10 Ways to Become a Better Coin Collector
pruebas
Posts: 4,565 ✭✭✭✭✭
Great article. Worth a read.
10
pruebas
Posts: 4,565 ✭✭✭✭✭
Comments
I never agreed with 10, but I think the paper is a great read.
Agreed. #4 and #6 contradict #10. Grade is a major indicator of quality and eye appeal. We talk on the boards like it isn't but that's because many of the collectors here are advanced in their grading and coin knowledge to the point that they live in the spaces that aren't well captured by grading. That and because the grade is often established on the holder the only thing left to discuss is what isn't captured by the grade. However, I don't think you can intelligibly have that discussion unless you know where the boundaries are.
Dealer relationships seem to be a bigger factor when building a collection of true rarities and if you collect on the high end. I feel like that comes into play more when the average value of your pieces is greater than $500 each. That rules out the vast majority of people and collectors. And it's worth noting that not all dealers will, or are even able to, serve you well.
IG: DeCourcyCoinsEbay: neilrobertson
"Numismatic categorizations, if left unconstrained, will increase spontaneously over time." -me
The title of the article is clearly open to a variety of interpretations. As a contrarian, I would take issue with the first point about not spreading yourself too thin. I have gone from a collection focused mainly on two denominations to one that is essentially as eclectic as possible.
My current aim is to include as many different numismatic criteria as possible based on denomination, ruler or ecclesiastic person identified, metal types, attributed designer, mint location, initial marks and sundries etc, trying wherever possible not to duplicate types or designs. Taking the criteria as a whole, this has the potential to create something close to a 'complete' collection as opposed to a narrow interest such as a particular period, ruler, denomination or mint, which are the usual specialised areas.
Spreading my tastes across a period of more than 2000 years allows me to focus on relatively unpopular areas at any time without the constraints imposed by a narrow focus. It allows me to include a few pieces that could only be described as dire, but they are what they are, and there usually isn't an alternative. Will it be a great collection? Probably not in my own eyes, but that will be a matter of opinion for others at some point in the future, and in any case, what does 'great' mean? When I'm pushing up the daisies, there will still be unfilled gaps in the trays, so one gap is as good as the next. Sometimes I overpay, but that is balanced by acquiring cheaply things that get under the radar. At the end of the day, I am collecting for my own enjoyment, not to satisfy others' opinions.
To be a better collector is mostly a willingness to do a lot of research and learn from it. You do need to know how to grade, contrary to the view in #10, but that knowledge is an integral part of learning your chosen series.
I agree with all the points in the article, except to note it seems to be written solely from a US coin collector's viewpoint. Having said that, #10 is very bold from that point of view. US coin collectors seem to worry about nothing else. But what he says is true - if a TPG has graded it, why do you think you can do better? 99% of the time you can't. Even if you think you can.
He does seem to contradict himself when he says 'learn how to choose coins in the top 5-10% for the grade', which would be impossible if you can't grade. But I would say you don't need to be able to do that unless you're buying to speculate rather than collect - to pick up on minute differences in the hope of selling the coin on for a profit.
I don't even think grade is a major indicator of eye appeal. Eye appeal is the best indicator of eye appeal. Cut out the middle man.
You certainly don't need to know about grading if you don't collect milled coins, or even coins older than 200 years or so. A hammered coin's appearance is affected by a multitude of factors, with wear only part of a much bigger picture. No two hammered coins are the same. This means clear differences in eye appeal will be self-evident when they're not simply going by a grade.
I agree 'not spreading yourself too thin' would reduce the richness of collecting if it meant 'stick to a narrow series.' And who cares if you have a 'mess of a collection'? You're not exhibiting it at the British Museum. Nor am I trying to impress Doug with my knowledge, as I'll never meet him. I would still agree with the article, though, if it's suggesting not buying everything you like for financial reasons. If you have a collecting goal, it's better to define it fairly tightly and stick to that, else you'll never achieve it.
I've known quite a few people who have got to say 80% complete and then given up because they couldn't fill any gaps over a period of a year or two, even if there were 100 gaps to fill. I didn't want to be in that position, so chose my eclectic criteria for the simple reason that I had no chance of completing them all, but the diversity ensured that I could usually find something that ticks a box.
I can easily go out looking for a Celtic unit and come home with a sovereign, or look for a scarce/rare Saxon mint and come home with a Civil War halfcrown, or vice-versa. I means I rarely get depressed at the lack of progress, and if I need a quick fix, I get a type example of something that doesn't tick a box, but I don't have an example and is too nice to pass up
Invest in quality books not just the coins. A must-have for cap and rays 8R is Resplandores
I agree with eye appeal being a superior attribute for a coin than technical grade.
The problem is, you can learn the technical aspects of grading via the Sheldon scale. With practice you can learn to recognize counterfeits, tooling, cleaning, damage, etc., if not 100% of the time, then at least most of the time. I don't know that you can learn eye appeal. Either something is appealing to your eye, or it isn't.
Well, yeah. So what do you do- collect coins you like or that other people do?
As a "gotta collect it all" collector for over 40 years, I'd have to also disagree with point 1.
This in turn modifies point 2: if I don't have "a series", then I can't educate myself specifically about it. But I do agree with the principle of "educate yourself about what you collect" (also known as "first the book, then the coin"), and if that means I collect everything, then I need to have a very good spread of knowledge across all of coin collecting, and enough of a reference library (both physical books and online sources) to be able to find out anything I need to know more specifically, relatively quickly.
Point 3 is a no-brainer.
Point 4 is irrelevant to a coin collector, especially to a Taklamakan-style collector like me (coins go into the collection, they never come out).
Points 5 and 6 are no-brainers too.
Point 7 is kind of unhelpful for new collectors, as they have no "instincts" they can reliably trust. To use computer gaming vernacular, they need to "git gud" before they can do that.
I've never been a big fan of point 8. Pricing is arbitrary, and subject to change at short notice; the old rule "a coin is worth whatever one person is prepared to pay for it" still applies. It also contradicts the principle of points 5 and 6: if you like a coin, and you can afford to pay for it, why quibble about "what it's worth", as if it's "worth" is some scientifically measurable, objectively verifiable parameter that's irrevocably attached to a coin? If you like it, buy it, even if that means you're letting people rip you off for it if that's what they're demanding. Once it's yours, a coin's "worth" only really matters if you plan on selling the coins again, and I don't (Taklamakan Desert, remember?).
Point 9 is kind of nullified by my disagreement with Point 1. With the entirety of numismatics to select from, I do not need to "wait" for that one coin to "complete" a "set", as there's always something I would find desirable, on offer, somewhere. Just another benefit of being a generalist.
Of course, I would disagree with point 10, as noted by several others above. Primarily because I see "learning to grade" as being intermeshed with "learning to tell genuine coins from fake coins", "learning to spot cleaned coins" and "recognizing how experienced a coin dealer/seller is at selling coins", all of which are essential skills to hone.
If we're making a list of things that make people "better coin collectors", then I would add a couple more points.
Point 11: Join a coin club. Coin collecting can be a lonely hobby, especially if (as is all too likely) there's no-one else in your circle of friends and family that shares the passion. Meeting up with other collectors not only encourages you by meeting and talking with other like-minded people, it has other benefits: the members will often bring along to meetings coins for "show and tell" that are better than anything you own or have ever seen for sale, maybe even better than you could see in a museum. Plus, in meeting collectors with similar but slightly different passions, you might get exposed to other aspects of numismatics that you'd never really considered before. Internet forums and online groups are great too, but not as good as a real in-person meet-up.
Point 12: Coin collecting is supposed to be fun, so collect to please yourself, not other people. Don't let a coin dealer talk you into buying something you don't actually want - their primary interest is in selling their stock, not necessarily in helping you find what you want. Listen to the advice of other numismatists, by all means, but don't let other people tell you "you're doing it all wrong", because ultimately, there is no "wrong way" to collect. Sure, there are "less profitable" ways to collect, but if profit's a key motive in what you do and why you do it, then it's more "job" than "hobby".
Roman emperor Marcus Aurelius, "Meditations"
Apparently I have been awarded one DPOTD.
For a beginner, learning is the most important thing, and "spreading yourself too thin" is the best way to learn. But yes, at some point it becomes important for most of us to narrow our focus to some extent.
Doggedly collecting coins of the Central American Republic.
Visit the Society of US Pattern Collectors at USPatterns.com.
Some pointers and discipline should be welcome and we can choose to adapt what works for how one collects. While "spreading yourself too thin" is usually not advisable, appreciating quality and having somewhat of a yardstick to measure rarity, condition rarity and how often certain coins or medals surface will help over the long term. The best coins and medals I own were bought when I least expected to find them. That is just how collecting has been for me- I just found the first issue1941 FDR Inaugural medal... that was limited to 1000 struck... and not to be confused with the second striking due to demand. I guess my contribution to the discussion is to develop an appreciation and knowledge so that you can recognize and be prepared to add something special that you may appreciate at a later in your collecting endeavors. Recognize opportunity and how often that opportunity will present itself.
Experience the World through Numismatics...it's more than you can imagine.
I collect coins that I like. They are medieval coins mostly and they are quite ugly for the most part. Debased and frequently with impairment. And I prefer to buy circulated rather than high grade as it allows me a more expansive collection. Then some of the issues are so rare that I'll take them in any sort of shape. I am under no illusion about my area of specialization, and realize that these do not have widespread appeal. I've made some good purchases and some not-so-good. I still think I could sell my collection for more than I paid.
To me 8 is part of 2.
In addition to trusting your instincts, I think it's important to validate your instincts are correct, which an be done by posting online for feedback.
I'll agree with 10, "Don't Bother Learning To Grade", if the author, Doug Winter, doesn't know how to grade
Can Doug grade?
I agree that 8 is part of 2. What I fail to understand is how you can be a student of a series without knowing how to grade it (point 10). Surely the more you study a series, how it was produced, and so on, you pick up knowledge that will help you grade the coins. And knowing how to grade the coins gives information about conditional rarity within the series for example, which helps the student. I just don't see how to separate grading entirely from studying - though in fairness that was not the authors suggestion.
Here's the full quote for number 10:
What's funny is that he says telling a MS62 from a MS63 is harder than telling if a coin has real color or original surfaces. Sometimes I think original surfaces (putty) and real color is much harder than MS62 vs. MS 63!
An interesting potential side-effect of using the approach of choosing the top 5-10% of the grade is that price guides may matter less since they are often done on a point basis.
These guides often are driven by implicit goals that aren't clearly written out. One is to teach new people principles early on that are fairly universally adopted by all experienced collectors in attempt to save new collectors time or money. One is to provide advice to ensure a collector will not be taken advantage of and be able to sell their collection for something close to what they got it for, if not more.
One thing we often ignore is the fact that this hobby is frivolous and that the vast majority of it doesn't matter. In those terms, we should really only advise people to do what they enjoy. And the best thing a new collector can do is figure out what they enjoy, and then chase it.
IG: DeCourcyCoinsEbay: neilrobertson
"Numismatic categorizations, if left unconstrained, will increase spontaneously over time." -me
I like that !
I give away money. I collect money.
I don’t love money . I do love the Lord God.
My take....a dealer's push for customers. He is the only dealer I know that publicly disparaged all other dealers in various ads or blogs except LS.
LS, I agree with.
I never recall Doug disparaging another dealer. He has written “ l’ve handled more…”, which is surely true. How is that disparaging? Is there something else?
It was probably long before you were playing with coins or not....If I recall it was 10-20 years ago...but it was nasty and I even called him out on it but he wouldn't respond to me! I can't remember where it was but I will never, ever forget!
I’ve been following Doug for probably 20 years and have no memory of him belittling another dealer.
The article to which you refer is in no more disparaging to anyone.
Does anyone else remember such an ad?