How to trade online safely?
craig44
Posts: 11,263 ✭✭✭✭✭
I am thinking about trading some fairly high value cards (> 10k) at some point and was trying to think of the safest way to do such. if a prospective trading partner is not within driving distance, is there any alternative to flying to meet in person?
possibly like an intermediary that both parties could ship cards to that would simply verify that everything is as it should be and then ship the cards out to each person?
I am a little wary of receiving an empty box.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
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When you say "Trading", do you mean actual SWAP of assets? I give you this card(s), and you give me that card(s)?
Is it an even swap so that both sides of the transaction are the same agreed amount? Or would one side also receive cash in order to make up the difference?
yes, an actual swap of assets.
it is the best way i can think of to acquire big cards i want without having to sell cards i currently own, pay taxes and then buy the cards i wanted to begin with.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
MULLINS5,1966CUDA,nam812,nightcrawler,OAKESY25,PowderedH2O,relaxed,RonBurgundy,samsgirl214,shagrotn77,swartz1,slantycouch,Statman,Wabittwax
I will add that I would only trade that kind of value on premises at a reputable card show, never online.
MULLINS5,1966CUDA,nam812,nightcrawler,OAKESY25,PowderedH2O,relaxed,RonBurgundy,samsgirl214,shagrotn77,swartz1,slantycouch,Statman,Wabittwax
I wonder if it is possible to send cards into one of the vaults that seem to be popping up all over and have them facilitate a trade for a month's membership to a vault or for a straight-up fee?
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
I'm wondering this also. I would gladly send stuff into an eBay VAULT and then trade cards with other members that have cards in the eBay Vault. Of course, eBay might charge a fee to make the book entry, but it seems safer then just sending my half of the deal in the mail...
My thoughts exactly
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
Maybe a vault company could assist you with this. Kind of like escrow. That sounds like a reasonable service these companies could provide.
Craig maybe someone on the board trusted by both parties?
HOF SIGNED FOOTBALL RCS
Send to BBCE and pay him a middle-man fee.
I like that idea if Steve would agree to it.
Shane
This really has to be done in person at a show such as the National or one of the larger regional shows. I need to see it in person. Scans don't always capture flaws.
is that something steve has done in the past? i would gladly pay a fee for such a service.
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
just on the “without having to pay taxes” thing. Barter transactions (trades) are absolutely taxable. Not that there is a lot of risk of being detected by the IRS, just pointing out a trade is not exempt from tax if you otherwise thought it was.
If you are trading in kind with same value items, what tax would there be to pay? for instance, a 15k card for a 15k card.
no net profit, no net loss
George Brett, Roger Clemens and Tommy Brady.
There is profit if the value of the barter is more than the cost basis of what you gave up. For instance, if you paid 10k, it’s now worth 15k and you trade for something else worth 15k, you owe tax on 5k.
It's a 1031 Exchange!!
I found one of the FAQs for the Goldin Vault mentions something for "trading assets." I couldn't find how much they charge, and how it works such as both sides fill out a form to do the "Title Transfer"? Perhaps an email to their Vault Service for more details...
We are currently facilitating peer-to-peer title transfers and will offer additional marketplace functionality on our site later this year.
It's getting to the point the industry is going to need a "Transfer Agent" where one can register the card/cert to an owner (including registrations as trusts, jt. ten. WROS, TOD, etc.), place stop-transfers based on the card's cert #'s. Could even offer CHUBB/Lloyds type insurance to replace value if lost/stolen and the cert would have a flag in the TA system to prevent the transfer if someday after the owner received a payout for their insurance claim that the underlying card comes in for transfer of ownership, so the card instead goes to the insurance co. and the transfer for the "trade" that raised the flag gets "busted" and the purchaser gets their money back and transferor gets the shaft. A vault just acts like "Book Entry" for your cards.. just like stocks. 1099's would be issued by the TA for cap. gains/losses, etc. etc. Wash sale rules would come into play. Just now how do we now get the cards to pay dividends, lol. Could you imagine if they offer derivatives on cards? A 5-year $30M call right for a 52 Mantle PSA 10? What would that option cost? $5m? Plug the variables into a Black Scholes calculator to find out. It could all happen. But at the same time, would it still be fun?
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Haha! The question would be whether you want Calls or Puts given the market today...
For example, trading 100 shares of Amazon for 300 of Tesla, or whatever.
I'm no CPA, but if your cost basis for the $15K card was $5K I wouldn't be surprised if the government considered that exchange to be a $10K profit and a net new purchase of a $15K item you're now holding onto. The results are exactly the same as you selling your card to the guy for $15K and him selling his card to you for $15K; just because no money actually changed hands doesn't mean that the govt wouldn't treat it like it did.
ETA - oops, just saw GreenSneakers said almost the exact same thing.
Jim