grade-flation and ikes
kookstek
Posts: 18 ✭
Seen quite a few examples recently of eisenhower dollars on great collections where these coins were previously 66 or 66+ and now they are 66+’s and 67’s. What’s the boards take, do you price up or do you think buyers are largely unaware?
In an upcoming Dec auction date on GC, there is a 74p that was originally a 66, now a 66+ CAC, and prior to being a 66, it was sold on DLRC for a couple hundred. Great find for seller, but is a good thing for the hobby.
Gives me some pause for sure.
Chris
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Agreed. I did a top set last year my 1971-D was a great coin MS67 but did not CAC, now it's the cover coin on coin facts in a 67+ holder. My 1971 was a MS66 CAC now a MS66+ CAC. 1976-D MS66+ CAC now MS67, there are others but I'll stop there. Oddly in 2020 the coins I was getting back was just the opposite, undergraded 1-2 points.
Go Lowball.
Takes the worry of over-grading right out of the picture.
peacockcoins
Actually, it makes overgrading a bigger problem. How are you going to get a Poor 1 if they keep over-grading things?
Once again. . . proven wrong...
peacockcoins
Now I feel like it looks like I'm targeting you. I didn't even realize you had posted it.
It happened to me.
I had a74P Ike in P66 sell on GC in April 2021 for $900. That's nice. The coin did not stand out to me as an MS67 candidate. Forward to August 2022 I recognize my former 74P in a GC auction as PCGS MS67 (with a CAC sticker to boot - I thought CAC was supposed to be super strict). The PCGS serial number was not the same but I recognized the toning pattern on the coin - and the previous serial number is "no longer in the system".
This coin brought $19000+ this time. (I could REALLY use a hit like this myself). What can one say?
How does this happen?
I've been submitting CN clad Ikes since about August(?) of 1998 so I have a fair idea of what the coins are supposed to look like.
Upgrades happen in all series. I have noticed multiple Morgans that sold at GC as MS 65 or MS 66 later end up as MS 67 or better. It's frustrating, especially if you tried sending it in more than once and never got the higher grade. But we also don't know how many times the new owner tried. There was the famous incident with a $130k Franklin that was tried double digit times until it finally achieved the top grade.
‘’It happened to me.
I had a74P Ike in P66 sell on GC in April 2021 for $900. That's nice. The coin did not stand out to me as an MS67 candidate. Forward to August 2022 I recognize my former 74P in a GC auction as PCGS MS67 (with a CAC sticker to boot - I thought CAC was supposed to be super strict). The PCGS serial number was not the same but I recognized the toning pattern on the coin - and the previous serial number is "no longer in the system".
This coin brought $19000+ this time. (I could REALLY use a hit like this myself). What can one say?
How does this happen?
I've been submitting CN clad Ikes since about August(?) of 1998 so I have a fair idea of what the coins are supposed to look like.’’
Yep- myriad examples of this, including even the one and only MS68 clad (77) being a 67+ that became the pop 2 in the 67+ grade to the pop 1 coin in my set at the time that the majority of board members liked even more than the second graded 67+ coin (and then that second graded 67+ into the 68 holder), the key date 72 Ty 2 MS66+ (pop 1) that my son wouldn’t let me even bid on as my MS66 CAC is a far nicer coin per his assessment of both coins, at least one of the two MS69 76-S Ikes that is not 69 grade 19/20 other grading days (generous), etc., etc. etc. And, I could write in dozens of other coins.
The CAC issue you raise - I am personally researching / investigating that very closely myself.
Wondercoin
I don't want to sound ignorant.
However, I hear this term "gradeflation" used alot.
Can someone give me a clear definition please?
Student of numismatics and collector of Morgan dollars
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A coin that was MS65 10 years ago is now considered MS66.
The theory is that the application of the standards have gotten looser over time.
Does anyone know if this has happened in reverse?
Yes, when you go to SELL the coin at your local coin shop.
peacockcoins
The coin in this holder...
Is the same coin in this holder - nothing changed on the coin. The holder was damaged in the mail with no effect on the coin.
This coincided with grading standards being noticeably tightened, IMO, for VF and EF SLH coins.
Thanks for the responses!
Here’s another example, 76p type 2, and now it’s a 67+, like is it the submitter or what?
I owned it for a spell as a 67 and specifically decided to sell bc I thought the luster was on par with 66’s, def not 67 luster, but it had that sheen which demarks a fresh die. I’ve come to appreciate that special die luster which comes across as sheen. I’m not dogging it, just my observation, so we will see how the market responds. I bet it gets a little more premium.
Lowball? More like cue ball thanks to Ike's head!
what makes em special is when you get to see a glorious toned ike or one with fantastic luster and finish.
this is where the gradeflation really starts to chip away at the coin hobby’s integrity. it would be best if pcgs was more transparent when they tweak their standards.
PCGS would tell you that they have not changed their standards.
It's not a theory...
RIP Mom- 1932-2012