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A TPG error leads to a listing error and an eBay auction to report

BarberianBarberian Posts: 3,039 ✭✭✭✭✭

APMEX is selling an NGC VF30 1855 normal date on EBay as a BIN for $481. NGC didn't realize the coin is an 1855/54 and not an 1855. It happens sometimes with 55/54's and TPGs; this is the 3rd one I've seen. Now the price APMEX is asking for the coin is much more in line with the 55/54 than an 1855 normal date, so I assume APMEX spotted the error and set an asking price appropriate for a 55/54, but they listed the coin as an 1855.

Here's the problem -- What if a buyer spots the overdate, purchases the coin, and then APMEX sends them an 1855 normal date instead of the coin in the photo? Afterall, they often use stock photos. Because the auction is entitled "1855 Liberty Seated Half Dollar VF-30 NGC (Arrows)", the buyer expecting a 55/54 has no valid case against APMEX if they send an 1855 from their holdings rather than the coin shown. They wind up paying $481 for a $180 coin with no ability to return the coin for a refund (APMEX won't accept returns) unless a numismatist at eBay or APMEX can recognize the overdate from the seller's photos.

I've contacted APMEX twice, but their customer service people told me that their coin guys won't be able to address the problem for several days. I'm trying to stop the auction by sending reports to eBay. I would appreciate assistance in reporting this misleading auction to eBay.

https://ebay.com/itm/144764481893?hash=item21b4a2b165:g:bOIAAOSwZ99jRz5H&amdata=enc%3AAQAHAAAAwEfRr5KzEWOcA%2FpOoUDZN0tR99f5hTlnBNuQb%2B6JgfiY028ASGzg2SL6fDR2xGbbY7LnwLPlbp6nILzWM%2BDY9exJG6u755qtLBguPjHSjBJ3ttHJbl6UAPJdMxyKvauRl%2BWhaRSS93fofEDxRhqP%2FJAipc7lyWBUrIvHIGGseFc2Psgr0VusT0%2FJcsgxrJ7jzie7WnzlFN52McIEKs5hYXaaUSqY9CPySvWUin%2FFkEdqLCFhQzRgGPPYtMnLSMUpsA%3D%3D%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR_SzjI-CYQ

3 rim nicks away from Good

Comments

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    BarberianBarberian Posts: 3,039 ✭✭✭✭✭

    It's not a fake coin, so I guess I'll have to do this myself.

    3 rim nicks away from Good
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    savoyspecialsavoyspecial Posts: 7,268 ✭✭✭✭

    Just remember, you can't cherrypick a seller that uses stock photos

    www.brunkauctions.com

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    Glen2022Glen2022 Posts: 843 ✭✭✭✭

    wouldn't the certification number on the pictured coin help the purchaser?

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    LanceNewmanOCCLanceNewmanOCC Posts: 19,999 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Barberian said:
    APMEX is selling an NGC VF30 1855 normal date on EBay as a BIN for $481. NGC didn't realize the coin is an 1855/54 and not an 1855. It happens sometimes with 55/54's and TPGs; this is the 3rd one I've seen. Now the price APMEX is asking for the coin is much more in line with the 55/54 than an 1855 normal date, so I assume APMEX spotted the error and set an asking price appropriate for a 55/54, but they listed the coin as an 1855.

    Here's the problem -- What if a buyer spots the overdate, purchases the coin, and then APMEX sends them an 1855 normal date instead of the coin in the photo? Afterall, they often use stock photos. Because the auction is entitled "1855 Liberty Seated Half Dollar VF-30 NGC (Arrows)", the buyer expecting a 55/54 has no valid case against APMEX if they send an 1855 from their holdings rather than the coin shown. They wind up paying $481 for a $180 coin with no ability to return the coin for a refund (APMEX won't accept returns) unless a numismatist at eBay or APMEX can recognize the overdate from the seller's photos.

    i thought they stated stock image or is that just for ebay?

    if they state "stock image" or some sort of quantity available which is a tip-off, i say it is caveat emptor but if NOTHING says any of that, one would PRESUME they are getting the coin imaged whether a variety or not and if nothing is mentioned about quantity or stock imege and i didn't like the coin or was different that pictured and wasn't happy with it, i'd probably return with a note about indicating where stock images are used please. (i dont recall ever really buying from multi-quantity let alone returning though)

    i did return an item from a big seller once because the images were SOOOO white-washed/overexposed i THOUGHT i was potentially buying a ngc 2.1 or 2.0 holder, which tells you the images were quite poor but it was an inexpensive coin on its own and obviously the holder was what i was after and i wouldn't probably have gambled if i was on the fence and i could have just kept the coin as it was cheap but i wanted to make a note about the image quality with my message and the return of the coin. decent images, even in bulk are NOT that difficult to pull off, especially for sellers with multi-million dollar inventory. or so i tell myself. (i really didn't go back to their site after that as the images (at the time) were not acceptable to me as not only were the holders washed-out, the coins were not even close to accurately imaged. imo

    i did have a buyer or two over the years completely miss the fact there was more than one available indicating by quantity the odds of getting the pictured coin is virtually nil BUT i have since gone to editing my images to say STOCK IMAGE, JUST to prevent the potential frustration for everyone.

    <--- look what's behind the mask! - cool link 1/NO ~ 2/NNP ~ 3/NNC ~ 4/CF ~ 5/PG ~ 6/Cert ~ 7/NGC 7a/NGC pop~ 8/NGCF ~ 9/HA archives ~ 10/PM ~ 11/NM ~ 12/ANACS cert ~ 13/ANACS pop - report fakes 1/ACEF ~ report fakes/thefts 1/NCIS - Numi-Classes SS ~ Bass ~ Transcribed Docs NNP - clashed coins - error training - V V mm styles -

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    LanceNewmanOCCLanceNewmanOCC Posts: 19,999 ✭✭✭✭✭

    <--- look what's behind the mask! - cool link 1/NO ~ 2/NNP ~ 3/NNC ~ 4/CF ~ 5/PG ~ 6/Cert ~ 7/NGC 7a/NGC pop~ 8/NGCF ~ 9/HA archives ~ 10/PM ~ 11/NM ~ 12/ANACS cert ~ 13/ANACS pop - report fakes 1/ACEF ~ report fakes/thefts 1/NCIS - Numi-Classes SS ~ Bass ~ Transcribed Docs NNP - clashed coins - error training - V V mm styles -

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    TomBTomB Posts: 20,730 ✭✭✭✭✭

    In the listing, APMEX states that the images may or may not be stock photos, which I suspect they use to dissuade folks from claiming SNAD on their items. I don't like their policy of using stock photos as many times I have noticed they either use desirable slab generations or a gold CAC sticker on a slab when they list an item.

    Thomas Bush Numismatics & Numismatic Photography

    In honor of the memory of Cpl. Michael E. Thompson

    image
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    BarberianBarberian Posts: 3,039 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @savoyspecial said:
    Just remember, you can't cherry-pick a seller that uses stock photos

    I'm not looking to cherry-pick the auction. Not at that price level for a VF30 55/54 ($481). I'm worried that someone might try to do that and end up with a 55 worth $175 when they expect the coin shown in the photo. Then they have no recourse for a return because the coin and auction are mislabeled.

    3 rim nicks away from Good
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    LanceNewmanOCCLanceNewmanOCC Posts: 19,999 ✭✭✭✭✭

    @Barberian said:

    @savoyspecial said:
    Just remember, you can't cherry-pick a seller that uses stock photos

    I'm not looking to cherry-pick the auction. Not at that price level for a VF30 55/54 ($481). I'm worried that someone might try to do that and end up with a 55 worth $175 when they expect the coin shown in the photo. Then they have no recourse for a return because the coin and auction are mislabeled.

    for the sake of argument, are you 100% it is the 5/4? i know in later states, dirty coins, worn etc it can be a little more difficult to identify and after refreshing the image in my mind with a nice earlier state example, i'm not 100% sure that line in the 2nd 5 is the bar of the 4 and i don't see the really strong re-punching that comes with the 8, at least that matches the CF example.

    <--- look what's behind the mask! - cool link 1/NO ~ 2/NNP ~ 3/NNC ~ 4/CF ~ 5/PG ~ 6/Cert ~ 7/NGC 7a/NGC pop~ 8/NGCF ~ 9/HA archives ~ 10/PM ~ 11/NM ~ 12/ANACS cert ~ 13/ANACS pop - report fakes 1/ACEF ~ report fakes/thefts 1/NCIS - Numi-Classes SS ~ Bass ~ Transcribed Docs NNP - clashed coins - error training - V V mm styles -

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    BarberianBarberian Posts: 3,039 ✭✭✭✭✭
    edited October 26, 2022 8:40PM

    @LanceNewmanOCC said:

    for the sake of argument, are you 100% it is the 5/4? i know in later states, dirty coins, worn etc it can be a little more difficult to identify and after refreshing the image in my mind with a nice earlier state example, i'm not 100% sure that line in the 2nd 5 is the bar of the 4 and i don't see the really strong re-punching that comes with the 8, at least that matches the CF example.

    I'm 100% sure. Those characteristics are visible here, even the base of the underlying 4, but they're often polished off, covered with dirt, or blurred out in sellers' photos. The easiest and most dependable diagnostic feature to rely on, even with blurry photos, is neither the 8 nor the 2nd 5. It's the . . . Oh NOOOooooo!! AAAAAAAargh! (CRASH)

    [crickets chirping]

    I trust you can figure it out easily enough now.

    3 rim nicks away from Good

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