Serena Williams "Unequivocally the greatest athlete of all time"

craig44

Naomi Osaka uttered this quote about Serena earlier this month. Now, it should go without debate that Serena Williams is certainly not unequivocally the greatest athlete of all time. for this exercise I am looking at the greatest "freak" athletes of all time. physical skills.

who do you think is?

I would use a few attributes to judge how great an athlete is: Strength, speed, agility, endurance, size, jumping/leaping ability, IQ in their sport. there probably are more that I havent considered yet.

If we are looking at the Unequivocally greatest athlete, I think we can dismiss all female athletes, as they would be unable to successfully compete with their Male counterparts.

I would think the list would be football and basketball heavy. I would also think there are some Hockey and Soccer players that could be added to the list, but my personal knowledge of those sports is weak at best.

I would start my list with these guys:
larry Allen
Wilt Chamberlain
Jim Brown
LeBron James
Lawrence Taylor
Bo Jackson
Vernon Davis
David Robinson
Tyreek Hill

who would you add? who would you take away? who was the greatest athlete?

JoeBanzai

First I would like to say that it is SO TIRING to see comments like this made. Naomi Osaka should never be quoted ever again. Secondly, I completely agree that it has to be a male athlete, unless someone wants to Nominate Bruce Jenner, but he did identify publicly as a man when he was winning gold medals.

Jim Thorpe would be one nomination. He won the pentathlon and decathlon at the Stockholm 1912 Olympic Games.

This would seem to be being the best in the world at several completely different activities.

A more modern thought would be Ashton Eaton who won gold in the decathlon at the 2012 London Olympics and the 2016 Rio Olympics. He also holds the current world record in decathlon with a score of 9,045 points.

As far as more well known professional athletes, I would say that Bo Jackson would be the best choice.

Most of the guys on your list are/were fabulous players at one sport. Hard to say who's the better athlete. I do like two others you bring up, Chamberlain and Brown.

Hockey is probably the hardest sport to do everything well, but is more of a specialized activity. Eric Lindros was a pretty good baseball player as well. He was probably a terrific athlete too.

erikthredd

Giannis
Shaq
MJ
Bill Russell
Vince Carter
Aaron Donald
Deion Sanders

craig44

@JoeBanzai said:
First I would like to say that it is SO TIRING to see comments like this made. Naomi Osaka should never be quoted ever again. Secondly, I completely agree that it has to be a male athlete, unless someone wants to Nominate Bruce Jenner, but he did identify publicly as a man when he was winning gold medals.

Jim Thorpe would be one nomination. He won the pentathlon and decathlon at the Stockholm 1912 Olympic Games.

This would seem to be being the best in the world at several completely different activities.

A more modern thought would be Ashton Eaton who won gold in the decathlon at the 2012 London Olympics and the 2016 Rio Olympics. He also holds the current world record in decathlon with a score of 9,045 points.

As far as more well known professional athletes, I would say that Bo Jackson would be the best choice.

Most of the guys on your list are/were fabulous players at one sport. Hard to say who's the better athlete. I do like two others you bring up, Chamberlain and Brown.

Hockey is probably the hardest sport to do everything well, but is more of a specialized activity. Eric Lindros was a pretty good baseball player as well. He was probably a terrific athlete too.

I thought about adding some Olympic athletes, but it seemed to specialized to me. I checked out ashton eaton. no doubt a great athlete, but at 180 pounds, he seems on the light side. guys in that size range would be at a significant strength disadvantage to athletes like bo jackson, vernon davis or wilt chamberlain.

that is why I didnt choose guys like Deion Sanders, darrel Green, Carl Lewis or Jordan. while able to run and leap, they are not on the same planet strength wise as someone like jim brown or even larry allen who could run a 4.8 40 I believe and dunk a basketball.

coinkat

Three words... Not going there

Maywood

Jim Thorpe.

He'll fall victim to the "era argument" but he distinguished himself in several athletic disciplines: track and field, football basketball and baseball. He was superbly gifted.

coolstanley

Pete Sampras

JoeBanzai

@craig44 said:

I thought about adding some Olympic athletes, but it seemed to specialized to me. I checked out ashton eaton. no doubt a great athlete, but at 180 pounds, he seems on the light side. guys in that size range would be at a significant strength disadvantage to athletes like bo jackson, vernon davis or wilt chamberlain.

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That statement confuses me. While I agree with some of your choices, you also pick some great players who are big and good at one sport, and then say a decathlon champion is specialized?

Here's one definition of the decathlon;

"An all-round athletics test, the 10-event contest covers the whole range of athletics disciplines spread over two days. The first day consists of (in order): 100m, long jump, shot put, high jump and 400m. The second day's events are 110m hurdles, discus, pole vault, javelin and 1500m."

To me an athlete doesn't have to be a giant, but does have to be proficient at several different sports.
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that is why I didnt choose guys like Deion Sanders, darrel Green, Carl Lewis or Jordan. while able to run and leap, they are not on the same planet strength wise as someone like jim brown or even larry allen who could run a 4.8 40 I believe and dunk a basketball.
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I was going to add Jordan to my list. Sanders and Green could run fast, Deion refused to tackle and was an OK baseball player. Over rated hot dog.

spacehayduke

Yup as always, main stream sports here. Sure those are great athletes mentioned above, but not even close to the best cyclists. More danger - one mistake on a descent and you are dead, crash injuries that send you to the hospital every year, as much skill (try riding in a pack at 35 mph, around a 90 degree corner in the road, shoulder to shoulder while being jostled around and keeping your bike upright), and fitness that requires 24/7 diligence to keep at the top level. Nothing comes close (well, except hockey).

So I say Greg Lemond might be the best. Others would be Hinault and Merckx, possibly Armstrong. Lemond had the highest VO2 Max of any person ever measured. I saw this guy crash twice on a steep hill in Seattle during the '77 national championships, then run down everyone for the win. Won 2 Tour de Frances AFTER getting shot point blank with a shotgun and losing 60% of his blood.

Dude was superhuman.

craig44

@JoeBanzai said:

@craig44 said:

I thought about adding some Olympic athletes, but it seemed to specialized to me. I checked out ashton eaton. no doubt a great athlete, but at 180 pounds, he seems on the light side. guys in that size range would be at a significant strength disadvantage to athletes like bo jackson, vernon davis or wilt chamberlain.

>
>
That statement confuses me. While I agree with some of your choices, you also pick some great players who are big and good at one sport, and then say a decathlon champion is specialized?

Here's one definition of the decathlon;

"An all-round athletics test, the 10-event contest covers the whole range of athletics disciplines spread over two days. The first day consists of (in order): 100m, long jump, shot put, high jump and 400m. The second day's events are 110m hurdles, discus, pole vault, javelin and 1500m."

To me an athlete doesn't have to be a giant, but does have to be proficient at several different sports.
>
>
that is why I didnt choose guys like Deion Sanders, darrel Green, Carl Lewis or Jordan. while able to run and leap, they are not on the same planet strength wise as someone like jim brown or even larry allen who could run a 4.8 40 I believe and dunk a basketball.
>
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I was going to add Jordan to my list. Sanders and Green could run fast, Deion refused to tackle and was an OK baseball player. Over rated hot dog.

It was a confusing statement. when I said olympic athletes were too specialized, I was talking about sprinters, high jumpers, weight lifters etc. they do one thing, and do it very very well, not decatheletes. when I was speaking about eaton, I feel he is too small to be able to keep up with the strength of a wilt chamberlain, bo jackson or larry Allen.

In my opinion, a 240 pound linebacker is a better athlete than a decathlete as he would be fast, but also much more powerful than the 60 pound lighter decathlete

thisistheshow

@spacehayduke said:
Yup as always, main stream sports here. Sure those are great athletes mentioned above, but not even close to the best cyclists. More danger - one mistake on a descent and you are dead, crash injuries that send you to the hospital every year, as much skill (try riding in a pack at 35 mph, around a 90 degree corner in the road, shoulder to shoulder while being jostled around and keeping your bike upright), and fitness that requires 24/7 diligence to keep at the top level. Nothing comes close (well, except hockey).

So I say Greg Lemond might be the best. Others would be Hinault and Merckx, possibly Armstrong. Lemond had the highest VO2 Max of any person ever measured. I saw this guy crash twice on a steep hill in Seattle during the '77 national championships, then run down everyone for the win. Won 2 Tour de Frances AFTER getting shot point blank with a shotgun and losing 60% of his blood.

Dude was superhuman.

...
I just read about the shotgun incident. Crazy, shot by a relative while turkey hunting.

daltex

@JoeBanzai said:

Hockey is probably the hardest sport to do everything well, but is more of a specialized activity. Eric Lindros was a pretty good baseball player as well. He was probably a terrific athlete too.

Well, as far as that goes, one of my favorite (bad) trivia questions (bad because there is no embedded hint) is Which Hall of Famer did the L.A. Kings draft the round before they drafted Luc Robitaille? Answer, Tom Glavine.

Bob Gibson played for the Harlem Globetrotters.

Dave Winfield was drafted by the Padres (as a pitcher!), Vikings, Atlanta Hawks, and Utah Stars (ABA).

Jackie Robinson, absent the whole history thing, was sort of a latter day Jim Thorpe. (An aside, it bothers me very much that the history thing gets in the way of people understanding how great an athlete and specifically a baseball player he was. I get the idea most people think he was Willie O'Ree or Bud Fowler.)

The above notwithstanding, in the past fifteen or twenty years Muhammed Ali was named best athlete of all time.

perkdog

Stupid comment by a completely biased individual with a clouded and moronic agenda

Serena was phenomenal, but no just no

JoeBanzai

@craig44 said:

@JoeBanzai said:

@craig44 said:

I thought about adding some Olympic athletes, but it seemed to specialized to me. I checked out ashton eaton. no doubt a great athlete, but at 180 pounds, he seems on the light side. guys in that size range would be at a significant strength disadvantage to athletes like bo jackson, vernon davis or wilt chamberlain.

>
>
That statement confuses me. While I agree with some of your choices, you also pick some great players who are big and good at one sport, and then say a decathlon champion is specialized?

Here's one definition of the decathlon;

"An all-round athletics test, the 10-event contest covers the whole range of athletics disciplines spread over two days. The first day consists of (in order): 100m, long jump, shot put, high jump and 400m. The second day's events are 110m hurdles, discus, pole vault, javelin and 1500m."

To me an athlete doesn't have to be a giant, but does have to be proficient at several different sports.
>
>
that is why I didnt choose guys like Deion Sanders, darrel Green, Carl Lewis or Jordan. while able to run and leap, they are not on the same planet strength wise as someone like jim brown or even larry allen who could run a 4.8 40 I believe and dunk a basketball.
>
>
I was going to add Jordan to my list. Sanders and Green could run fast, Deion refused to tackle and was an OK baseball player. Over rated hot dog.

It was a confusing statement. when I said olympic athletes were too specialized, I was talking about sprinters, high jumpers, weight lifters etc. they do one thing, and do it very very well, not decatheletes. when I was speaking about eaton, I feel he is too small to be able to keep up with the strength of a wilt chamberlain, bo jackson or larry Allen.

In my opinion, a 240 pound linebacker is a better athlete than a decathlete as he would be fast, but also much more powerful than the 60 pound lighter decathlete

Thanks for clearing that up. Makes more sense.

JoeBanzai

@daltex said:

@JoeBanzai said:

Hockey is probably the hardest sport to do everything well, but is more of a specialized activity. Eric Lindros was a pretty good baseball player as well. He was probably a terrific athlete too.

Well, as far as that goes, one of my favorite (bad) trivia questions (bad because there is no embedded hint) is Which Hall of Famer did the L.A. Kings draft the round before they drafted Luc Robitaille? Answer, Tom Glavine.

>
Good point. Justin Morneau was also a hockey player and the concussions he suffered while playing hockey might have shortened his baseball career.
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Bob Gibson played for the Harlem Globetrotters.

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Another one I forgot.
>

Dave Winfield was drafted by the Padres (as a pitcher!), Vikings, Atlanta Hawks, and Utah Stars (ABA).

>
Winfield played basketball and baseball here at the University of Minnesota. The Vikings drafting him as a potential Tight End was kind of a joke, but they did draft him.
>
>

Jackie Robinson, absent the whole history thing, was sort of a latter day Jim Thorpe. (An aside, it bothers me very much that the history thing gets in the way of people understanding how great an athlete and specifically a baseball player he was. I get the idea most people think he was Willie O'Ree or Bud Fowler.)

>
Wasn't he a great College FB player? USC? UCLA?
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>

The above notwithstanding, in the past fifteen or twenty years Muhammed Ali was named best athlete of all time.

>
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My favorite boxer, but I would not say he was the best athlete of all time.

spacehayduke

Honestly, I think it is hard to compare across the different sports which is why I brought in cycling. I think each sport has their GOATs. Serena could be the GOAT for her sport, Gretzky could be for his, Lemond for his, MJ for his, etc.............

craig44

I would say it is not just hard to compare across different sports, but near impossible. just a fun thought experiment.

compare greg lemond with larry allen. lemond clearly has the advantage in endurance and distance speed. Allen would clearly be much stronger and possibly quicker over short distances. which is considered more "athletic?"

Darin

I'll just say Spartacus since ancient Rome basically gets no representation here.
When you say greatest athlete of all time aren't you really saying greatest athlete since
the invention of the radio?
Krog holds the record for most wooly mammoths killed by a Neanderthal at 32.
He would be high on my list. I think it hurts him because he really wasn't well
thought of even in his own time....

thisistheshow

@Darin said:
I'll just say Spartacus since ancient Rome basically gets no representation here.

....
😂🤣😂🤣😂🤣

daltex

@JoeBanzai said:

@daltex said:

Jackie Robinson, absent the whole history thing, was sort of a latter day Jim Thorpe. (An aside, it bothers me very much that the history thing gets in the way of people understanding how great an athlete and specifically a baseball player he was. I get the idea most people think he was Willie O'Ree or Bud Fowler.)

>
Wasn't he a great College FB player? USC? UCLA?

12.2 YPA rushing and led the NCAA in punt return average in 1939 and '40. He lettered at UCLA in basketball, football track, oh, and baseball. He won the 1940 NCAA long jump championship. Maybe not the best, but surely the most underrated of all time.

JoeBanzai

@daltex said:

@JoeBanzai said:

@daltex said:

Jackie Robinson, absent the whole history thing, was sort of a latter day Jim Thorpe. (An aside, it bothers me very much that the history thing gets in the way of people understanding how great an athlete and specifically a baseball player he was. I get the idea most people think he was Willie O'Ree or Bud Fowler.)

>
Wasn't he a great College FB player? USC? UCLA?

12.2 YPA rushing and led the NCAA in punt return average in 1939 and '40. He lettered at UCLA in basketball, football track, oh, and baseball. He won the 1940 NCAA long jump championship. Maybe not the best, but surely the most underrated of all time.

Yes, I would list him as an all time great.

Was just on another post and saw that Gordy Howe played his final year in the NHL at 50 and scored a point every other game on average that year. Unbelievable!

galaxy27

that was an embarrassing statement by Naomi Osaka, and this thread is equally as embarrassing because not a single esteemed poster has mentioned Babe Didrikson Zaharias. Serena Williams could not hold a stick to her, and you could easily make the argument that no other male could either based on the sheer breadth of her athleticism. let's see, where to start....

.....how about track and field? does gold in the 80-meter hurdles and the javelin, and the silver in the high jump at the 1932 Olympics do anything for you?

.....or what about basketball? is being selected All-American for 3 consecutive years any good?

.....or what about baseball? in '34 she pitched an inning for the Philadelphia A's against the Brooklyn Dodgers in a spring training game. she gave up one walk and no hits.

the list goes on and on, but let's now move on to golf. she was Tiger Woods before Tiger Woods was Tiger Woods. when she first started playing she was able to drive the ball 260 yards. 260. in the early 30s. with no doubt a wooden club. as a female. i can't even begin to tell you how impressive that is. stick her in the year 2022 with a tech-driven driver and without question she'd be able to send it 300+ off the box.

she won 3 major championships as an amateur, she won 10 majors as a professional, she won 13 tournaments in a row at one point, and perhaps one of the greatest achievements by any athlete ever -- in 1954 she won the U.S. Open by 12 shots while playing with a freaking colostomy bag because she had been diagnosed with colon cancer the year before.

and before someone else can come along and insinuate how easy golf is by labeling it a game, i invite you to traipse over to my thread creation that consists of 14-year NBA pro Jalen Rose simply trying to make contact with a stationary ball. and come up embarrassingly short.

Naomi Osaka, please be quiet