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counterfeit

I sent in a coin to PCGS to be graded , They gave it a identification number following there number system. But then put counterfeit on also. No slab it came back in slip. I thought if counterfeit they would keep it. Any thoughts?

Comments

  • yosclimberyosclimber Posts: 4,771 ✭✭✭✭✭

    No, they don't keep counterfeits.

    The concept of not returning a counterfeit has some positives, but also many negatives.

    But if you like that idea, you can simply destroy it yourself and have a similar effect.

  • JBKJBK Posts: 15,475 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited August 28, 2023 1:04AM

    It's your property - they have no right to keep it.

    Besides, what if they were wrong about it being counterfeit? (Not likely in the case of PCGS, but there is that theoretical possibility).

  • PerryHallPerryHall Posts: 46,084 ✭✭✭✭✭

    They return all coins to keep from being sued. The only exception would be a coin known to be stolen property which would be turned in to the appropriate law enforcement agency.

    Worry is the interest you pay on a debt you may not owe.
    "Paper money eventually returns to its intrinsic value---zero."----Voltaire
    "Everything you say should be true, but not everything true should be said."----Voltaire

  • burfle23burfle23 Posts: 2,312 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Any images? Great education tool here!

  • ok will do it might take a little time. I know who I got the coin from so would or should I turn him in for conning me or just take it as a learning curve? its #7 at pcgs I know it was a long shot but I did not know much about it and I believe to have received a Oregan trail 26s that is counterfeit also. so I'm doing some expensive learning

  • ConshyboyConshyboy Posts: 453 ✭✭✭✭

    Report the scumbag!

  • ajaanajaan Posts: 17,356 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @JBK said:
    It's your property - they have no right to keep it.

    Besides, what if they were wrong about it being counterfeit? (Not likely in the case of PCGS, but there is that theoretical possibility).

    I had a gold coin that one leading TPG called counterfeit and the another leading TPG call authentic.


    DPOTD-3
    'Emancipate yourselves from mental slavery'

    CU #3245 B.N.A. #428


    Don
  • MFeldMFeld Posts: 13,400 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited August 28, 2023 5:00AM

    @jeff6012_ said:
    ok will do it might take a little time. I know who I got the coin from so would or should I turn him in for conning me or just take it as a learning curve? its #7 at pcgs I know it was a long shot but I did not know much about it and I believe to have received a Oregan trail 26s that is counterfeit also. so I'm doing some expensive learning

    You should politely but firmly, demand a full refund, to which (I believe) you are legally entitled.
    It's quite possible that he didn't know the coin was counterfeit. So he might not have conned you and he might not be (as described by another poster) a "scumbag".

    Mark Feld* of Heritage Auctions*Unless otherwise noted, my posts here represent my personal opinions.

  • KeshequaKeshequa Posts: 108 ✭✭✭

    Contracts on 'illegal transactions' (ie. selling a counterfeit as genuine) are not valid. Refund is due.

    Buying and Selling coins for 54 years, 700+ shows in last 20 years, and boy am I tired.
    Purchased and Trademarked the Mohawk Valley Hoard
    Originated the Rochester (NY) Area Coin Expo

  • mr1931Smr1931S Posts: 6,234 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited August 28, 2023 7:56AM

    The one and only counterfeit the dealer I bought the piece from sent PCGS had been slabbed by PCGS as genuine. They kept it because I wanted them to keep it. I received a slabbed genuine piece in the same grade (from the dealer) as a replacement for the counterfeit. Presumably, they kept the well-done counterfeit piece to use as a teaching tool for their graders. I hope they left the counterfeit in its slab and allow their new graders/authenticators to evaluate it during learning session for their opinion about it's grade/authenticity. In my opinion, it was a great piece, in it's genuine PCGS slab, for PCGS powers-that-be to identify the sharpest knives in their drawer.

    Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.-Albert Einstein

  • CaptHenwayCaptHenway Posts: 32,093 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @MFeld said:

    @jeff6012_ said:
    ok will do it might take a little time. I know who I got the coin from so would or should I turn him in for conning me or just take it as a learning curve? its #7 at pcgs I know it was a long shot but I did not know much about it and I believe to have received a Oregan trail 26s that is counterfeit also. so I'm doing some expensive learning

    You should politely but firmly, demand a full refund, to which (I believe) you are legally entitled.
    It's quite possible that he didn't know the coin was counterfeit. So he might not have conned you and he might not be (as described by another poster) a "scumbag".

    Exactly. Honest people sometimes make mistakes. give his the benefit of the doubt and request a refund.

    Numismatist. 50 year member ANA. Winner of four ANA Heath Literary Awards; three Wayte and Olga Raymond Literary Awards; Numismatist of the Year Award 2009, and Lifetime Achievement Award 2020. Winner numerous NLG Literary Awards.
  • ifthevamzarockinifthevamzarockin Posts: 8,843 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @mr1931S "Presumably, they kept the well-done counterfeit piece to use as a teaching tool for their graders. I hope they left the counterfeit in its slab and allow their new graders/authenticators to evaluate it during learning session for their opinion about it's grade/authenticity."

    It was an easy to spot counterfeit that PCGS just missed. It would be much easier to teach new graders with a TrueView photo on a large screen TV than pass a coin around. I would be willing to bet the coin was destroyed to prevent it from ever making it back into the market place. Your "Whispering VDB" is in the landfill.

  • SapyxSapyx Posts: 2,204 ✭✭✭✭✭

    Possessing and owning counterfeit coins is not illegal in America - the only crimes are making them, fraudulently attempting to use them as money, or to fraudulently sell them. Selling a counterfeit coin, when both the buyer and seller know perfectly well it's a counterfeit, is legal (though not permitted on eBay, since counterfeits are outright banned from eBay, so you'd need to find some other venue for your transaction). So there is no compulsion upon PCGS, or you, to hand the coin over to the authorities.

    PCGS aren't the Secret Service - it's not their job to collect or investigate counterfeits.

    Waste no more time arguing what a good man should be. Be one.
    Roman emperor Marcus Aurelius, "Meditations"

    Apparently I have been awarded one DPOTD. B)
  • TrampTramp Posts: 686 ✭✭✭✭✭

    PCGS returned to me the counterfeit gold coin I sent in.

    You need to know what each TPGs terms and conditions are. For instance ANACS says they reserve the right to turn over a counterfeit to the secret service. https://anacs.com/counterfeit-and-altered-coins/

    I could not locate similar policy or T&C with PCGS.

    USAF (Ret.) 1985 - 2005. E-4B Aircraft Maintenance Crew Chief and Contracting Officer.
    My current Registry sets:
    ✓ Everyman Mint State Carson City Morgan Dollars (1878 – 1893)
    ✓ Everyman Mint State Lincoln Cents (1909 – 1958)
    ✓ Morgan Dollar GSA Hoard (1878 – 1891)

  • IkesTIkesT Posts: 3,091 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @ifthevamzarockin said:
    @mr1931S "Presumably, they kept the well-done counterfeit piece to use as a teaching tool for their graders. I hope they left the counterfeit in its slab and allow their new graders/authenticators to evaluate it during learning session for their opinion about it's grade/authenticity."

    It was an easy to spot counterfeit that PCGS just missed. It would be much easier to teach new graders with a TrueView photo on a large screen TV than pass a coin around. I would be willing to bet the coin was destroyed to prevent it from ever making it back into the market place. Your "Whispering VDB" is in the landfill.

    Rumor has it the Lifetime Channel is filming a TV movie adaptation of the story - It's called Whispers in the Garbage.

    I hope they get Cliff from Cheers to play my part... ;)

  • Thank you to every one that had input. I do appreciate it.

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