A Major League Baseball Chain. Can you make one with fewer links?
frankhardy
Posts: 8,097 ✭✭✭✭✭
On the way home from work this afternoon I was thinking about something. What is the fewest links in an unbroken baseball chain from inception to now. Baseball Reference has the first MLB season in 1871. Each player has to overlap. If you can't beat the list with fewer than 8 players, see if you can get 8 players that has more total WAR.
Here is my effort. See if you can match it or beat it.
Cap Anson (1871 - 1897) (WAR 94.3)
Cy Young (1890 - 1911) (WAR 163.6)
Ty Cobb (1905 - 1928) (WAR 151.5)
Jimmie Foxx (1925 - 1945) (WAR 93.1)
Stan Musial (1941 - 1963) (WAR 128.7)
Pete Rose (1963 - 1986) (WAR 79.6)
Barry Bonds (1986 - 2007) (WAR 162.7)
Albert Pujols (2001 - present) (WAR 99.6)
That makes 8 players to span the entire history of MLB.
Total WAR for all 8 players is 973.1.
Shane
Comments
Neat idea.
Probably a way to do it with Nolan Ryan too. Or Julio Franco. Minnie Minoso and Satchell Paige not eligible. Maybe Joe Nuxhall?
Kiss me twice.....let's party.
Thanks for getting me to think a bit tonight. Is it cheating if I use technology to help me? I didn't use Minnie Minoso, but would it count to use him with 1980 as his last year? I can get it to seven names, but I doubt that they will match those WAR numbers.
Also maybe a link with Williams and Yaz. That goes from 1939 to 1983 I think? Some good WAR there.
Kiss me twice.....let's party.
Heres 7, at less than half the WAR.
Cap Anson 1871-97 (94.4)
Bobby Wallace 1894-1918 (70.2)
Jimmy Dykes 1918-1939 (34.7)
Early Wynn 1939-63 (51.6)
Tommy John 1963-89 (62.1)
Omar Vizquel 1989-2012 (45.6)
Mike Trout 2011-2021 (76.1)
Total 434.7
ETA: As was the case with Musial, Wynn had a break due to military service that we aren't counting.
This may be cheating, but you can replace both Foxx and Musial with Satchel Paige. Lots fewer WAR, but only seven players.
Here's 7. Pretty tough to do with 7 players.
Cap Anson- 1871-1897 (WAR 94.3)
Bobby Wallace- 1894-1918 (WAR 76.2)
Jimmy Dykes 1918-1939 (WAR 34.7)
Early Wynn- 1939-1963 (WAR 61.1)
Pete Rose- 1963-1986 (WAR 79.6)
Rickey Henderson- 1979-2003 (WAR 111.2)
Albert Pujols- 2001-2021 (WAR 99.6)
Total WAR- 556.70
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I started the same thread on a couple of more boards with some interesting responses, as we have here.
It looks like Keith Olbermann and others have posed similar questions. I had no idea. I was just thinking about it on my way home from work while listening to the audio book Ty Cobb: A Terrible Beauty (which I highly recommend!).
Anyway, while looking at other responses someone posed an interesting trivia question....
Name a pitcher that pitched to a batter that started his career in 1939 and also pitched to a batter that ended his career in 2007?
The answer....
Jim Kaat pitched to Ted Williams and also to Julio Franco.
That is amazing to me.
Shane
It would be interesting to make the tie breaker lowest WAR rather than the highest.
And that's why baseball is just so unlike many other sports. Just...amazing.
Golf, because it is possible to play the sport at a high level for so long, can do the same kind of thing with even fewer players. You have situations where Bobby Jones played in tournaments with Ben Hogan, who played in tournaments with Arnold Palmer and Jack Nicklaus, who played in tournaments with Tiger Woods. I haven't tried this in detail with either sport, but things like Jim Kaat pitching to both Ted Williams and Julio Franco blow my mind.
kevin
Continuous or overlap? War years?
Anson 71-97 94.3
Wagner 97-17 130.8
Ruth 14-35 183.1
DiMaggio 36-51 79.2
Mays 51-73 156.1
Schmidt 72-89 106.9
Bonds 86-07 162.7
Pujols 01-21 99.6
Total 1,012.7
That's insane!
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Here's a different take:
Pop Snyder played for the Washington Blue Legs (National Association) in 1873.
In 1890, he was a teammate of Ed Delahanty with the Cleveland Indians.
In 1899, Delhanty was a teammate of Roy Thomas, with the Phillies.
In 1911, Thomas was a teammate of Grover Alexander, with the Phillies.
In 1922, Alexander was a teammate of Gabby Hartnett, with the Cubs.
In 1940, Hartnett was a teammate of Clyde McCullough, with the Pirates.
In 1952, McCullough was a teammate of Ron Kline, with the Pirates.
In 1969, Kline was a teammate of Carlton Fisk, with the Red Sox.
In 1986, Fisk was a teammate of Bobby Bonilla, with the White Sox.
In 2001, Bonilla was a teammate of Albert Pujols, with the Cardinals.
So, in ten players, you go from the 1873 National Association, to the present day; 148 years of teammates.
Steve
Amazing!
Shane
Another twist to this game:
It only counts as overlap if they play in the same game.
In other words....it only counts if their paths actually crossed. I like it. That would be tough. It would take some research. I basically did my original list from memory while double checking the years to make sure they overlapped.
Shane
And another one:
Willie Keeler played for the original New York Highlanders in 1903. In 1909, he was a teammate of Jack Quinn.
In 1921, Quinn was a teammate of Carl Mays.
In 1923 Mays was a teammate of Lou Gehrig
In 1936, Gehrig was a teammate of Joe DiMaggio.
In 1951, DiMaggio was a teammate of Mickey Mantle.
In 1965, Mantle was a teammate of Bobby Murcer.
In 1983, Murcer was a teammate of Don Mattingly.
In 1995, Mattingly was a teammate of Derek Jeter.
In 2014, Jeter was a teammate of Brett Gardner.
Gardner played for the Yankees in 2021.
So, ten players spanning the entire 119 year history of the New York Yankees.
Steve
And one more:
Johnny Podres pitched for the Dodgers beginning in 1953.
In 1966, Podres was a teammate of Don Sutton.
in 1988, Sutton was a teammate of Ramon Martinez.
In 1998, Martinez was a teammate of Chan-Ho Park.
In 2008, Park was a teammate of Clayton Kershaw.
So, five pitchers cover the entire Dodgers history in Los Angeles, and going back to 1953 in Brooklyn.
Steve
Now the Cardinals franchise. It started in 1882 as the St Louis Brown Stockings in the American Association.
Bob Caruthers came up with them in 1884.
In 1892, Caruthers was a teammate of Heinie Peitz.
In 1913, Peitz was a teammate of Bill Doak.
In 1922, Doak was a teammate of Jim Bottomley.
In 1928, Bottomley was a teammate of Gus Mancuso.
In 1941, Mancuso was a teammate of Stan Musial.
In 1959, Musial was a teammate of Bob Gibson.
In 1974, Gibson was a teammate of Bob Forsch.
In 1982, Forsch was a teammate of Ozzie Smith.
In 1990, Smith was a teammate of Ray Lankford.
In 2004, Lankford, was a teammate of Yadier Molina.
Note:
In 1892, Heinie Peitz was also a teammate of Pud Galvin, who pitched for the St Louis Brown Stockings in 1875, in the National Association.
So, in 11 players, you cover the entire St Louis Cardinals franchise history going back ~140 years.
Steve
A little different, but a link of 8 people that linked the Revolutionary War 1775 to Afghanistan in 2004.
George Washington and Andrew Jackson in the Revolutionary War
Andrew Jackson and John Burns in the War of 1812
John burns and Peter Convor Haines in Civil War
Peter Convor Haines and Sir Adrian Carton de Wiser in WWI
Sir Adrian Carton de wiser and Ted Williams in WWII
Ted Williams and Basil Plumley in Korean War
Basil Plumley and Don Nichols in Vietnam
Don Nichols served in Afghanistan in 2004
Some very interesting stories from those gentlemen above.
Trivia Question for your buddies: Who is the only President to ever have been a prisoner of war?
Answer: Andrew Jackson was the only President to ever be a prisoner of war. He was captured and imprisoned by the British in the Revolutionary War, then later became President.
PS I haven't seen Minnie Minoso in any of the baseball chains. He went from 1946-1980....I'm sure he could cut the chain a little shorter somehow. Minoso to Rickey Henderson to Pujols covers 1946 up to present.
Guys that lose time to military service or injury should be counted. But Minoso has got to be cheating, right? He only played in 5 games over two years after 1964.
Here's the White Sox going back to their first year in 1901:
1901, Billy Sullivan played for them.
In 1914, Sullivan was a teammate of Red Faber.
In 1933, Faber was a teammate of Luke Appling.
In 1950, Appling was a teammate of Nellie Fox.
In 1951, Fox was a teammate of Minnie Minoso.
In 1980, Minoso was a teammate of Harold Baines.
In 2001, Baines was a teammate of Paul Konerko.
In 2014, Konerko was a teammate of Jose Abreu.
Unfortunately, Appling's last year was 1950, and Minoso didn't get to the White Sox until 1951.
So, eight players get you through the entire White Sox history from 1901 - 2021.
Steve
He was going to play in 1990 too but Fay Vincent vetoed it. I wish they would have let him. I could see if stuff like that started getting out of hand where it began happening all the time....but it being just Minnie...he gets a thumbs up for me.