Who is the only post WWII MLB player to have pitched 175 IP & hit 25 HR in a MLB season?
1948_Swell_Robinson
Posts: 1,917 ✭✭✭✭✭
in Sports Talk
Doesn't have to be done in the same season.
0
Comments
Rick Ankiel? I know he hit over 25 hr in a season, not as sure about the 175 innings though.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
Its Ankiel. He hit 25 once, and pitched 175 once. Othani was 9 innings shy of doing it last year and Mike Hampton almost did it in 2001 when he hit 16 hrs in only 79 at bats
Missouri 14 OSU 3
Ankiel is correct. 175 innings pitched his rookie year and 25 HR when he came back as an OF.
Ohtani on pace for 175 this year. Will be close.
Arbitrary limits for sure, but Ankiel gets forgotten as someone who did both for a bit.
Hampton could hit, but I think you looked one column over in the stat for for 2001. He had 7 HR and 16 RBi that year.
Ankiel's four year prime as a Center Fielder/Outfielder:
1,297 PA
53 HR
.251/.316/.451
105 OPS+
He played 799 innings in CF when he hit those 25 home runs too in 2008.
For his career he played 3,200 innings in CF.
That's not too bad keeping his head above water for four years as a MLB Centerfielder/outfielder five years after his impressive rookie year pitching 175 innings with 194K and 134 ERA+.
He got a case of the yips pitching and was injured.
In the end, Ankiel had 5.5 WAR as an Outfielder and a 3.6 WAR as a pitcher. Without looking, I'm going to guess that since Ruth that nobody else was able to achieve that by playing a position in the field and also as a pitcher. Ohtani has basically only DHed.
Another famed two way player was Brooks Kieschnick in college.
He never got the chance in MLB to do it at the same time. He was the opposite as Ankiel. He played as an OF in MLB first and then took up pitching later in his career in MLB
0.7 WAR as an outfielder
0.7 WAR as a pitcher
Yea it was one column over, he was on pace though given the low number of ABs. > @1948_Swell_Robinson said:
The difference though is Othani is doing it at the same time. He played OF early in his career in Japan and is good at it, its just to much stress to do it especially for a guy thats had an elbow surgery and throws right and bats left. His pitching arm is the exposed arm because of that. Fortunately knock on wood he doesnt get hit too much since teams know what will happen if they drill him.
1918/1919 Ruth is really the only one to do it playing the field while doing both at the same time.
Missouri 14 OSU 3
Speaking of college there have been some other fun ones. There was Brandon McKay from Louisville who just cant stay healthy for the Rays. He was a better pitcher than hitter and saw a little action in the MLB so far as the Rays were willing to promote him faster as a pitcher. Jac Cagliano at Florida right now just lead the NCAA in homeruns and was an absolute monster at the plate while also throwing 100 mph as their 3rd starter. He has another year before the draft and some command issues that hurt him on the mound but the stuff is there both ways. Cags has a real shot of being able to at least also be a reliever and hit if a team will let him.
The most interesting that never was though is probably Tim Hudson. In 1997 at Auburn he has a 2.97 era with 165Ks in 118.1 innings pitched going 15-2. At the plate he hit .396/.430/.670 with 18 Hrs and 95 Rbis. The slug is a little inflated given the bats at the time but that just makes his pitching that much more impressive. Oakland made him pick between the two and he chose pitching, got very few ABs in the minors and by the time he got to ATL he looked like a guy that hadnt been working on his hitting for years. Even ATL really only wanted pitchers working on bunting. Would have been interesting to see if he could have done both
Cronenworth on San Diego was also a two way player in college as a reliever as well but Tampa just wanted him as a hitter when they drafted him
Missouri 14 OSU 3
He doesn't really count like Ankiel and Ohtani, but Wes Ferrell, a great pitcher from the 30s, was used as a PH over 100 times, and was used as an OF a little one season, while going 22-12 and leading the league in complete games as a pitcher. He wasn't always this good, but in 1931 if you multiply all his stats by 5 bringing him to full-time status (640 PA), he had a triple crown line of 45/150/.319 along with 30 doubles and 120 runs scored.
Yup, I think it goes without saying at this point that Ohtani is ridiculously good without peer.
It is good to revisit some other forgotten players with unique skills/accomplishments in light of Ohtani's.
As you said, the only real "peer" Ohtani has is the Babe, which is some mighty fine company. Had the DH existed in Ruth's day, the Yankees might have used him more like the Angels are using Ohtani and there's just no way to know what Ruth's numbers (hitting and pitching) would have looked like. Ohtani is still years away from staking a claim, but it's certainly possible that he could retire as the GOAT. As far too many people did with Joe Morgan and Mike Trout, I hope people aren't missing that they are watching a player of extraordinary talent.
Among all the other accomplishments, Ohtani has the chance to be the first player since 1978 to lead the league in homers and triples.
It's interesting> @dallasactuary said:
Ferrell's HOF candidacy is hurt by two things: 1, that he hung around too long, and 2 that he gets little credit for his hitting. I think he gets in if he stops his career after the 1936 season. It's impossible to overstate the value of a pitcher with a 100 OPS+. I mean his OPS+ was higher than that of Reese, Lloyd Waner, Tinker, Fox, Rizzuto, Aparicio, even his brother Rick (who helps to make my case that the new enshrinees don't lower the standard.
It's interesting to note that of the six "real pitchers" with 25 career home runs, four are in the HoF. Defining "real pitcher" as a player whose primary defensive position was pitcher, pitched in at least 100 games, and had at least 500 PA. (Ohtani has, as I type, only 80 pitching appearances. No doubt he'll join this list soon, and it seems likely that he'll make it 5/7.) Pitchers are Ferrell, Lemon, Ruffing, Spahn, Drysdale, and Earl Wilson.
I had somehow never realized that Jim Rice led the league in triples.
When I was looking up players who had led in both, I was STUNNED that Jim Rice had done it.
Mickey Mantle is the only other player to accomplish it.