Gold coins from around 1050AD had what kind of gold composition?

Herb_T

Today gold coins can be a mixture of Gold and Copper or can be 99.99% pure, 24 kt. What was the mixture if any over 1000 years ago?

neildrobertson

Gold mined from the earth usually seems to occur in the range of 85-97% purity. They could mint gold of similar purity without much refining of any kind.

Herb_T

I submitted without PCGS numbers....maybe after they get them PCGS will create numbers.

TomB

@Herb_T said:
I submitted without PCGS numbers....maybe after they get them PCGS will create numbers.

???

fluffy155

PCGS doesn’t grade coins that old, most likely they will be returned ungraded.

PBRat

@fluffy155 said:
PCGS doesn’t grade coins that old, most likely they will be returned ungraded.

Here's a PCGS graded Visigoth Tremisses from just after 600 AD, so they do grade coins that old. Not sure what criteria they use for grading vs not grading.

Sapyx

@Herb_T said:
Today gold coins can be a mixture of Gold and Copper or can be 99.99% pure, 24 kt. What was the mixture if any over 1000 years ago?

Depends on where the coins are from. Gold coins from western Europe are super-rare, almost unheard of. Likewise gold coins from China. But the tiny number that do occur, are usually quite high fineness.

The Byzantine Empire was a prolific issuer of gold coins, and the stamenon numisma was of quite high fineness in AD 1050. Both the quantity and the fineness fell quite suddenly after the Byzantine defeat in the Battle of Manzikert in 1071.

In the Islamic sphere, the gold dinar of the Fatimids (the Shiite rulers of Egypt) is quite common, the gold dinars of the Ayyubid Caliphate in Baghdad somewhat less common. Both of these gold dinars are of quite high fineness, retaining the standard of the old Byzantine solidus they were originally copied from.

@PBRat said:
Here's a PCGS graded Visigoth Tremisses from just after 600 AD, so they do grade coins that old. Not sure what criteria they use for grading vs not grading.

The list of coins that PCGS are prepared to grade can be found on their FAQ page:

What types of coins does PCGS grade?
PCGS grades most U.S. coinage, Mint Errors, Colonials, Fractional Gold, Patterns, Territorials, and World coins from 1600 to present.

So they do not routinely grade coins older than AD 1600 - basically, if it's not in Krause, they don't touch it. The Visigoth coin posted above is an anomaly; I can only assume someone got i graded as part of some special deal.

Herb_T

@Herb_T said:
I submitted without PCGS numbers....maybe after they get them PCGS will create numbers.

@TomB said:

@Herb_T said:
I submitted without PCGS numbers....maybe after they get them PCGS will create numbers.

@fluffy155 said:
PCGS doesn’t grade coins that old, most likely they will be returned ungraded.

Sorry guys, that comment was meant for my other thread on Vienna Philharmonic coins…my bad.

Rexford

@Sapyx said:

@Herb_T said:
Today gold coins can be a mixture of Gold and Copper or can be 99.99% pure, 24 kt. What was the mixture if any over 1000 years ago?

Depends on where the coins are from. Gold coins from western Europe are super-rare, almost unheard of. Likewise gold coins from China. But the tiny number that do occur, are usually quite high fineness.

The Byzantine Empire was a prolific issuer of gold coins, and the stamenon numisma was of quite high fineness in AD 1050. Both the quantity and the fineness fell quite suddenly after the Byzantine defeat in the Battle of Manzikert in 1071.

In the Islamic sphere, the gold dinar of the Fatimids (the Shiite rulers of Egypt) is quite common, the gold dinars of the Ayyubid Caliphate in Baghdad somewhat less common. Both of these gold dinars are of quite high fineness, retaining the standard of the old Byzantine solidus they were originally copied from.

@PBRat said:
Here's a PCGS graded Visigoth Tremisses from just after 600 AD, so they do grade coins that old. Not sure what criteria they use for grading vs not grading.

The list of coins that PCGS are prepared to grade can be found on their FAQ page:

What types of coins does PCGS grade?
PCGS grades most U.S. coinage, Mint Errors, Colonials, Fractional Gold, Patterns, Territorials, and World coins from 1600 to present.

So they do not routinely grade coins older than AD 1600 - basically, if it's not in Krause, they don't touch it. The Visigoth coin posted above is an anomaly; I can only assume someone got i graded as part of some special deal.

They do routinely grade older coins, they have tons of medieval types graded. That limit of 1600 AD isn’t accurate.