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Should there be a reset in Israel Coin Values

bidaskbidask Posts: 13,812 ✭✭✭✭✭
edited October 14, 2023 5:39PM in World & Ancient Coins Forum

On May 14 1948 Israel became a modern country .

Their legal tender coin designs since 1948 commemorates much of their history .

Yet the coins and ( medals) themselves are cheap as coin collector items.

I am probably in the minority here but I think Israel coins ( and medals) deserve a reset in value and wouldn't be surprised to see this happen .

Below is a gold medal that commemorates the raid on Entebbe.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Entebbe_raid

No country cares more about their citizens than Israel.

Your thoughts?

I manage money. I earn money. I save money .
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.




Comments

  • pruebaspruebas Posts: 4,276 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Not sure what you mean by a "reset," but I will say that people probably do collect Israeli coins, but not the modern NCLT, which is most of it.

    Look at Isle of Man. There are legitimately collectible coins issued there. But the modern NCLT has ruined the numismatics of Isle of Man.

    Ditto Gibraltar. Ditto Cook Islands. Ditto Israel. Etc.....

  • bidaskbidask Posts: 13,812 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Israel Coins and Medals

    Relive the Past, Preserve the Present, Ensure the Future

    Israel Coins and Medals Corp. (ICMC) was established in 1958 by Israel's first Prime Minister David Ben Gurion. Its purpose was then, and still is, to commemorate the national and historic events of the State of Israel and its outstanding personalities, and the milestones in our culture, art and people. ICMC was designated an ambassador for the distribution of the legal tender commemorative coins issued by the Bank of Israel and the Israel State Medals, as well as for the promotion of Israeli artistry and Judaica.

    ICMC was fully owned by the Israel Government until 2008, when it was privatized and bought by the G.R.A.S. Group. In the privatization agreement, ICMC pledged to the Government that it would maintain the company's traditional character and scope of activity. Today, ICMC operates in a wide range of activities, with special emphasis on production and global promotion of gold and silver for investment under The Holy Land Mint trademark.

    I manage money. I earn money. I save money .
    I give away money. I collect money.
    I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.




  • SapyxSapyx Posts: 1,959 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @pruebas said:
    Not sure what you mean by a "reset," but I will say that people probably do collect Israeli coins, but not the modern NCLT, which is most of it.

    Look at Isle of Man. There are legitimately collectible coins issued there. But the modern NCLT has ruined the numismatics of Isle of Man.

    Ditto Gibraltar. Ditto Cook Islands. Ditto Israel. Etc.....

    I suppose the key difference between Israel and those other countries, from a numismatic perspective, is that the Israeli items were actually mad in Israel, rather than being made by a corporate mint elsewhere that is using that country as a flag of convenience. The Israeli ones are "more genuine", in that sense. And most of the things commemorated on Israeli coins and medals are actually relevant to to the history and culture of Israel; there's very little Star Wars / Bugs Bunny / Lord of the Rings bandwagon-jumping from the Israeli mint.

    Opposing this there is, of course, another connected issue, which is a major factor affecting Israeli coin demand: that Israel itself, and coins from Israel by extension, is a polarizing political issue. Whether you agree with it or not, for a certain section of the community, buying coins from the government of Israel would be like buying coins from Nazi Germany, if Nazi Germany were still in power. I'm sure there are many people who would take the attitude "I collect world coins, but I won't collect Israeli coins", not even from the secondary market. This reduction in the size of the potential pool of collectors reduces demand will cause a downward pressure in price.

    Another factor affecting demand, particularly overseas demand, is language. Most people outside of Israel can't read Hebrew, and Hebrew is always the dominant language on most Israeli coins and medals; English, if present at all, is very much secondary.

    Finally, there's the issue of supply. Israel has made an awful lot of these things over the years, both "coins" and "medals". They all tend to have very similar themes and a very similar artistic style. Mintages tend to be high, and the coins and medals remain on sale from the Israeli mint until they sell out, sometimes years after the event being commemorated. The medals in particular often had no mintage limit, and more would be struck of orders exceeded expectations. Owning one or two, as examples, might be desirable, but owning the whole set? Only the most dedicated (and well-funded) collector desires that.

    High supply and low demand combine to make investment profits minimal. So investor-collectors stay away from the series, which in turn keeps prices even lower.

    So for me, the factors that help keep secondary market prices for Israeli coins depressed, are understandable.

    Waste no more time arguing what a good man should be. Be one.
    Roman emperor Marcus Aurelius, "Meditations"

    Apparently I have been awarded one DPOTD. B)
  • pruebaspruebas Posts: 4,276 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Sapyx said:

    @pruebas said:
    Not sure what you mean by a "reset," but I will say that people probably do collect Israeli coins, but not the modern NCLT, which is most of it.

    Look at Isle of Man. There are legitimately collectible coins issued there. But the modern NCLT has ruined the numismatics of Isle of Man.

    Ditto Gibraltar. Ditto Cook Islands. Ditto Israel. Etc.....

    I suppose the key difference between Israel and those other countries, from a numismatic perspective, is that the Israeli items were actually mad in Israel, rather than being made by a corporate mint elsewhere that is using that country as a flag of convenience. The Israeli ones are "more genuine", in that sense. And most of the things commemorated on Israeli coins and medals are actually relevant to to the history and culture of Israel; there's very little Star Wars / Bugs Bunny / Lord of the Rings bandwagon-jumping from the Israeli mint.

    Opposing this there is, of course, another connected issue, which is a major factor affecting Israeli coin demand: that Israel itself, and coins from Israel by extension, is a polarizing political issue. Whether you agree with it or not, for a certain section of the community, buying coins from the government of Israel would be like buying coins from Nazi Germany, if Nazi Germany were still in power. I'm sure there are many people who would take the attitude "I collect world coins, but I won't collect Israeli coins", not even from the secondary market. This reduction in the size of the potential pool of collectors reduces demand will cause a downward pressure in price.

    Another factor affecting demand, particularly overseas demand, is language. Most people outside of Israel can't read Hebrew, and Hebrew is always the dominant language on most Israeli coins and medals; English, if present at all, is very much secondary.

    Finally, there's the issue of supply. Israel has made an awful lot of these things over the years, both "coins" and "medals". They all tend to have very similar themes and a very similar artistic style. Mintages tend to be high, and the coins and medals remain on sale from the Israeli mint until they sell out, sometimes years after the event being commemorated. The medals in particular often had no mintage limit, and more would be struck of orders exceeded expectations. Owning one or two, as examples, might be desirable, but owning the whole set? Only the most dedicated (and well-funded) collector desires that.

    High supply and low demand combine to make investment profits minimal. So investor-collectors stay away from the series, which in turn keeps prices even lower.

    So for me, the factors that help keep secondary market prices for Israeli coins depressed, are understandable.

    Everything you stated is true. But most people don’t care about Holy Land historic events. And none of the coins could be considered classic or iconic to a world coin collector.

    Israeli NCLT and medals had traditionally been marketed to wealthy Jews worldwide to capitalize on their pride in Jewish heritage.

    The problem with that is when those folks get old and sell (or their estates sell), there is no secondary market to buy them.

    The Goldbergs used to have huge collections of this stuff in their auctions and I bet the estates received less than bullion after the Goldberg’s commission.

    The only way those folks made money is if they bought when gold was cheap (60s & 70s), and they probably did.

  • MrEurekaMrEureka Posts: 23,829 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I agree that the NCLT is not interesting at this time. However, at some point, so much of it will have been melted that the market could catch fire. Probably not in my lifetime, but maybe.

    Andy Lustig

    Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.

    Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
  • ExbritExbrit Posts: 1,232 ✭✭✭✭

    @pruebas said:

    Look at Isle of Man. There are legitimately collectible coins issued there. But the modern NCLT has ruined the numismatics of Isle of Man.

    Interesting thought. The early IOM coinage is still very collectible, but as you said has been diminished somewhat by the more recent NCLT issues. Some of the NCLT’s do bring decent money, but there are too just many of them. Some of IOM’s recent offerings are circulated coinage and quite nice.

  • 7Jaguars7Jaguars Posts: 7,182 ✭✭✭✭✭

    I can understand the sentiment in the OP, but think relatively very low overall demand. And also I agree with the point about Goldbergs - who still have HUGE listings for sale at auctions, etc.
    And sadly as Exbrit says about IOM coinage (and I have a few of the scarcer 1972-74 circulating coins), they have absolutely drowned the market with NCLT...

    Love that Milled British (1830-1960)
    Well, just Love coins, period.
  • FrankHFrankH Posts: 756 ✭✭✭✭✭

    US has gone the NCLT route, also. :'(

  • ZoharZohar Posts: 6,627 ✭✭✭✭✭

    As an Israeli, I am "short" on Israeli coins unfortunately. No collector base here with all the limitations of language, designs etc.

    The one coin I do have and will keep is the first coin minted in tough conditions during the war of independence.

  • ExbritExbrit Posts: 1,232 ✭✭✭✭
    edited October 15, 2023 9:05AM

    @Zohar said:
    As an Israeli, I am "short" on Israeli coins unfortunately. No collector base here with all the limitations of language, designs etc.

    The one coin I do have and will keep is the first coin minted in tough conditions during the war of independence.

    Good to hear from you. Met you very briefly a few years ago along with Cathy (star city) in Baltimore. Hope all is well.

  • ZoharZohar Posts: 6,627 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Exbrit said:

    @Zohar said:
    As an Israeli, I am "short" on Israeli coins unfortunately. No collector base here with all the limitations of language, designs etc.

    The one coin I do have and will keep is the first coin minted in tough conditions during the war of independence.

    Good to hear from you. Met you very briefly a few years ago along with Cathy (star city) in Baltimore. Hope all is well.

    Of course I remember!

  • pruebaspruebas Posts: 4,276 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Zohar said:
    As an Israeli, I am "short" on Israeli coins unfortunately. No collector base here with all the limitations of language, designs etc.

    The one coin I do have and will keep is the first coin minted in tough conditions during the war of independence.

    That’s a great example of a collectible Israeli coin. But I bet the market for them is depressed since everyone is turned off by all the NCLT.

    As for language (and character set), most people cannot read Japanese or Chinese, but those countries have some iconic coins that are widely collected. But Chinese NCLT is starting to take over the world!

  • atomatom Posts: 428 ✭✭✭✭

    1967 100 Lirot iconic Victory of Six Day War, IDF (Israel Defense Forces) emblem/Jerusalem's Western Wall

  • pruebaspruebas Posts: 4,276 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Isle of Man 1 Crown Gold Cat

    Given the choice of the two, I know which I’d prefer.

  • 291fifth291fifth Posts: 23,850 ✭✭✭✭✭

    It is all a matter of supply and demand just as it is for all collectables. Coins of Israel were quite popular through the 1960s but then seemed to drop off in popularity during the 1970s. The demand does not seem to have improved much over the following decades. I think the very modernistic designs seen on many of the coins may not have much appeal to current collectors.

    All glory is fleeting.
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