day by coiners with pretty rudimentary equipment and skills.
That's why the 1823 above threw me off.. most won't look anywhere as legit as this one.
At least one of the CC's you picked up must be pretty valuable or I doubt you would have had to pay what you paid to win the lot.
@jacrispies can probably help you identify which one and how nice of a score it is...
As mentioned it is the 1-A for the year.
DEFINATELY NOT modern. If you go back decades these have been misidentified as trial strikes or patterns in the past. Bust half expert, Stewart Witham, wrote about them in the Numismatic Scrapbook magazine in the 1960’s.
I purchased my first one in the 1970’s from someone who had sent it to ANACS thinking it was a die trial.
A: The year they spend more on their library than their coin collection.
A numismatist is judged more on the content of their library than the content of their cabinet.
A pst script to my previous post.
There is an 1825 that is just as deceptive. I remember a story that a dealer had one get through one of the major services some years ago. Thought it was a new die marriage for the series but is a Davignon 1-A for 1825.
Other very deceptive fakes are known for 1832 and 1833. If you want to know more see Keith Davignon and my presentation in the ANS’s COAC, Coinage of the Americas Conference on contemporary counterfeits from, I believe, 1998.
A: The year they spend more on their library than their coin collection.
A numismatist is judged more on the content of their library than the content of their cabinet.
There is an 1825 that is just as deceptive. I remember a story that a dealer had one get through one of the major services some years ago. Thought it was a new die marriage for the series but is a Davignon 1-A for 1825.
Unfortunately this one no longer resides with me.