1838 Half Dimes - Linking the Reverses of V-6, V-9, V-13, and V-1

epc

In a discussion on the Liberty Seated Coins Boards, @yosclimber posted a draft 1838 half dime die pair table (see https://www.tapatalk.com/groups/seateddimes/1838-new-die-marriage-t5957.html). In it, three different reverse dies are listed for V-1, V-6 & V-9, and V-13. This was based on the presence of the "notched leaf" feature in V-6, V-9, and V-13, but not in V-1, and a crack at the top of A2 that seems present only in V-13 and V-1. I have believed they are all the same die, but did not have good photographic evidence to convince him. I think I do now.

I recently obtained an example of what we've been calling V-9. It clearly has the A2 crack. Beyond that, close examination reveals a faint beginning of a crack that's obvious in V-1, starting left of S2, and going across the wreath to H.

Here are several of my coins, in sequence:

V-6

V-6a

V-9

This is my first time posting here with images. It's not letting me add more. So I'll try responding to this post with the others.

epc

Okay, let's see if I can add the next three coins...

V-9, the recently acquired coin (I can't seem to get the obverse in-line here.)

V-13

V-1 VEDS

I think the V-6 and V-6a are linked by a few minute features, such as a spur of extra metal at the end of the right ribbon.

V-6a and V-9 are linked by the complete and then partial die line extending from K7 to A4. I wonder if the line was the result of an object between the die and a coin, such that that coin is out there somewhere with a nice strike-through line corresponding to the raised line on subsequently produced V-6a coins.

The second V-9 clearly has the crack at the top of A2, linking it to V-13 and V-1. And since V-9 and V-13 share the same obverse, they are the same marriage.

The crack from S2 to H further links V-9 and V-13 (faint crack only in the wreath) to V-1 (the longer, more obvious crack).

Alan

Bikergeek

I just want to jump in to offer kudos to @epc and @yosclimber for the deep dive into these dies. I'm not a Seated guy - my passion lies with the capped bust half dimes that just precede this set - but one of the joys of the early mint products is that you can still make discoveries and have debates almost 200 years down the road. Cool stuff.

epc

Thanks, @Bikergeek. @yosclimber is doing most of the "deep dive" in this series. I've been mostly pursuing examples of die marriages and die states for my collection, and pitch in any information I happen to acquire along the way.

yosclimber

It was @epc's discovery of new proof obverses and his goal of obtaining all the 1838 die marriages that
yielded a lot of study and got me motivated to work on the attribution guides more seriously.
And the 1838 quest and new discoveries continue!

Walkerguy21D

Hello experts - I’ve had this one in my Type album for over 30 years.
What variety is it? I think it’s a Small Stars type, but I’m not even sure about that:

yosclimber

Yes, it's a V-1 "rusty arm", aka small stars.
You can see the bumps on the arm next to the pole in your photo.
The stars do not actually get "thin" (Valentine's word, not small) until a later die state.
I saved copies of your photos of this coin back when you posted them in 2018 and attributed it at that time.

Walkerguy21D

@yosclimber said:
Yes, it's a V-1 "rusty arm", aka small stars.
You can see the bumps on the arm next to the pole in your photo.
The stars do not actually get "thin" (Valentine's word, not small) until a later die state.
I saved copies of your photos of this coin back when you posted them in 2018 and attributed it at that time.

Thanks so much - you are a true numismatic scholar.
I’m going to write it down this time, so I don’t come back asking in another 5 years Lol!
God willing, of course….
And if you need any early or middle date large cents attributed, I owe you.